L Dude 7

And if we go back to 2000, we also had AA flying an SJC-TPE route.

It does seem odd that the US carriers have ceded TPE to the Taiwanese airlines. (Especially since neither is in their respective alliances.)
I'm just hoping somebody eventually decided to resume the "early afternoon" nonstop from the Bay Area to Taipei.

npei

After EVA is accepted into *A sometime between 2H12-1H13, their nonstop SFO-TPE is available to earn EQM on UA, or redeem using UA miles.

uwr

Direct flights with plane changes are common on many airlines in the US and abroad. They have been around for decades as a marketing ploy. They might be annoying, but I don't think they are "baffling."

The UA Economy Plus hard product offers superior legroom compared to ANA's economy class, although UA doesn't offer other perks such as an amenity kit, hot towel, or free drinks. Did you fly E+ or E- ?

Though transoceanic travel on UA (or on any American carrier) has some drawbacks, there are legitimate reasons to choose UA economy over ANA economy - E+ seats with more legroom (free for elites), the possibility of an upgrade, credit toward million-mile status, and potentially better service for elites in the case of IRROPS.

oldtimer

I am not too sure that I agree the air craft of Air Japan is that much inferior than NHs; however, you should take note that that the Air Japan's aircraft is better configured in Y than the UAs, other than the UA's E+ seating. If you are not in E+ or qualified to be in E+, in my opinion, Air Japan offers a better alternative in food, service and seating.

mjcewl1284

Not totally accurate. CI did just join ST.

But yes I agree, while CI/BR are better in terms of FA service, planes and such, their food and beverage is stripped down to bare bones. The food's awful. I've flown the old TPE-(ANC)-JFK once with a client and witnessed an FA turn down a pax when asked for additional food. The plane was about 1/3 full. US carriers could make a dent if they really wanted to imo to/from TPE.

dsquared37

UA absolutely does give free drinks on TPAC and intra-Asia flights.

1kBill

Not sure I agree with this, as the pricing on USA-TPE routes is usually quite low. Witness the withdrawal of other carriers (SQ and soon MH) from the LAX-TPE route.

L Dude 7

I guess I failed at brevity. UA and AA were the ones with nonstop service, and they are not members of alliances with Taiwanese airlines. (Though it sounds like one day EVA may be *A)

I saw a similar food rejection on a UA flight. The guy behind me had ordered a Muslim meal and decided he'd rather have something else. The FA's response: "tough luck, we only have one thing for each passenger." However, UA does have extra chips and snacks available. (And on UA I needed those because the coach meal was not very substantial.) On Eva, I don't recall any issues with the food, but I wasn't paying particular attention either. (2AM departure. Uggh.)

The Taiwanese carriers, however do go all out on cross-straight flights. China Airlines had a full economy meal service on a <500 flight to China. (I was amazed they pulled it off, as there was some turbulence on the flight delaying the FAs.)

maize&blue

I must not have known the secret phrase, because all UA offered me in the way of additional snacks was a couple packets of crackers. That was probably the hungriest I've ever been on a flight, and I don't understand why there isn't even food for sale on this route.

rmbl

This answer is tantalizingly baffling. What do you mean by "keep route authorities on the up and up"?

(I've also wondered "why do direct flights exist". It sounds like you have a meaningful answer, but I don't quite understand it.)

NickP 1K

100% agree that except for the seat Air Japan is MUCH more superior to UA on Japan-Taiwan.

username

While I look forward to the day EVA joins *A (gestimate ranges from 4Q12-2014), I got to reach my MM before I can switch. I guess the MM program does keep some customers

TG, NW, UA, SQ and MH have pulled out or about to pull out the nonstop TPAC market out of TPE since the 90s. It used to be CI was the only Taiwanese TPAC carrier in town but many would not fly CI due to its safety record. BR started LAX service in December of 1992 and the rest was history.

For a while, it seems UA kept SFO-TPE going (stopped and resumed) because of cargo. The cargo market out of TW is really bad now. BR/CI relied on that for years but are cutting back. There was a report just 2 days ago that CI is sending 2 74Fs to the AZ deserts for storage and BR is dumping 2 or 3 M11Fs. Now the money maker is passenger routes to Mainland China.

I think once BR is in *A, UA might even stop TPE service and use BR/NH for codeshare or switch to CO 737s. TPE is not a high yield business market - a lot of Taiwanese manufacturing and companies have moved to China.

The Taiwanese carriers have a lot more frequencies to US/Canada and most is nonstop and have better schedule (you can work all day on both ends and hop on the flight). Language, service and food are other factors that most Taiwanese prefer CI and BR - even though they are more expensive. If I am not slave for UA miles/status, I would too

I am surprised that people think the food on US carriers is better than CI or BR. One possible explanation is that Americans are more used to UA food and Taiwanese/Chinese are more used to CI/BR food. (You need to compare long haul with long hual - TPE-HKG on BR has some strange and cheap hot meals but that is only 492 miles.)

Looking at how CI awards DL miles for their flights, I think BR will probably do the same - 50% EQM for most fares in Y. The interesting thing will be how much is given for Elite Class (Premium Economy) and whether one can redeem UA miles for Elite.

CAPT Tee

I have not experienced any UA/CO international flights that isn't part of a direct flight. So my guess is every international flight is part of a direct flight.

ljwobker

United's international economy product competes other US-based carriers... here you have:

• price sensitivity: the "mass market" of US travelers want the absolute cheapest thing no matter how miserable it makes the service
• frequent flyer loyalty... people who will fly airline X because that's where their miles are, no matter how poor the service
• people who fly airline X because that's who their companies have contracts with, no matter how poor the service
• people who live in the USA, travel infrequently, and have no idea that there are foreign carriers out there, and will always travel on a US based airline, no matter how poor the service...
• I'm sure you get the common theme here by now... ;-)

I think any marginally educated traveler, who has no loyalty and just wants the best service in economy from point A to point B, would rarely if ever pick a US based airline if there's a competing product from an international carrier. But those conditions very rarely occur... so the US based carriers all fight each other for the scraps of low-fare paying, hard to please, miserable whining americans.

mjcewl1284

My experience on UA has been incredibly different. If I happen to be in the back of the bus, when I do request for seconds, the FA will usually tell me, "If I can get you one after everyone has been served, I'll come back to you."

And no, I don't enjoy Economy food, I'm usually just loading up on the rice so I don't get hungry 4 hrs later.


It's the only reason why I won't fly CI if I don't have to.