emcampbe

lincolnjkc

I'm not sure how much of it is a "complaint" vs. an "observation". The thing that annoys me about this from the inbound passenger point of view is that I've sat in the penalty box staring at multiple empty, UA controlled, gates but we were kept out on the field waiting for a specific gate. I understand that there are logistical reasons/necessities that discourage late gate swaps but it's still frustrating -- spending idle time in my seat when I could be getting work done in the UC (if a connection) or going home/to the client/hotel/generally getting on with my life if at the end of the journey. Heck, even if we were still in the air I could be productive with my laptop, etc. vs sitting in the penalty box strapped in to seats with everything stowed because we may move at any second.

In the case I mentioned upthread where I misconnected despite being on the ground 30 early but got the door open 20 late because the first aircraft was late off the gate I could see no fewer than 6 open, UA owned, gates the entire time we were waiting.

I haven't encountered this internationally, I think in part because many international airports don't actually post a departure gate (the inbound aircraft's arrival gate) until much closer to the departure time which obviates many of the logistical problems that a late gate swap causes (e.g. passengers and luggage/cargo haven't had a chance to congregate in the "wrong" gate area)

LarryJ

Most hub airports in the US are behind on gate availability. Most have gate expansion projects either underway or planned.

EWR is building a new terminal which will replace the current A terminal.
LGA is completely rebuilding a large portion of the airports terminals and concourses.
ORD has just selected the design for it's Terminal 2 replacement project and terminal 1 concourse expansion and is currently working on expanding Terminal 5 as well as building a new runway. (Maybe they'll fix some of the bumpy taxiways soon, too!)
IAH recently opened a new north C concourse and has plans to continue rebuilding the north side from that new C concourse through the D concourse.
DEN is expanding the gates on all three concourses (and remaking the terminal's 'Great Hall')
SFO is rebuilding/expanding the south side concourses.
LAX has plans for expansion on both the north side (SWA) and a terminal 9 (UAL).
BNA is doing an extensive terminal and concourse project that will rebuild the international arrivals; add gates, parking garages, and a hotel; and increase gates. (Not a hub but I live there so had to include it)

When I have extra time in the hubs I like to visit the various SOCs (station operations control) and ramp towers. At each hub there is a person whose only job is to manage the gate assignments. They have a large, vertical monitor with the timeline on the horizontal axis and gates on the vertical. Each flight is shown on its gate as a horizontal bar indicating its arrival and departure. Colors specify the fleet type. Each gate also has restrictions on which aircraft it can accept, what equipment might be inoperative, etc.

One late morning I visited the SOC in DEN and stood behind the lady working gates. She was working non-stop, talking to various people through her headset on a communications panel that looked like it came right out of an air traffic control center. I was told that on that morning they had exactly as many widebody-capable gates as they had widebody flights scheduled so there was no flexibility on those gates. Two gates had inoperative ground power. Another gate was scheduled to go out of service that afternoon to have the stiping re-painted. Other gates were closed for construction.

Most of the issues she was dealing with were not things we would know about in the cockpit. If we don't know it, we can't explain it to the passengers. What I'm trying to say is that, at least at the hubs, there is someone whose only job is to manage the allocation of gates. When you land and have to wait for a gate, you can at least know that there is someone who is aware of the issue and has the power to change it if a change is possible and practical.

Another problem that you'll find when you do get a last minute gate change is that a ground crew may not be available to park you when you arrive at the new, open gate. Your original crew is still working to push out the airplane from your original gate and the crew for your new gate may also be working on a flight at another gate in their zone.

I know some FlyerTalk members have had unique opportunities to tour the NOC and various SOCs. If you ever do, I'd highly recommend asking to see the gate manager position and what they do. I could have stood there watching for quite some time if my guide didn't have other work to get back to.

International arrivals can have their own issues. The international arrival gates are often not fully within the control of the airline. The B-gates at EWR, M-gates at ORD, etc. are managed by the port authority and/or airport. We don't necessarily know when they will be able to give us a gate.

At international stations the gates are frequently common-use gates that are controlled by the airport authority. Sometimes we don't even know our gate until after we land.

After takeoff, when we first have a fairly good idea of when we will land, we get a gate assignment message which includes the time at which the gate will come available. If we are early, and our gate will not be ready, we can slow down a bit which both saves fuel and reduces or eliminates the amount of time we will have to wait on the ground. Sometimes it isn't enough or a flight that was suppose to clear five or ten minutes before our arrival takes a delay. It is not unusual to be landing at ORD within just a few minutes of the scheduled push time of the airplane at our gate. If it looks like we'll significantly beat our flight plan time I'll send a new Expected On time through ACARS which will give the gate manager a heads up that we'll be earlier. Often, a new gate assignment follows ten or fifteen minutes later. Other times, there are no other gates so it doesn't.

