SFO-AMS go to seasonal even before service starts! & SFO-MUC goes to year round

Reply Subscribe

Thread Tools

Search this Thread

Mar 24, 2019, 12:02 pm

#16

findark

FlyerTalk Evangelist

Join Date: Nov 2014

Location: MSP

Programs: DL PM, UA Gold, WN, Global Entry; +others wherever miles/points are found

Posts: 14,395

Quote:

Originally Posted by ACYYZ/SD

Makes sense. MUC has the connectivity and is an awesome facility. They obviously tested the waters with year-round SFO/AMS and would appear that advance booking projections did not meet target.

I also think they're load balancing with LH on the SFO-FRA/MUC combined market, possibly freeing up LH frames for something else.

Mar 24, 2019, 12:15 pm

#17

sinoflyer

Join Date: Feb 2006

Programs: UA, Starwood, Priority Club, Hertz, Starbucks Gold Card

Posts: 3,952

Remember DL's ORD-LHR? I didn't think so. Route planners sometimes miss their projections.

Imstevek likes this.

Mar 24, 2019, 3:28 pm

#18

avi8tir

Join Date: Mar 2004

Location: LAX IAH AMS

Programs: UA GS 1MM

Posts: 1,266

Didn't KL just announce this week a 2nd AMS-SFO flight?

Thinking that's the reason they cut it back.

Mar 24, 2019, 4:47 pm

#19

lhrsfo

FlyerTalk Evangelist

Join Date: Jan 2009

Location: London & Sonoma CA

Programs: UA 1K, MM *G for life, BAEC Gold

Posts: 10,220

Quote:

Originally Posted by dilanesp

It's a tough market for UA because AMS is a SkyTeam hub.

Just like AMS-SFO is a tough market for KL because SFO is a *A hub. But KL seems to be able to overcome such difficulties.

Mar 24, 2019, 6:56 pm

#20

BB2220

Join Date: Jun 2014

Posts: 261

Quote:

Originally Posted by mahasamatman

On the surface, the availability of PZ could indicate that flight is a financial failure for United. If that was the only piece of information I had, I wouldn't expect it to last, though I'm sure there are other reasons for the flight to exist.

Maybe they were/are hoping it would be more successful so they could close down IAH-AMS?

IAH-AMS has been running for a long time. Due to the market dynamics SFO couldn’t replace IAH on that route.

Mar 24, 2019, 9:45 pm

#21

hirohito888

Join Date: Jul 2005

Location: NYC

Programs: UA-1K MM, AA-Gold, DL-Silver, AS-MVP

Posts: 2,508

Quote:

Originally Posted by lhrsfo

Just like AMS-SFO is a tough market for KL because SFO is a *A hub. But KL seems to be able to overcome such difficulties.

Because KL only has 1 hub and can rely on Europe/Middle East/Africa feed. UA is already flying to AMS from 4 different hubs, an additional flight will of course have an effect on the entire US-AMS traffic.

Mar 24, 2019, 10:15 pm

#22

cesco.g

FlyerTalk Evangelist

Join Date: Oct 1999

Posts: 11,468

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bavariair

SFO-MUC is going year-round instead, maybe they decided putting the frame on that route makes more sense than AMS...

Most likely. ZRH might be a runner-up for year-round down the road.

Mar 24, 2019, 10:25 pm

#23

cesco.g

FlyerTalk Evangelist

Join Date: Oct 1999

Posts: 11,468

Quote:

Originally Posted by JAaronT

I’m having trouble interpreting the article. When is the service effective?

March 30 to October 25 SFO-AMS; AMS-SFO one day later.

Mar 24, 2019, 11:27 pm

#24

dilanesp

Join Date: Feb 2015

Programs: united

Posts: 1,636

Quote:

Originally Posted by lhrsfo

Just like AMS-SFO is a tough market for KL because SFO is a *A hub. But KL seems to be able to overcome such difficulties.

AMS is a lot closer to being a fortress hub than SFO.

