Rebooking BOS-LAX flight
I've been rebooking my UA BOS-LAX flight monthly since April, hoping to be able to see my daughter. I'm now booked for June 10 and paid cash. I've been stalking the UA website for any flight changes I might not be notified about and now there are only 6 UA BOS-LAX flights listed and no non-stops on 6/10. I'm hoping that means my flight is no longer an option for new bookings, but is not cancelled.
I plan to wait until the last minute to decide if I'm going in June and also to give UA the opportunity to cancel the flight rather than me canceling so I get a refund. Since there are so few flight choices even now in the first week of May, should I book a (second) flight now for July or August when there might be more choice (and hopefully a nonstop option) and then cancel whichever flight I don't take? If yes, should I book that second flight on points or cash? |
Originally Posted by Graciecatt
(Post 32353916)
I've been rebooking my UA BOS-LAX flight monthly since April, hoping to be able to see my daughter. I'm now booked for June 10 and paid cash. I've been stalking the UA website for any flight changes I might not be notified about and now there are only 6 UA BOS-LAX flights listed and no non-stops on 6/10. I'm hoping that means my flight is no longer an option for new bookings, but is not cancelled.
I plan to wait until the last minute to decide if I'm going in June and also to give UA the opportunity to cancel the flight rather than me canceling so I get a refund. Since there are so few flight choices even now in the first week of May, should I book a (second) flight now for July or August when there might be more choice (and hopefully a nonstop option) and then cancel whichever flight I don't take? If yes, should I book that second flight on points or cash? I am sure this definition will be challenged, but so far it stands. |
Originally Posted by Graciecatt
(Post 32353916)
I've been rebooking my UA BOS-LAX flight monthly since April, hoping to be able to see my daughter. I'm now booked for June 10 and paid cash. I've been stalking the UA website for any flight changes I might not be notified about and now there are only 6 UA BOS-LAX flights listed and no non-stops on 6/10. I'm hoping that means my flight is no longer an option for new bookings, but is not cancelled.
I plan to wait until the last minute to decide if I'm going in June and also to give UA the opportunity to cancel the flight rather than me canceling so I get a refund. Since there are so few flight choices even now in the first week of May, should I book a (second) flight now for July or August when there might be more choice (and hopefully a nonstop option) and then cancel whichever flight I don't take? If yes, should I book that second flight on points or cash? I'd go with the miles option since UA is also waiving re-deposit fees as long as it is done 30 days prior to departure. Then, if you ultimately decide to go in July/August, you can determine if you want to use the funds from your June flight (which there should be a change fee waiver for) towards the July/August flight and cancel the award booking, or just keep the award booking and try for a possible refund or use those funds for something else. |
Originally Posted by CPH-Flyer
(Post 32354362)
United has stopped calling cancellations for cancellations. They don't cancel flights any longer. They remove them from the schedule. A schedule change is when the flight is removed and you can be reaccommodated within 6 hours, a significant change is if the change is more than 6 hours. A cancellation is only if the flight is removed, and they can't reaccommodate the passenger. So getting a cancellation from United is tricky at best.
I am sure this definition will be challenged, but so far it stands.
Originally Posted by econ
(Post 32354513)
Given the stance UA has adopted on refunds for cancelled flights, I'd be very reluctant to make any cash bookings on UA if your schedule isn't flexible.
I'd go with the miles option since UA is also waiving re-deposit fees as long as it is done 30 days prior to departure. Then, if you ultimately decide to go in July/August, you can determine if you want to use the funds from your June flight (which there should be a change fee waiver for) towards the July/August flight and cancel the award booking, or just keep the award booking and try for a possible refund or use those funds for something else. |
For those who have already booked and who have a situation where the flight they booked is not operating, do not give up if you are issued a credit by UA. The April 3, DOT Enforcement Warning to carriers is manifestly clear that if the flight is cancelled OR there is a significant change, a refund is due. People who want a refund absolutely ought to both file a DOT complaint and also initiate a chargeback with their credit card issuer (bank).
