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-   United Mileage Plus (Pre-Merger) (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/united-mileage-plus-pre-merger-504/)
-   -   Dear United: Start enforcing friggin carry-on bag limits! (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/united-mileage-plus-pre-merger/1310399-dear-united-start-enforcing-friggin-carry-bag-limits.html)

mduell Feb 4, 12 1:08 pm

It'd be a very different story if the airlines could deliver bags to the carousel in something resembling a reasonable period of time, like the amount of time it takes to walk there. Waiting 20 minutes for bags to start and mishandling elite bags are two of the many reasons checking a bag is miserable.

Or locating the baggage carousel somewhere reasonably close to the gate you're arriving; I'm looking at you, IAH terminal E. A half mile walk or a train ride is absurd.

And then there's Thousands Stealing our Articles to deal with...

With great, secure baggage service I'd be happy to check. With the current state of affairs, I'm carrying the kitchen sink on board.

freshairborne Feb 4, 12 1:25 pm


Originally Posted by Cantheplanegofaster? (Post 17950110)
Quite simple: Start enforcing the size of bags allowed as carry-on. I have flown a ridiculus amount of miles the last quarter. It's seriously gotten out of control.

Just because it has wheels does not mean it is a carry-on people. So many examples of baggage limits being abused it's silly. When a bag takes up an entire bin on an INTL 777 do you think it's too big? hmmm

The baggage issues is what leads to the stampedes at the gates and long and frustrating boarding processes.

Seriously UA, it's time to clean it up and stop letting some people take advantage of the system while screwing other pax who comply!!!:mad::td::mad:

What about the laptop in the setback rule?

"Stuffing my laptop in the seatback pocket one flight at a time"

FAB

ncorman Feb 4, 12 2:14 pm

Want a solution for the issue. If you check a bag, at any status level you can board in the first group. Followed by elite with no checked bags, etc. :eek:

Sort of stinks, doesn't it... however it rewards those who pay a stupid checked bag fee or others who just want to check something. Think back to August 2006 how quickly you could load and unload an airplane when there was really no carry-on bags due to the liquid rule.

chollie Feb 4, 12 3:19 pm

Why take a punitive approach?

Solve the problem of why elites (who don't pay baggage fees, whether they fly in F or Y) keep carrying their bags on.

If you solve that problem, you'll solve a subset of those folks who do have to pay to check bags, but who are carrying on for other reasons (hint: long delays at baggage claim and inability to secure luggage).

I have to admit, if I paid to check a bag and then had to wait 45 minutes to get it or found it rifled or it didn't show up and catch-up delivery was not only inconvenient, it was not possible, I'd be pretty angry I'd paid to check the bag.

I have checked a 'carry-on' recently on AS and DL - the former actually did actually start rolling bags off 20 minutes after landing and the latter did actually seem to honor the 'elite' tag.

Of course, I'm still going to carry-on gifts, technical gear, souvenirs - that gets to the inability to secure my luggage issue.

Often1 Feb 4, 12 4:17 pm

Just enforce the rules and the problem all but goes away. While most aircraft can't acommodate a compliant roll-a-board from every pax, it's rare that every pax has one.

If the rule is enforced, pax behavior will change quickly.

GRALISTAIR Feb 4, 12 4:23 pm

Become Anal like RyanAir - now that is what I call enforcement.

Cantheplanegofaster? Feb 4, 12 5:17 pm


Originally Posted by freshairborne (Post 17952053)
What about the laptop in the setback rule?

"Stuffing my laptop in the seatback pocket one flight at a time"

FAB

Your post here proves that sentence serves it's purpose ;)

chollie Feb 4, 12 5:48 pm

I flew SAA (domestic flight) a couple years ago. Nothing allowed in seatback pockets or under seats or held in lap during take-off and landing.

That would really wreak havoc on many US flights.

pdx1M Feb 4, 12 5:58 pm


Originally Posted by harryhood (Post 17951189)
So let me pose this to you:

I have a well worn, tried and true Travelpro carryon. Bought it 7 years ago, has travelled the world. It was billed by Travelpro as fitting the carryon sizing at the time. It fits exactly in the overhead, wheels in, on all normal aircraft (the exception being the older 767's which have those terrible bins). It just barely does *not* fit into the carry-on sizer, even though it has never not fit wheels-in in a non-767 overhead.

I agree with you. I'd be fine with the sizers if they corresponded to what fits in the bins. My roller bag (a B&R I have used for years) fits in every normal (i.e., non 767 or RJ) bin in the narrow position. Yet I have found that whether it fits a sizer or not is somewhat random - some it does and other not. It is the "big" rollers that won't fit in any narrow body bin that drive me nuts - they essentially double the space per passenger occupied.

