All electronics turned off for SIN-SFO flight - comments from multiple onboard FTers
Mar 22, 2019, 7:08 pm
#76
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 73
Originally Posted by
[b
[b
As other posters have noted, mechanical issues occur inflight. Why is we need to have carriers give us massive compensations or reimburse thousands of dollars one paid for J seat as some posters upthread have suggested and would expect.[/b]
Example, Your Mercedes breaks down, you call Mercedes road service, they com & pick you up. You miss your meeting and some work hours. Would one expect Mercedes compensation you for lost of working income or missing an important meeting?.
In this day & age when internet is essential for work. When one's service provider's servers go down. No internet for 3-6 hours, does the provider compensate you for loss of income or even few hundred dollars?
Example, Your Mercedes breaks down, you call Mercedes road service, they com & pick you up. You miss your meeting and some work hours. Would one expect Mercedes compensation you for lost of working income or missing an important meeting?.
In this day & age when internet is essential for work. When one's service provider's servers go down. No internet for 3-6 hours, does the provider compensate you for loss of income or even few hundred dollars?
Lastly, I do not buy use of an airline seat. I buy the ability to work and "comfort". Same as "you do not buy a drill, you buy the ability to drill a hole".
Btw, I am not asking United for money, I will take what they offer. I just like looking at this situation from a service and service recovery perspective. If it were up to me, United would use a predictive model to estimate what benefit is most important to me, and then they would price the "refund" accordingly. They know a lot about me - flights taken, fare classes purchased, flight length, destinations, services purchased. They can fairly accurately predict if I am on a business trip or not. If "yes", they can further predict if I am likely to work during the flight (e.g., Wifi purchased or not, length of time spent in Singapore (2 days in my case) etc. etc.). I would gladly accept the occasional misclassification error.
Mar 22, 2019, 7:29 pm
#77
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 7,875
So the option the pilot had was to land somewhere when the power went out and to wait for another plane to replace the first so that you could have "what you paid for" and that might have taken a day or two ---- or he could do what he did and fly you to point B and land you safe and on-time. Had he done the first, you could not have complained about compensation, but for the second you can?
Not saying it is impossible, but it seems unlikely. This is a super-long flight, much worse in other direction as well (I looked up actual duration cause I was inquiring why someone wasn't willing to fly business vs economy)
As other posters have noted, mechanical issues occur inflight. Why is we need to have carriers give us massive compensations or reimburse thousands of dollars one paid for J seat as some posters upthread have suggested and would expect.
Example, Your Mercedes breaks down, you call Mercedes road service, they com & pick you up. You miss your meeting and some work hours. Would one expect Mercedes compensation you for lost of working income or missing an important meeting?.
In this day & age when internet is essential for work. When one's service provider's servers go down. No internet for 3-6 hours, does the provider compensate you for loss of income or even few hundred dollars?
Example, Your Mercedes breaks down, you call Mercedes road service, they com & pick you up. You miss your meeting and some work hours. Would one expect Mercedes compensation you for lost of working income or missing an important meeting?.
In this day & age when internet is essential for work. When one's service provider's servers go down. No internet for 3-6 hours, does the provider compensate you for loss of income or even few hundred dollars?
Last edited by WineCountryUA; Mar 22, 2019 at 8:06 pm
Mar 22, 2019, 7:46 pm
#78
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: トロント
Programs: IHG Gold
Posts: 4,817
You just check out and the clerk says "Sorry about everything not working"...you just say thanks and walk out?
Alternatively, you buy a microwave and it does not work...you bring it back and they say "too bad, all sales final". That's ok with you?
Mar 22, 2019, 7:57 pm
#79
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 7,875
So let's say you book a hotel. You go to the room and the heater does not work in winter (in a cold weather climate). You turn on the TV..does not work. The water is turned off all day due to a plumbing issue.
You just check out and the clerk says "Sorry about everything not working"...you just say thanks and walk out?
Alternatively, you buy a microwave and it does not work...you bring it back and they say "too bad, all sales final". That's ok with you?
You just check out and the clerk says "Sorry about everything not working"...you just say thanks and walk out?
Alternatively, you buy a microwave and it does not work...you bring it back and they say "too bad, all sales final". That's ok with you?
(and btw, the clerk cannot check you out normally, because the computers also don't work without electricity)
Mar 23, 2019, 2:39 am
#80
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: NYC, LON
Programs: *
Posts: 2,767
US carriers give some kind of compensation. I suggest you check out other international carriers forums RE: Compensation.
As other posters have noted, mechanical issues occur inflight. Why is we need to have carriers give us massive compensations or reimburse thousands of dollars one paid for J seat as some posters upthread have suggested and would expect.
I second that & will add, this sense of entitlement is more prevalent in North America.
As I said we have been so battered by the airlines if 50 business passengers feel it is acceptable for an entire cabin to be dark and powerless for several hours and yet all they get is 200 USD compensation and zero refund of paid fare. As others have said we would not accept that in any other aspect of life and expect goods we pay for to perform exactly as prescribed. Rather than condemn the airline for such derisory and pitiful response to it's most valued customers we are castigating a passenger who dared speak up and labeling them as overentitled. The airlines love this and reading this thread UA will see no reason to improve and will continue with it's usual 'enhancements' that have eroded the quality of it's service last ten years.