DOT does not enforce individual consumer complaints, but it does require carriers to answer the complaint and it does track what they say. Your complaint should make clear that your flight was cancelled (if it does not operate, it is cancelled), that you exercised your right under DOT rules as most recently made clear (April 3 letter) and were denied. Your chargeback should include a copy of your e-ticket receipt, a screenshot showing the absence of the flight (or a cancellation if there is one), your request for a refund, and the UA response (or a note that your received one) or that you were issued a credit and did not want one. "Carriers have a longstanding obligation to provide a prompt refund to a ticketed passenger when the carrier cancels the passenger’s flight or makes a significant change in the flight schedule and the passenger chooses not to accept the alternative offered by the carrier." UA may well back down and issue a refund or it may choose to fight DOT should DOT pursue the matter. But, if you do not pursue your claims, you are stuck. |
UGH - so my flight not appearing in a new search for the date, time, and flight means it's cancelled? I guess I have to call United then.
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Originally Posted by Graciecatt
(Post 32355677)
UGH - so my flight not appearing in a new search for the date, time, and flight means it's cancelled? I guess I have to call United then.
So no point calling united about it yet. Good luck. |
Originally Posted by fumje
(Post 32355735)
That does not actually mean your flight is cancelled, but it is a strong indicator that it will be. In fact, although inventory is zeroed (hence being unable to find it in a new search), the flight is still on the schedule.
So no point calling united about it yet. Good luck. |
Originally Posted by CPH-Flyer
(Post 32354362)
United has stopped calling cancellations for cancellations.
... I am sure this definition will be challenged, but so far it stands.
Originally Posted by econ
(Post 32354513)
Given the stance UA has adopted on refunds for cancelled flights, I'd be very reluctant to make any cash bookings on UA if your schedule isn't flexible.
Originally Posted by econ
(Post 32354513)
I'd go with the miles option since UA is also waiving re-deposit fees as long as it is done 30 days prior to departure.
Originally Posted by Graciecatt
(Post 32355524)
So then maybe I should book a second, easily refundable flight on a different airline? I have plenty of Chase UR and Amex MR - which airline has the best cancellation policy that can get me from BOS-LAX? Or even cash? - flights are certainly cheap enough - I'm more interested in the ease of cancellation.
Originally Posted by Often1
(Post 32355565)
Your complaint should make clear that your flight was cancelled (if it does not operate, it is cancelled)
Originally Posted by Often1
(Post 32355565)
"Carriers have a longstanding obligation to provide a prompt refund to a ticketed passenger when the carrier cancels the passenger’s flight or makes a significant change in the flight schedule and the passenger chooses not to accept the alternative offered by the carrier."
Originally Posted by Graciecatt
(Post 32355832)
I was wondering if not seeing it in a new search meant that it was "full" according to new social distancing seating requirements or if it was cancelled.
Given current flight loads, I don't see much of a rush to book a separate ticket for July or August. In general, one month of advance purchase should get you a reasonable fare, so I'd be tempted to wait, see what happens with your existing flight, and be prepared to change it if/when it becomes necessary. Also, AFAIK, United has not announced any inventory limits. They're blocking advanced seat assignments, but if they sell enough tickets, they'll fill every seat. |
Originally Posted by jsloan
(Post 32356024)
There's no way to distinguish a flight that is full from a flight that United has zeroed out due to an intention to cancel. However, that flight is nearly empty on the seat map. While that isn't definitive, I wouldn't expect it to operate, but see above on the difficulty getting a refund from UA if the change isn't large enough, and note that nonstop travel is not guaranteed.
Given current flight loads, I don't see much of a rush to book a separate ticket for July or August. In general, one month of advance purchase should get you a reasonable fare, so I'd be tempted to wait, see what happens with your existing flight, and be prepared to change it if/when it becomes necessary. Also, AFAIK, United has not announced any inventory limits. They're blocking advanced seat assignments, but if they sell enough tickets, they'll fill every seat. |
Originally Posted by Graciecatt
(Post 32356130)
Thank you so much. This is super helpful. I am curious how you were even able to see the flight and its seat map - when I do a fresh search, it isn't there. I could check the seat map via my own reservation I guess.