N1120A Feb 4, 12 5:58 pm

Honestly, I don't get the whining about this. United agents and FAs are particularly anal about carry-on limits. I've seen FAs try and tell people they are exceeding their limit by having bags with food from the terminal in them (they aren't. That is specifically excluded). Camera bags are similarly excluded, yet I see people prodded about that as well. Also, because of the TSA madness, people are often unbundled when boarding (that happens to me from time to time).

Really, number of bags has never been the problem. The problem is size. FAR too many people, including rather frequent flyers, carry on bags that don't fit properly in overhead bins. If everyone had bags that fit wheels/handles first, gate checks would be significantly reduced. Similarly, unless you are in a bulkhead, you don't put the briefcase/laptop in the overhead. You put it under your seat until you know there is room up above. That would help things as well.

I had a roller that didn't fit well on the Airbus wheels/handle first, so I replaced it. Then I got rid of the wheels altogether. I carry as much or more in my bag and have a smaller footprint. Its really about courtesy, not enforcement. And what they do enforce is not the real issue, because the vast, vast majority of people don't exceed the carry-on limits when it comes to actual number. I do, however, see someone dragging a 24" roller or an overstuffed 22" expandable on every flight.

Cantheplanegofaster? Feb 4, 12 6:03 pm


Originally Posted by chollie (Post 17953152)
I flew SAA (domestic flight) a couple years ago. Nothing allowed in seatback pockets or under seats or held in lap during take-off and landing.

That would really wreak havoc on many US flights.

There's some history behind that signature. Apparently aircraft safety is jeopardized if you put a mini laptop in the seat. You know, the kind you can't see if someone doesn't watch you put it in the pocket? Was whole separate thread.

Good time for a signature change however as now I have a better one to use;)

TomA Feb 4, 12 8:02 pm

F passengers do have bigger bags, but in general there is usually plenty of space there anyway. (I do pretty much carry my maximum allotment onboard... those sizers are bigger than you think. :eek: )

I once saw a woman in the first row of Y put her bag in a compartment and it took half of it. Another pax went to put his bag in and she said, "don't put that on top of my bag." I was astounded and told him--not quietly--to put it there anyway, and if she had a problem she could call the FA. But the guy was nicer than me and went looking for another spot.


Originally Posted by chollie (Post 17952528)
Solve the problem of why elites (who don't pay baggage fees, whether they fly in F or Y) keep carrying their bags on.

:confused:

I carry my bags on because my entire--and I mean all 239.5 pounds of it--checked bag allotment is full with commercial cargo.

fastair Feb 4, 12 9:18 pm

While I believe an airline has the responsibility to enforce it's rules, to say that people bring too much as being the airline's fault is akin to saying that people speed, not becuase they want to, but because the police don't stop everyone and ticket them all for going 1 mph over. The ultimate decision of whether one wants to break the rules is not the airline's but the passenger's. Just like iphone software that tells you where the speed traps are, travel writers have advertised ways around paying for the excess baggage and said "bring it to the gate, if you get caught, check it for free!"

In the end, the police regulate and enforce the rules, but do not get everyone every time someone speeds, so to, is it an airlie's job to enforce the rules. But in both cases, it is the one who breaks the rules fault for breaking it. DO we blame GM for making cars that go faster than the speedlimit or the DoT for making nice roads that allow our cars to go fast, no, and so we cannot blame the airlines for imposing a fee FORCING people to carry on above the limit (sarcasm intended, there is no forcing.) One can either comply or not, and that decision entirely rests within the individual. An airline can attempt to enforce the policy, which I am sure the airline tries to do as it lack of following the policy makes for more work for the gate agents, late departures, and DoT fines. But don't externalize a problem that is CAUSED solely by the individual who knows the rules (they are posted,) and chooses to break them. The TSA has advertised 1+1 for ages now...it is nothing unique to UA.

Should their be a penalty for bringing too much to the gate to board with? Perhaps, But then again, the gate agent who would then have to see how many bags were checked under each passenger's name prior to issuing a gate checked tag would slow the process down even more. Just like the DoT regs on tarrmac delays, every action has forseen, and unforseen reactions, such as more cncls for delayed flights on weather days (regarding the DoT's 3 hr rule.)

Just don't try place 100% of the blame on the airline...even before they started charging, this problem existed, and was rampant. The only real difference is you now think there is a way to blame the airlines saying "they caused it by charging". Many DYKWIA people have fluanted the rules before and still do, even when they get free bags checked, as they can't be bothered waiting at the baggage claim for 10 min.

Heck, I remember a test UA did in the late 90's where they actually had a discounted business type (not class, but restriction) fare for elites flying ORD-DSM that permitted them only 1 carry on. Why this market? Becuase when that aircraft was full of businessmen/women who fly frequently, they had more carryons than the aircraft could hold in the cabin. This was well before the 1+1 rule or even charging for bags, as it was a business market with frequent fliers who routinely carried on more than they were permitted. So to say "ma and pa kettle are doing it to avoid the fees!" In reality, just as many frequent flyer commuters who think they travel light enough to not need to check a bag, are just as bad, if not worse than the vacation flyer, who in reality, has 1 giant checked bag apiece and limited carry ons.

