Often1

It's a business transaction. Nothing more and nothing less.

People over-personalize that business relationship (note the silly use of CEO first names all across FT) and when they over-personalize, they get upset.

If you don't like the business proposition put to you, fly another carrier.

entropy

If they're still running full planes with high fares, why would they care about a segment of flyers who paid years ago for a lifetime club, which costs UA money to service today (incremental cost), when they could "replace" them with an annual dues paying member? (I'm not saying they shouldn't, but by their logic, they are).


That's a good approach. Sometimes its nice to look at the LT status (I've got it, but I'm at 1.08M, so I'm unlikely, hopefully, to get to 2M.) What do I really stand to gain? A few reduced fees ? Certainly not going to be upgrades...

bluedemon211

I think loyalty programs of all stripes say they want to reward past performance (our view of loyalty) and maximize long term shareholder by attracting as many $'s as possible with the least investment (company's view of loyalty going forward). Personally, we understand that UA is a "for profit" company and needs to make money.

The balance between short term gain and long term growth is always a delicate one. UA's recent changes seem to be stilted toward getting the most $'s from customers while minimizing costs. Welcome to free market dynamics. We can either stay loyal and pad the numbers or walk and try to find a better partner. Frankly, despite the recent devaluations, the MP Program is still the best alliance in the sky. Other airlines have either already devalued more than UA (e.g. Sky Pesos) or likely will soon. If we have learned anything it is that this industry plays "follow the leader" in whatever appears to help the bottom line. Today's UA's devaluation will be tomorrow's change at AA, etc.

I only ask 2 things from UA.........1) make the rules clear and understandable and PLEASE keep things stable for a while so we can at least understand where the goal posts are, and 2) treat me like I have at least half a brain and STOP rolling out these changes as something that is for my benefit. We (appropriately) ridicule Smisek for "changes we will like". Today the changes are soft peddled as improvements. Please stop p@%$ing in my ear and tell me it is raining.....that's just insulting.

lilpisher

As a generally short haul domestic flyer, it can be tough getting past Plat, even though I always flew United and flew nearly every week. Next year 1k will be easy. I’m glad United is finally recognizing loyalty.

usedtobeimportant

Thanks for sharing I'm guessing United has looked at the numbers and said there's more for you than people who fly really long distances but rarely

rileydogmi

I take issue with many posts thinking the current crop of 1k's aren't loyal or profitable. My measly 133,289 PQM's and $14,033 PQD's to date no longer warrant 320 points a year to use for upgrades that rely on PZ availability.

We all have different travel situations and patterns - it was said before, a program should be inclusive and encourage all members to reach. And, to offer a product worth reaching for. United has now alienated people like me where the carrot is way off the mark. And another thing? They aren't even the best product out there to demand this premium.

Want a purely spend program that is fair and easy for all? 20 upgrade points per $3000 spend on UA metal only. Period. Then my $14,000 gets a few upgrades and the $24,000 gets a few more. To say this program is somehow revolutionary and leading edge and truly cost based is drinking the UA kool aid. This is simply moving to a different definition and new ways to game the system that I feel won't drive higher profits.

lilpisher

I never commented on your loyalty. But flying from Chicago, I could spend 25k a year, flying 48 out of 52 weeks, and only qualify for Gold. And the only thing keeping me from jumping to AA was it was clear that US Air was going to destroy AA like CO did to UA for awhile (though feel like last year and a half life has gotten much better...).

CoMooter

OnePass followed the NW WP model, easy upgrades (domestically, and for a short while, internationally), lots of miles, but horrible redemption availability. Even as a NW Plat, I don’t think I ever sat in CO Y. Very nice benefit. Those programs were the SkyPeso’s of their day, even though DL was already moving in the same direction (and is still there) towards horrendously bad redemption on the premium awards that were most sought after.

The main thing MP, especially in the old days offered, was good and reasonably fair use of the miles you earned. Upgrades came if you paid for them through 500 mile certs, clubs came if you paid for them, auto E+ was about all you could expect other than *G lounge access overseas and *G lines.

Sure, 1K got you 6 SWU’s and access to the old 1K Rooms or whatever they were called and the occasional nice note from the Captain in flight - but that was about it. But then they started to cheap out on the SWU’s to be used on just the higher fare classes...

Different times...with a lot more competition and different theories on how best to keep your customer. Now, not so much.

mduell

I don't know of any commercial airline frequent flier program that has ever looked at loyalty in the sense of what portion of your flying or spend is on other airlines. They only look for the aggregate activity (however measured) on the airline and sometimes their partners, never a closer measure of loyalty. So call them activity programs not loyalty programs?

bearkatt

loyalty is a function of how much an airline needs cash. back in the early 90's when continental wasn't doing so well, they came up with their infinity scheme. I think is was that if you flew 50,000 miles times 5 years in a row, you got their highest level for life. a co-worker of mine got that. I think for him it translated into 1k for life now. even though he no longer flies. the problem for fliers now is that airlines are making record profits. so don't expect much.

Karl-MDW

I now understand that it was not "loyalty" during the first 25 years or so of frequent flyer programs, but I found that Mileage Plus benefited both the "frequent" flyer (me) and the airline.