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Originally Posted by Graciecatt
(Post 32353916)
I've been rebooking my UA BOS-LAX flight monthly since April, hoping to be able to see my daughter. I'm now booked for June 10 and paid cash. I've been stalking the UA website for any flight changes I might not be notified about and now there are only 6 UA BOS-LAX flights listed and no non-stops on 6/10. I'm hoping that means my flight is no longer an option for new bookings, but is not cancelled.
I plan to wait until the last minute to decide if I'm going in June and also to give UA the opportunity to cancel the flight rather than me canceling so I get a refund. Since there are so few flight choices even now in the first week of May, should I book a (second) flight now for July or August when there might be more choice (and hopefully a nonstop option) and then cancel whichever flight I don't take? If yes, should I book that second flight on points or cash? |
Originally Posted by tphuang
(Post 32357192)
If I were you, I would prepare UA not operating BOS-LAX for a long time and book on another carrier. UA has been the most aggressive of the big 4 in cutting flights and both BOS & LAX have got the axe.
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Originally Posted by Graciecatt
(Post 32357472)
That's what I was wondering - should I book a second flight on a different airline (which one (best refundable policy)? points or cash?) that I am positive is refundable and just wait and see if United cancels my existing flight.
But, honestly, I don't understand why you'd do anything right now. If your United flight gets cancelled, and you're able to get e refund, then that's great; start from scratch at that point. But if it they merely turn a nonstop into a connection, and refuse to refund it on that basis, you're looking at a fight to get refunded: there are over 2000 posts on the refund thread, and I promise you that very few of those are "easiest thing I've ever done in my life." On the other hand, turning it into a travel credit would be simple; you could then rebook for a later date. I could understand getting a refundable flight on another airline for June, in order to increase your options if one cancels. But I just don't see the hurry to book anything for July or August. There will be plenty of time to book something if it becomes necessary. |
Originally Posted by jsloan
(Post 32357650)
The only flights that you can be sure are refundable are refundable fares, and those tend to be pretty expensive. In most cases, award flights are refundable, but they are generally subject to refund conditions, so you'd have to look at each program's conditions. United awards are refundable for free with 30 days notice, through the end of the year.
But, honestly, I don't understand why you'd do anything right now. If your United flight gets cancelled, and you're able to get e refund, then that's great; start from scratch at that point. But if it they merely turn a nonstop into a connection, and refuse to refund it on that basis, you're looking at a fight to get refunded: there are over 2000 posts on the refund thread, and I promise you that very few of those are "easiest thing I've ever done in my life." On the other hand, turning it into a travel credit would be simple; you could then rebook for a later date. I could understand getting a refundable flight on another airline for June, in order to increase your options if one cancels. But I just don't see the hurry to book anything for July or August. There will be plenty of time to book something if it becomes necessary. |
Originally Posted by Graciecatt
(Post 32357472)
That's what I was wondering - should I book a second flight on a different airline (which one (best refundable policy)? points or cash?) that I am positive is refundable and just wait and see if United cancels my existing flight.
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Originally Posted by tphuang
(Post 32358821)
seems like getting refund right now is pretty hard with an airline that's going through cash crunch as badly as UA. I would simply wait until you are more sure about traveling. I would be weary of AA/WN right now, because they schedule more flights and cancel more up close. The only airline to have operated this continuously is B6, so there is no reason they wouldn't fly this in June or later. DL canceled this for part of May, but if they still have it scheduled 2 to 3 weeks before your planned flying date, they should be flying it. I think you will be better served to wait until you are closer to expected traveling date.
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So United changed my direct flight to a one-stop leaving 1.5 hours earlier to BOS-EWR layover 4 hours then EWR-LAX arriving 4 hours later. Total is more than 6 hours change but b/c it doesn't ARRIVE 6 hours later they say I am only eligible for a future flight credit or an electronic ticket certificate. Both credit and ETC are good for the same 2-year period. I also paid for upgraded seats and I know I have to apply for that credit separately.