Mar 25, 2019, 2:12 am

#25

Thysk

Join Date: Aug 2017

Location: Somewhere between AMS and ANR

Programs: Hilton Diamond, Marriott Platinum, Hyatt Globalist, United Platinum Premier, AF/KLM Platinum

Posts: 266

Quote:

Originally Posted by MSPeconomist

Plus, this would be a long thin route, so it's expensive to operate. Saturating the AMS market with capacity and starting a price war with DL/KLM doesn't seem like it would have been a wise move.

As a passenger flying out of AMS a lot, I tend to disagree

onthesam likes this.

Mar 25, 2019, 6:55 am

#26

williambruno1975

Join Date: Oct 2017

Programs: SPG, Marriott, UA, AA, CX, SQ

Posts: 165

So UA converting their FIFTH gateway flight to rival fortress hub to summer only and people scream bloody murder

but when it’s AA canceling their ONLY gateway to TLV and DL canceling their ONLY gateway to HKG then it’s “they’re in the business to make money”

*eye roll*

jsloan, coolbeans202, hirohito888 and 2 others like this.

Mar 25, 2019, 7:35 am

#27

Bear96

FlyerTalk Evangelist

Join Date: May 2000

Location: TPA for now. Hopefully LIS for retirement

Posts: 13,682

Quote:

Originally Posted by williambruno1975

"Screaming bloody murder"? Goodness, that sounds serious!

Um, who is doing that exactly?

Mar 29, 2019, 4:24 pm

#28

jupper

Join Date: Apr 2007

Location: 42mi from AMS

Programs: UA 1K 1MM, Marriott LT Au, Hilton C, IHG PtA

Posts: 576

Quote:

Originally Posted by hirohito888

UA is already flying to AMS from 4 different hubs, an additional flight will of course have an effect on the entire US-AMS traffic.

Right now, West-Coast to AMS means a very early flight at SFO, have done it quite a number of times.

Quote:

Originally Posted by BB2220

IAH-AMS has been running for a long time. Due to the market dynamics SFO couldn’t replace IAH on that route.

There's a lot of (TX) business folks on that flight, not necessarily all oil/gas stuff too. It's been running on a 777-200 for ages now.
And it's a very nice freight route, there's a lot of logistics around AMS/NL...

Quote:

Originally Posted by lhrsfo

Just like AMS-SFO is a tough market for KL because SFO is a *A hub. But KL seems to be able to overcome such difficulties.

SFO is a big cargo route for KL. I once heard it was their best use of the half-freight 747-400 Combi...

Quote:

Originally Posted by MSPeconomist

Maybe UA somehow believes that people from the Bay Area especially want to visit Amsterdam?

Well, mind you, government folks need to fly flag-carriers, and there's a lot of those folks in the Bay Area too, and you have flights to all major *A hubs out of AMS as well as to other places.
Then again, maybe UA is seeing how BRexit pans out...

Apr 1, 2019, 9:13 am

#29

Infinite1K

Join Date: Apr 2010

Programs: AA PP, UA 1K/MM, WoH Globalist, HH Gold

Posts: 1,194

Looking at today's flight (April 1st) and no, this isn't an April fools joke, there are only 21/48 business seats booked and the upgrade list currently shows 32 people and it is identical to the standby list (aka NonRev).

Meanwhile, Award and Upgrade fare buckets are zero-ed out and the asking price for business class is at $12000+ for roundtrip.

Tomorrow's flight (April 2nd) not looking any better. 18/48 business class seats booked. Similarly Award and Upgrade fare buckets are zero-ed out with $12000+ fares for business class.

P.S. Fun fact, the aircraft for today is coming from Anchorage! Apparently UA 892 from ICN diverted.

Apr 1, 2019, 10:23 am

#30

hockey7711

Join Date: Oct 2005

Programs: Continental

Posts: 1,588

April 1

Look at all the non revs on the standby and upgrade waitlists.
Also, they have changed the aircraft three times until they could finally get one that will cause a delay. 😩😩The original from hnd and second from sin will arrive sfo in plenty of time!
I will be on the AMS flight today.

Last edited by hockey7711; Apr 1, 2019 at 10:27 am Reason: Additional

Reply Share

First
Prev
2 / 3
Next
Last

Forum Jump