This is simplistic, I know, but after deregulation, the airlines needed customers and offering perks to anyone who wanted to fly the airline regularly was beneficial to both the airline and the flyer. The perks were usually reasonably priced award seats and upgrades. Most award seats and upgrades were filling a percentage of usually empty seats. Flight attendants and ticket /gate agents were for the most part happy with their jobs, and they were taught to recognize frequent flyers. During irrops airline reservation systems were programmed to help the agent rebook frequent flyers before others. (I remember that I was once on a flight that was delayed. I got off the plane to talk to the ticket agent about an alternate flight. She was really busy, Finally, she asked my name. When I told her, she turned to the shelf behind her and gave me a new ticket for the alternate flight - which was booked before the original flight was publically announced as cancelled - AND before I asked. Now that was service!)

In those days, even living in Chicago I had a choice of which airline to fly. Before the advent of frequent flyer programs, I always flew the airline that my travel agent or I chose by calling around based on schedule and cost. I acknowledge that I had a special place in my heart for United. After all, I grew up less than two blocks from Midway Airport, United's home airport until 1962 or so. When mileage Plus started, it was United Mileage Plus that I chose first.

Up to the time of bankruptcy, I felt that both United and I benefited from our relationship. My flights were usually booked in some economy class fare, and I was usually always able to upgrade using certificates at first, and then 10,000 mile upgrades. I bought a Red Carpet Club membership annually for more than 25 years. While I did flirt with Delta for two years in the early 90s, I went back to United 99% of the time - with only a short trip here and there on other airlines just to keep my membership active. Eventually, I achieved Million Miler status.

Then came the award mile inflation (as early as the mid 90s after Delta et al and their triple mile challenges), the 2008 recession, bankruptcies, and mergers. The rest is history.

So, while "loyalty" might not be the right word, I did have a great relationship with a company and its brand.

I still have a relationship today -basically because of Million Mile status (which could change at any time). I still do several domestic trips every year, and once in a while (like next year) a paid international trip, but all of it is in a discounted economy fare; and I do shop around before buying - something that I never did before. So, I realize that I have been jilted -so to speak- for a more wealthy customer, but there is still a spark in my heart someplace for the past relationship.

dliesse

I believe that in the early days the various programs were closer to being loyalty programs than now, but they never were completely. If they were they would recognize status based on the number of trips -- not segments, but complete one-way trips (until you had the X in the Stopover column on your ticket) -- rather than dollars spent. Because they were mileage-based, though, someone flying one JFK-SFO round trip on a $99 special fare was given more credit than someone who flew five times, say, OMA-ORD. Who was the more loyal passenger (and yes, there were other options OMA-ORD)?

The programs became less and less about loyalty when we started getting credit for hotel stays, car rentals, using the United credit card to build our new houses (I had a boss who actually did that), and so on. None of that had anything whatsoever to do with loyalty to United. This is one reason I've never used the term "loyalty program" and have even gotten away from "frequent flyer program", which was the original term.

A retail establishment such as a grocery store or a bookstore has nothing to base rewards on besides dollars spent; at that level individual transactions are pretty meaningless. A transportation company is a little different. Mileage runs aside, you can't just take the same trip five consecutive days for one conference (well, maybe if you're on a SFO-LAX commute or something like that).

Others have gone into detail on the changing travel world, so I won't repeat any of that. I have my theories, and I have an MBA in aviation management which means I've at least looked at all this academically if not practically, and I also have my ideas of what an airline loyalty program should look like. Although I joined Mileage Plus in the first few months of its existence, I now fly whatever airline provides me the best value for a particular trip. Not price, mind you, but value. As someone pointed out recently in a professional group, if everyone were price-sensitive Apple wouldn't sell nearly as much product. Price factors in, of course, but so do schedule, comfort, and convenience (slightly different from schedule -- for example, the difference between flying to MKE, ORD, or MDW when your destination is Kenosha). As it happens, most of my travel since I moved back to the Seattle area is on AS, but I still consider all the possibilities for my much-fewer trips. The only reasons I belong to any travel loyalty programs are (a) force of habit, and (b) it's kind of difficult to deal with the airline/railroad/hotel online without it. The non-travel programs are essentially giving me rebates on things I would have bought anyway.

Ramble, ramble. Didn't mean to go on so, but I did refrain from lots of off-topic comments!

Often1

The largest customers, e.g. large corporate customers who account for an increasing share of the market, want lower prices. Period. They do not care about status, free tickets, who boards in what order and so on.

The same is true for many individual business travelers who are paying for travel out of pocket (or at least out of the profits of their business) and leisure travelers who have become more frugal.

At the same time, concentration means that a growing percentage of regular fliers have fewer choices and thus loyalty is less meaningful. If you live somewhere with one carrier, why does that carrier need to coddle you? Same thing if you live near a major single-carrier hub. Not that you can't fly UA out of ATL, but there is that other carrier with more frequencies to more places.

usedtobeimportant

Excellent point. This discussion board reflects just a fraction of the UA's customers.

I have no idea how many organizations have corporate policies to only fly company x (or x y).

I could imagine UA thinking of us as tiny customers and these corporations as the real prized customers hence the changes.

CMK10

I came to United in 2004 and I guess it was a little bit more about loyalty back then. But in my opinion that United was so much worse than the one today that it balances out.