Mar 23, 2022, 12:09 pm

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Last edit by: WineCountryUA

Also see United drops/suspends 14 UX flights IAD

SkyWest dropping 29 (virtually all) EAS markets served under UA* code (on hold)

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Mar 11, 2022, 4:25 pm

#16

Bonehead

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Regarding PAH:

Quote:

[Barkley Regional Airport Executive Director Dennis] Rouleau said the decision from SkyWest was due to pilot staffing issues and rising fuel costs.

Rouleau told The Sun that to his understanding, SkyWest has to continue service until another Essential Air Service provider could be located. He added that the U.S. Department of Transportation would need to advertise the bid to seek out potential air service providers.

https://www.paducahsun.com/news/skyw...a4d4727e9.html

So it looks like EAS must continue at these cities if this guy is correct.

Mar 11, 2022, 4:34 pm

#17

DEN

Join Date: Jan 2004

Location: Golden, CO USA

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Posts: 765

Quote:

Originally Posted by Punekar

Shocking and awful to think about the jobs that will be lost in these small communities. I was lucky enough to fly ORD-CKB and ORD-SHD last year; so much fun to be able to fly from a major airport into these places!

Most most of these routes have been money losing for years and several airlines have gone broke trying to earn a profit serving them ( Great Lakes Aviation is one that comes to mind). If you chose to live in rural America, you have to take the good with the bad and most of these EAS locations are within 3-4 hours of a major airport…..people spend more time than that in-line at Walmart and Best Buy on Black Friday!

EAS was a attempt by Rural Senators to appease their constituents after the deregulation of the airline industry. It’s a relic that has been dragged along because no one has the courage to stick a fork in it and call it done.

DEN

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Last edited by DEN; Mar 11, 2022 at 4:40 pm

Mar 11, 2022, 4:40 pm

#18

narvik

Join Date: May 2010

Location: AVP & PEK

Programs: UA 1K 1.8MM

Posts: 6,349

Quote:

Originally Posted by MatthewLAX

Was on a Denver to Dodge City, KS flight last year - went out 7/50...

Thanks for that. That's more-or-less what I expected, but of course just one data point.

Quote:

Originally Posted by asphaltman

PAH averaged 20 pax on each of 2 daily flights. The problem is, flights were priced so high, that people made the drive to other airports that were significantly cheaper.

Cheers. Yep, pricing is a huge issue from these small airports. It's brutal when the first 200 mile segment costs the same or even more (by itself) than an international long-haul from a hub.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bonehead

So it looks like EAS must continue at these cities if this guy is correct.

The document in the OP has a provision to OBJECT until March 21st. Two things from the document:

1)
"NOTE: Objections to this notice of intent to terminate service must be filed on or
before March 21, 2022"

2)
"Although SkyWest Airlines, Inc. would prefer to continue providing scheduled air
service to these cities, the pilot staffing challenges across the airline industry preclude us
from doing so"

Not sure exactly what happens should the right amount and the right kind of people/institutions object to the notice???

Mar 11, 2022, 5:04 pm

#19

Beltway2A

Join Date: Apr 2017

Location: WAS

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Posts: 1,757

In addition to your list, I noticed this the other day when some of my flights to Plattsburgh (PBG) and Ogensburg (OGS) either drastically shifted in time (frequency cuts) or were cancelled altogether.

Mar 11, 2022, 5:06 pm

#20

DEN

Join Date: Jan 2004

Location: Golden, CO USA

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Posts: 765

Quote:

Originally Posted by narvik

2)
"Although SkyWest Airlines, Inc. would prefer to continue providing scheduled air
service to these cities, the pilot staffing challenges across the airline industry preclude us
from doing so"

Well, I call BS on Sky West’s comment. If it were profitable, they would find the pilots, or start a flight training academy or something. The pilot shortage didn’t just start yesterday, it’s been a well known issue for years. Working for Sky West is a starter job for most Pilots…..a few years of sleeping on couches to get the hours necessary to move up to a major. I’m surprised they didn't mention COVID or supply chain issues or climate change or another of the usual excuses.

DEN

Mar 11, 2022, 5:18 pm

#21

narvik

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Quote:

Originally Posted by DEN

Aye, I call BS too. With any foresight they may have just tagged along with United's flight academy and organized their own class at:
United Airlines buys flight-training academy to speed up hiring of 10,000 pilots

Mar 11, 2022, 5:45 pm

#22

cfischer

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Quote:

Originally Posted by entropy

why is it shocking and awful? These subsidies are an awful waste of taxpayer money (and carbon if you're into that) . If the market can't support the flights, there shouldn't be flights. If people want to be easily able to fly places they can move to a hub.

agreed. Wonderful to see this happen. This is wasting an enormous amount of $$$.

halls120 and J_Stroming like this.

Mar 11, 2022, 5:54 pm

#23

VRFast

Join Date: Dec 2019

Location: IAH

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Posts: 698

Victoria, TX

There goes my PQP/PQF run. IAH-VCT was a short and cheap run to do to get to Gold last year, about $90 R/T. The two times I did this trip there wasn’t more than 10 passengers on that flight, but still sad to see it go for the people who live/work in Victoria.

