Has anyone got milage credit from checking in online but not actually flying???
#16
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Washington DC
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Wirelessly posted (BlackBerry8320/4.5.0.81 Profile/MIDP-2.0 Configuration/CLDC-1.1 VendorID/100)
The only time where I was checked in for a flight and did not actually fly it, the segment did post. This was on US crediting to UA. I was surprised, but it was a trivial amount of miles so really no big deal.
The only time where I was checked in for a flight and did not actually fly it, the segment did post. This was on US crediting to UA. I was surprised, but it was a trivial amount of miles so really no big deal.
#17
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: SMF
Programs: UA Gold, 1 MM
Posts: 11,632
I missed the last flight on a complicated international itinerary (many of you know what I'm talking about) that involved a UA codeshare on an AC metal flight. I never cancelled the flight, but was surprised to see that the mileage posted three days after the scheduled flight.
#18
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The logic that says I should not collect miles in that situation is similar to the logic of a hotel charging your credit card for a no show for the, and then when you show up at 9am to check in, the hotel saying they already gave your room away, but they are still charging your credit card, and you have to wait until 3pm to check in.
I know where you are going ... when transcons are selling for $125 or less each way, providing credit for not flying is effectively rewarding frequency of transactions. Simple solution: reward revenue whether the miles are flown or not (if not flown, recognize the reward after the credit expires). Elite qualification should be by revenue only, or if the airlines want, by either revenue or miles flown.
The fact that the airlines retreated in 2008 on the BIS versus 500 mile minimum for RDMs and EQMs is their de-facto recognition that elite qualification in M+ cannot ignore revenue component. I.e. those of us stung by UA's brief foray into a bad policy last year were providing the most revenue per mile to UA for the least return ... adding COS/DEN/COS to my round trips often doubles the cost of the fare.
The airline crew's word is law of course. But it often isn't ethical.
E.g. I decided to buy two seats, I would insist that UA keep the extra seat empty. However, I can assure you on a full plane, the airline would try to seize that seat. And if the FA determined I was not a CoS, she would sieze that seat or invent a "load/re-balance" excuse that caused me to lose my extra seat. It would be up to me to seek a refund.
E.g. I purchase a premium fare, and am downgraded. It is up to me to seek a refund.
E.g. UA has a CoS policy. I've yet to see it enforced. UA's employees see nothing wrong with CoS overflowing into someone else's seat. The person who is forced to share his space has no recourse.
E.g. I've a cousin-in-law who once flew with her two kids, one an infant and bought three tickets. The FAs forced her to put one kid on her lap, and sold the seat to someone else. And the mother did not get any money back. (This was not UA.)
E.g. UX tried to force me allow the pax in the bulkhead row in front of to store her stuff under the seat she was sitting in, i.e. my designated carry on space.
All of the above are perfectly legal. None are ethical in my book.
Selling a seat twice is not ethical in my book either, but as you say, it is legal. If the airline awards FF RDMs and EQMs to the pax who isn't sitting there, I think that is a reasonable exchange.
The hotel (unless it is the Tulip Inn Rainbow Hotel Terminus in Oslo; apparently under new management 10 years after it shafted me) keeps my room empty from check in time to check out time if I guarantee space via deposit or credit card guarantee. The airline should be happy that it will burn less fuel because my fat butt and my bags aren't adding weight.
We have different ethics, and that is OK.
#19
Join Date: Nov 1999
Location: if it's Thursday, this must be Belgium
Programs: UA 1K MM
Posts: 6,481
...
The hotel (unless it is the Tulip Inn Rainbow Hotel Terminus in Oslo; apparently under new management 10 years after it shafted me) keeps my room empty from check in time to check out time if I guarantee space via deposit or credit card guarantee. The airline should be happy that it will burn less fuel because my fat butt and my bags aren't adding weight.
We have different ethics, and that is OK.
The hotel (unless it is the Tulip Inn Rainbow Hotel Terminus in Oslo; apparently under new management 10 years after it shafted me) keeps my room empty from check in time to check out time if I guarantee space via deposit or credit card guarantee. The airline should be happy that it will burn less fuel because my fat butt and my bags aren't adding weight.
We have different ethics, and that is OK.
Usually I agree it is unethical to sell something twice. It would be unethical, for example, in the case of a theater ticket or hotel room. If the first customer has not shown up by the beginning of the curtain/check-in time, it is unethical to sell that ticket/room again, because there is a possibility that he/she shows up after that and still wants to use it. If the ticket/room is resold to someone else, you have potentially deprived the original customer of his/her legitimate use of it.
But airlines are different. As soon as the flight takes off, the value of the empty seat is completely down the toilet, it has expired. (I know this applies to other things too, but airline seats are particularly dramatic in the high cost of everything involved)
But also, the original customer cannot show up half an hour after the flight departed, and still use the ticket. There is no possibility of it.
So for the special case of airlines, they have been allowed to (as some people phrase it) sell the same seat twice because doing so should not deprive any legitimate ticket holder of his/her original seat, and prevents it from going wasted. Of course, this has been pushed to the limit lately, and sometimes they are not diligent about asking for volunteers to make sure that no one is forced to give up their seat. (and the IDB penalties should be higher, as part of the bargain that they're allowed to profit from this practice.)
But both from any legal and ethical viewpoint, that is how I am ok with the airline exception. We already benefit from this arrangement by non-refundable fares being cheaper than they were 10 years ago, so I don't complain unless they have handled an oversold situation very poorly. And I don't think it suggests a right to claim all original benefits back because they sold the seat twice.
hope this clarifies things.
Last edited by TA; Sep 13, 2009 at 9:12 am
#20
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But airlines are different. As soon as the flight takes off, the value of the empty seat is completely down the toilet, it has expired. (I know this applies to other things too, but airline seats are particularly dramatic in the high cost of everything involved)
But also, the original customer cannot show up half an hour after the flight departed, and still use the ticket. There is no possibility of it.
But also, the original customer cannot show up half an hour after the flight departed, and still use the ticket. There is no possibility of it.
It's my space. I paid to keep it open. If the airline wants to use the space, then it ethically it needs to compensate me.
#21
Join Date: Nov 1999
Location: if it's Thursday, this must be Belgium
Programs: UA 1K MM
Posts: 6,481
What if I am traveling with some else? We have adjacent seats. I missed the flight, my fare is non-refundable, and I did not cancel (so no hope of using the credit). My companion does makes the flight. My companion should be able to enjoy that space. It is unethical for the airline to do otherwise, and it should assume that I have a companion.
It's my space. I paid to keep it open. If the airline wants to use the space, then it ethically it needs to compensate me.
It's my space. I paid to keep it open. If the airline wants to use the space, then it ethically it needs to compensate me.
How about the pleasant conversation you were going to have that he/she is now deprived of? Should the airline make up for that too? Or what if you were business travelers and would not reasonably be expecting to cross your arms/legs into each others' seat areas? The airline doesn't give you a break then, but does if you're close traveling companions? Cmon.
We pay for seats one by one, and that's all that can be reasonably expected of the airline to account for also. If you wanted another seat worth of space, you buy another ticket.
#22
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Join Date: May 2002
Location: YEG
Programs: HH Silver
Posts: 56,417
Agree. Once you fail to board IMHO you lose the ability to have a say in what the airline choses to do with your seat.