My personal record, for what it's worth, is five gate changes on a flight from Florida to ORD. We received our first ORD gate assignment shortly after takeoff (climbing through ~20,000'). By the time we were parked in ORD, that gate had changed five times!

BF263533

Some of the problem could be solved by larger aircraft and less frequencies.

LarryJ

How do you change an A319 into an A321? Then how do you change it back again when the next recession arrives?

I think you have to plan your fleet for something in between the booms and the busts so that you can prosper, or survive, in whatever comes next.

JimInOhio

It's one thing to wait for a gate and end up on time but I've arrived on the ground in time to be 15 - 20 minutes early at the gate yet end up at the gate 20 minutes behind schedule.

Aspen

If I remember correctly.....

I think UAL were encouraged/prodded by LAWA to sell/lease their LAX T6 gates in ~2014 to AA as part of the deal to re-furbish T7. I have long speculated that the 6.00am arrivals from MEL & SYD are disembarked at TBIT because of a lack of gate space at T7 not the reluctance of UAL to pay for the passengers to be processed downstairs in the dungeon immigration facility below T7.
With 20/20 hindsight - should have UAL held on to their gates in T6 ?

HoyaSFOIAD

trmbn65

I find it to happen at ORD the most frequently. I've waited for nearly an hour on multiple occasions.

ISTFlyer

At least this situation is seen rare on United Airlines flights, %75 of my American Airlines flights ( regardless of arrival airport but @ LAX: %100 ) I have waited around 10-30 minutes for our parking position to be empty. I have never experienced this on United even at LAX during an early arrival.

Unfortunately, at LAX all airlines ( that own gates ) should be forced to have remote stand equipments ( buses with drivers, stairs, mobile elevators for disabled people, mobile ground power source etc... at an empty apron ), this would be the only solution. This is how British Airways deals at LHR and Lufthansa deals at FRA & MUC.

Also during my last visit to SFO, with UA ( I was a connecting DOM to DOM pax ), most of the UA gates were empty ( Thursday around 20:00 [ 8PM ] ) and we were quickly parked to an available gate despite arriving 15-20 minutes early.

narvik

This was a common occurrence for me too.

HOWEVER, for some reason this year on this very flight, I have arrived at EWR early, and was already on RT78 in the rental car before the scheduled arrival time. This has now happened twice this year.

IAD_flyer

I am not sure why but US airports have always have had a reluctance to set up hard stands like the rest of the world. Hard stands are no ones favorite but beat waiting for a gate to open.

phkc070408

The problem with this is customers demand frequent service on certain routes, and if UA doesn't offer it, some other airline will. Frequent service is one of the things an airline does on certain routes to attract customers and make the route strong. Since only higher capacity aircraft are able to perform on the long haul international routes, less frequent service has become the norm and is generally accepted. Trust me, if a 752 could do EWR-NRT, there would be 2 or 3 daily frequencies.

I agree that it's silly to complain that you're not arriving even earlier than you already are, but I also under the psychological issue of getting excited when you look at your watch when you land 40" early and then getting the let-down when you're told you have to wait 20 minutes for a gate, especially after an ULH.

I had two slightly different personal experiences.

1. Flying BNA-ORD on an RJ, they scheduled us to come into a wide-body gate and the bridge operator couldn't get the bridge to line up with the plane (I'm not so sure that it wasn't bridge-operator error).
2. Flying TLV-EWR on 91, my father was the pilot. We landed in EWR at 0250am but border control wasn't scheduled to open until 0400, so we were all prisoners of the plane (fortunately they were ready by about 0340). My father told me that he knew this would be a problem and tried to slow the plane down as much as possible, but the winds were just too light.

Austin787

This problem happens more frequently since the airlines banked their hubs. As a result, almost every gate is utilized during the arrival times and no spare gates available if a delayed flight is occupying a gate which another airplane is waiting for.

Some of my worst waiting for a gate moments were:
1) Landed DFW on track to arrive on time, if not a few minutes early. Then waited one hour for a gate. We missed our connection.
2) Landed LAX early, on track to arrive 15 minutes early. Then wait 30 minutes for a gate, then when we finally park at the gate the agents took 15 minutes to figure out how to move the jetway. Flight ended up arriving 30 minutes late.

lhrsfo