The UA rep told me I have until 5/31 to change/cancel my flight and maybe this new flight will be changed again so she advised me to wait and see if it qualifies for cancellation and refund. Shouldn't the total change of 1.5 hours earlier + 4 hour layover + arriving 4 hours later = enough time for a refund? She supposedly checked with a supervisor and was told no. I'm going to hang up and call again to see if I can get a different answer re the refund but in the meantime, which is better - the future credit or the certificate? From what I can gather from google, the future credit can be used with UA partners and the certificate cannot? or that you have to use the whole thing at once with a credit and a certificate can be used on multiple occasions until you use it up? This is super confusing. If I can't get a refund, I want to choose the smartest choice. |
Originally Posted by Graciecatt
(Post 32365959)
The UA rep told me I have until 5/31 to change/cancel my flight and maybe this new flight will be changed again so she advised me to wait and see if it qualifies for cancellation and refund. Shouldn't the total change of 1.5 hours earlier + 4 hour layover + arriving 4 hours later = enough time for a refund? She supposedly checked with a supervisor and was told no.
Originally Posted by Graciecatt
(Post 32365959)
I'm going to hang up and call again to see if I can get a different answer re the refund but in the meantime, which is better - the future credit or the certificate? From what I can gather from google, the future credit can be used with UA partners and the certificate cannot?
Originally Posted by Graciecatt
(Post 32365959)
or that you have to use the whole thing at once with a credit and a certificate can be used on multiple occasions until you use it up?
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Originally Posted by Graciecatt
(Post 32365959)
.... Shouldn't the total change of 1.5 hours earlier + 4 hour layover + arriving 4 hours later = enough time for a refund? ....
Long, detailed discussion with multiple points of view of this in COVID19 Schedule Change (6+hrs)/Cancellation Refund, UA resisting refunds, DOT ruling
Originally Posted by Graciecatt
(Post 32365959)
.. - the future credit or the certificate? From what I can gather from google, the future credit can be used with UA partners and the certificate cannot? or that you have to use the whole thing at once with a credit and a certificate can be used on multiple occasions until you use it up? This is super confusing. If I can't get a refund, I want to choose the smartest choice.
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Thank you both so much. I will go back and read those threads.
I am not thrilled with UA. But after spending an hour arguing about how lousy the new flight was (4 hours in EWR? :)) they put me on a different connection through ORD where I arrive at the exact same time as I was arriving originally. And only 1.5 hours in ORD, which is reasonable and won't cause stress. BOS-ORD UA3409 and ORD-LAX UA1967. Obviously I may still not fly this ticket either, in which case I will give up, get a certificate rather than a credit to use w/in 2 years, and fly Jet Blue nonstop instead. Plus they say they will refund me for the cost I paid to upgrade to E+, gave me E+ seats for free on the new flight. We'll see if I receive the seat refund. |
Originally Posted by Graciecatt
(Post 32366445)
BOS-ORD UA3409
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Originally Posted by dkc192
(Post 32366655)
BOS-ORD on UAX? Yikes. Never seen that before!
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Originally Posted by Graciecatt
(Post 32371477)
What? They don't normally fly to ORD?
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Originally Posted by fumje
(Post 32371507)
Historically it's usually mainline, not express ('UAX'), for BOS/ORD.
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Originally Posted by fumje
(Post 32371507)
Historically it's usually mainline, not express ('UAX'), for BOS/ORD.
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Originally Posted by cfischer
(Post 32373468)
there have always been some weekend UAX BOS-ORD. And a change to UAX is good news because you can get a refund ... different operating carrier.
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Originally Posted by Dave_C
(Post 32374013)
Is this in the CoC anywhere? I’ve got a booking for the end of June from SFO to SEA that has changed from mainline to UAX. It was a separate ticket designed to connect from LX (which I’m waiting to be cancelled too). I only paid £80 one way for it, so hardly the end of the world, but would be great to be able to get my money back if possible.
IMO, the law is clearly on your side if you request a refund, but you may need to go through a DOT complaint to get it. |
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