CoC: A doccument that is legal and binding between airline and passenger that DYKWIA types think doesn't apply to them.

wtigerFF Feb 5, 12 12:22 am

I think that charging for checked bags contributes greatly to the problem. Just because they sometimes allow gatechecking bags for free, that doesn't mean that people can easily take advantage of it. When I'm carrying things on, I pack assuming it will not be checked: fragile items, electronic items, medicine, keys. However, I usually just carry on a backpack and laptop bag. If I'm in F and am not at the front of the early boarding F/1K line, I have trouble finding room for one of them in the overhead. Many times it is because people have put both carry on bags up there.

AA is the only major airline for which I have to pay for checked bags so I avoid them if at all possible. I had to fly JetBlue last year and couldn't check my bag because I took the last flight of the day and I had to catch a bus first thing in the morning. Even as one of the last ones to board, my bag was the only one in the huge overhead compartment above my seat when the plane took off. I looked around and noticed that over half of the overhead space was empty on a completely full flight. Another interesting data point that they allow different sized carryons depending on the plane type. the largest allowed is larger than the typical sizer.

Cantheplanegofaster? Feb 5, 12 12:30 am


Originally Posted by fastair (Post 17953980)
While I believe an airline has the responsibility to enforce it's rules, to say that people bring too much as being the airline's fault is akin to saying that people speed, not becuase they want to, but because the police don't stop everyone and ticket them all for going 1 mph over. The ultimate decision of whether one wants to break the rules is not the airline's but the passenger's. Just like iphone software that tells you where the speed traps are, travel writers have advertised ways around paying for the excess baggage and said "bring it to the gate, if you get caught, check it for free!"

In the end, the police regulate and enforce the rules, but do not get everyone every time someone speeds, so to, is it an airlie's job to enforce the rules. But in both cases, it is the one who breaks the rules fault for breaking it. DO we blame GM for making cars that go faster than the speedlimit or the DoT for making nice roads that allow our cars to go fast, no, and so we cannot blame the airlines for imposing a fee FORCING people to carry on above the limit (sarcasm intended, there is no forcing.) One can either comply or not, and that decision entirely rests within the individual. An airline can attempt to enforce the policy, which I am sure the airline tries to do as it lack of following the policy makes for more work for the gate agents, late departures, and DoT fines. But don't externalize a problem that is CAUSED solely by the individual who knows the rules (they are posted,) and chooses to break them. The TSA has advertised 1+1 for ages now...it is nothing unique to UA.

Should their be a penalty for bringing too much to the gate to board with? Perhaps, But then again, the gate agent who would then have to see how many bags were checked under each passenger's name prior to issuing a gate checked tag would slow the process down even more. Just like the DoT regs on tarrmac delays, every action has forseen, and unforseen reactions, such as more cncls for delayed flights on weather days (regarding the DoT's 3 hr rule.)

Just don't try place 100% of the blame on the airline...even before they started charging, this problem existed, and was rampant. The only real difference is you now think there is a way to blame the airlines saying "they caused it by charging". Many DYKWIA people have fluanted the rules before and still do, even when they get free bags checked, as they can't be bothered waiting at the baggage claim for 10 min.

Heck, I remember a test UA did in the late 90's where they actually had a discounted business type (not class, but restriction) fare for elites flying ORD-DSM that permitted them only 1 carry on. Why this market? Becuase when that aircraft was full of businessmen/women who fly frequently, they had more carryons than the aircraft could hold in the cabin. This was well before the 1+1 rule or even charging for bags, as it was a business market with frequent fliers who routinely carried on more than they were permitted. So to say "ma and pa kettle are doing it to avoid the fees!" In reality, just as many frequent flyer commuters who think they travel light enough to not need to check a bag, are just as bad, if not worse than the vacation flyer, who in reality, has 1 giant checked bag apiece and limited carry ons.

CoC: A doccument that is legal and binding between airline and passenger that DYKWIA types think doesn't apply to them.

Wow. Speeding ticket versus luggage on an airplane? You went on a complete tangent:rolleyes:

The reality is UA can police the bags at check-in and the gate. Otherwise I could use all your same arguments about the GAs and CSR claiming thay are not responsible for enforcing pax to have correct forms of identification. The bags are in plain sites and every pax walks throught security and a GA so if UA can't enforce their own rules, me thinks you have a problem.

And by the way, the CoC is not as binding as you would like to suggest as there are many parts of it that if challenged in the courts would likely not survive. Exactly how many passengers are present during CoC debates and approval? It's a one-sided document that probably 0.00000001% of pax even know exists let alone know the details of what is in it.


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