SPN Lifer likes this.

Mar 11, 2022, 6:00 pm

#24

RRROOO

Join Date: Jun 2021

Posts: 201

Quote:

Originally Posted by narvik

You missed a few; here's the full list:

Alamosa, CO – OST-1997-2960
Pueblo, CO – OST-1999-6589
Fort Dodge, IA – OST-2001-10682
Mason City, IA – OST-2001-10684
Sioux City, IA – OST-2006-23932
Dodge City, KS – OST-1998-3502
Hays, KS – OST-1998-3497
Liberal, KS – OST-1998-3498
Salina, KS – OST-2002-11376
Paducah, KY – OST-2009-0299
Decatur, IL – OST-2006-23929
Houghton, MI – OST-2009-0302
Muskegon, MI – OST-2009-0301
Cape Girardeau, MO – OST-1996-1559
Fort Leonard Wood, MO – OST-1996-1167
Joplin, MO – OST-2006-23932
Meridian, MS – OST-2008-0112
Hattiesburg, MS – OST-2001-10685
Devils Lake, ND – OST-1997-2785
Jamestown, ND – OST-1997-2785
Kearney, NE – OST-1996-1715
North Platte, NE – OST-1999-5173
Scottsbluff, NE – OST-2003-14535
Johnstown, PA – OST-2002-11451
Victoria, TX – OST-2005-20454
Shenandoah, VA – OST-2002-11378
Eau Claire, WI – OST-2009-0306
Clarksburg, WV – OST-2005-20736
Lewisburg, WV – OST-2003-15553

Not Eau Claire! UGH..that means MSP and driving instead.

Mar 11, 2022, 6:28 pm

#25

DELee

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Quote:

Originally Posted by narvik

Thanks - bad copy and paste.

David

narvik likes this.

Mar 11, 2022, 7:16 pm

#26

prestonh

Join Date: Jan 2007

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Posts: 2,808

Quote:

Originally Posted by DEN

Lol air mode subsidies are by far the cheapest per metric in the transport system. When compared to transit subsidies enjoyed by the metro areas it does not even compare. If transit subsidies were eliminated your commute time might double as service gets slashed and ridership drops etc. Same economics as eas. If the market doesn't support transit why should rural markets like eas pay for it? You can sit in traffic 4-5 hours I guess. I think there are public interest reasons but different areas have different needs in order to keep the economy and society connected.

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Mar 11, 2022, 7:50 pm

#27

WineCountryUA

Moderator: United Airlines

Join Date: Jun 2007

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Posts: 66,852

We are tending into a discussion of EAS, a federal program and better discussed in a non-airline forum. The impacts of this change on UA flyers is a reason topic for the UA forum, but the value or not EAS is out of scope. Will leave the earlier posts as they help explain EAS for those unfamiliar but let's return to the UA relate issues of the is change

Thanks

WineCountryUA
UA coModerator

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Mar 11, 2022, 8:02 pm

#28

Detroiter

Join Date: Dec 2002

Location: Bloomfield, MI, USA

Programs: DL Gold

Posts: 694

Quote:

Originally Posted by CZBB

It's kind of a dumb system really.
There are plenty of communities > 2+ hrs from a nearby airport without EAS contracts (let's say Omak WA, or Oroville WA), yet some of these losing service are under an hour drive to a significantly served airport. There should be some stipulation that it needs to be >90 minutes from another significantly served airport.

Yeah, I live in the northern burbs of Detroit and usually budget an hour to get to DTW (normal timing is ~45 minutes, but I allow for potential heavy traffic, accidents, construction, etc.), so I don't have a lot of sympathy for cities that have an airport with non-subsidized service less than 90 minutes or so away. .

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Last edited by WineCountryUA; Mar 11, 2022 at 8:29 pm Reason: Unneeded comments & ignored Moderator's request

Mar 11, 2022, 8:15 pm

#29

SPN Lifer

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I wonder what effect the elimination of UA mileage earning on these discontinued Essential Air Service (EAS) routes will have on the willingness of passengers to ride even smaller planes.

My guess is that the effect due to tiny planes and no UA miles will be significant.

Those complaining about the CR-5, be careful what you wish for.

Last edited by WineCountryUA; Mar 11, 2022 at 8:29 pm Reason: removed off-topic comments

Mar 11, 2022, 8:58 pm

#30

phoenixstar

Join Date: May 2003

Location: Fresno, California

Posts: 45

Quote:

Originally Posted by narvik

Moving a bit away from EAS in general (as it probably belongs elsewhere), but is there any info available that shows the loads on these flights?
I presume they were not flying out full, i.e. not making money by themselves, and thusly expendable, despite SkyWest having to pay an early termination penalty?

Does anyone here have first hand experience on these flights, and could shed some light on whether these flights were actually underused? I mean, if these flights were going out with one passenger, then good riddance! But if they were generally full, I'd feel differently, I guess.

Just flew DEN-SLN back on Feb 28th. Was reasonably full. Would estimate about 40 of the 50 seats were taken. Too bad because it was extremely convenient to my final destination (Abilene, KS), but it is tough to keep routes like this for too long.

narvik likes this.

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