It is not hard to work out circumstances in which refund rather than compensation is due. The question is would most reasonable business passengers have bought the fare and boarded a 13 to 14h flight had they known there would be no power in cabin for two thirds of flight? I suspect many would not. Now if you asked same question and said if one seat was malfunctioning, wifi didn't work, IFE didn't work, coffee machine didn't work etc then you may get different response - that is compensation territory.
Mar 23, 2019, 8:11 pm
#81
Join Date: Mar 2019
Location: SFO/SJC, JFK
Programs: United 1K 2MM - Jet Blue Mosaic - Hyatt LTG - Marriott Plat - Hertz PC
Posts: 205
I'd be appalled by such a poor compensation offer. It wasn't just IFE, but even reading lights and the seat power as well. UA charges a huge premium for business class. The seat is a huge part of that.
Mar 23, 2019, 8:58 pm
#82
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Oct 2014
Posts: 10,904
We are using the term compensation too loosely. We are not discussing compensation here but rather a refund of appropriate fare for unprovided service. UA did not give the passengers any compensation and indeed barely scratched the surface in refund for unprovided service. Compensation is what I get if I get inconvenienced like flight delay, cabin too hot, a small detail of service is lacking, wine poured on my clothes and not what I get if I paid for a product and got in return something substantially less than what I paid for. This is not about entitlement but about principle.
Had I been on that flight I would have:
1. Requested the fare difference between J and Y as a refund.
2. If that failed, initiated a chargeback on my CC for the fare difference under "services not rendered"
3. And, if that failed, initiate a SCC case for the difference
Mar 24, 2019, 3:31 am
#83
Original Poster
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Raleigh, NC
Programs: United 1K
Posts: 72
I did not realize that this would become such a hot and more surprisingly, contested, topic.
I apologize if my original post appeared misleading. I thought that I did make clear that the Internet did work, that they were able to put my seat down once I realized that was possible, and that they were able to cook the food. I am not exactly sure what was inferred from what I said that made it seem more dire than it was.
Honestly I was much more inconvenienced by not having Internet at all on my flight back from Shanghai, and that was made worse by the fact that I was not aware until AFTER we reached altitude, and so I had no way of warning my office and delegating tasks before the cabin door closed. By the time I landed it was already after EOD and all I could do was read the email s to see what had happened in my ansence and what I would need to fix.
I did not discuss what my personal expcetations were because I didnt really think it was too relavant. But personally I was not planning to sleep for the first half of the flight because my trip to Asia had been short and I was working each day so I needed to be working diring business hours on the East Coast.
If I had not been in the center section I would have loved to be able to "open" (undim) a window for light. Yes, we had cabin lights for the dinner service. We had daylight by window for the pre-arrival meal. In the center section that was kind of dark, adn many people were not undimming their window.
As I said, I was personally grateful that I had Internet and would have been inconvenienced much more by its lack then then IFE. My laptop did lose power eventually, and I had to switch to using my phone for emails. I had power packs to keep my phones charged.
The email from customer service simply said that the compensation was for the lack of IFE, and I feel that the rest of it was important, too.
To be very clear: I am VERY grateful we did not divert to Tokyo! I am VERY gratefeul that they did not leave the electricity on and let that incessant seat belt chime continue!! I never felt that there was a safety issue, and I was by and large comfortable on the flight. I think that most of us agree that SOME compensation is fair. I am not expecting a refund of the fare difference between Polaris and coach. Not even close. But I do think that $175 is about half or less of what would be fair considering the multitude of issues.
I apologize if my original post appeared misleading. I thought that I did make clear that the Internet did work, that they were able to put my seat down once I realized that was possible, and that they were able to cook the food. I am not exactly sure what was inferred from what I said that made it seem more dire than it was.
Honestly I was much more inconvenienced by not having Internet at all on my flight back from Shanghai, and that was made worse by the fact that I was not aware until AFTER we reached altitude, and so I had no way of warning my office and delegating tasks before the cabin door closed. By the time I landed it was already after EOD and all I could do was read the email s to see what had happened in my ansence and what I would need to fix.
I did not discuss what my personal expcetations were because I didnt really think it was too relavant. But personally I was not planning to sleep for the first half of the flight because my trip to Asia had been short and I was working each day so I needed to be working diring business hours on the East Coast.
If I had not been in the center section I would have loved to be able to "open" (undim) a window for light. Yes, we had cabin lights for the dinner service. We had daylight by window for the pre-arrival meal. In the center section that was kind of dark, adn many people were not undimming their window.
As I said, I was personally grateful that I had Internet and would have been inconvenienced much more by its lack then then IFE. My laptop did lose power eventually, and I had to switch to using my phone for emails. I had power packs to keep my phones charged.
The email from customer service simply said that the compensation was for the lack of IFE, and I feel that the rest of it was important, too.
To be very clear: I am VERY grateful we did not divert to Tokyo! I am VERY gratefeul that they did not leave the electricity on and let that incessant seat belt chime continue!! I never felt that there was a safety issue, and I was by and large comfortable on the flight. I think that most of us agree that SOME compensation is fair. I am not expecting a refund of the fare difference between Polaris and coach. Not even close. But I do think that $175 is about half or less of what would be fair considering the multitude of issues.
Mar 24, 2019, 6:43 am
#84
Suspended
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: Buffalo, but live from suitcase
Programs: Delta, AA, Marriott
Posts: 240
I did not realize that this would become such a hot and more surprisingly, contested, topic.
I apologize if my original post appeared misleading. I thought that I did make clear that the Internet did work, that they were able to put my seat down once I realized that was possible, and that they were able to cook the food. I am not exactly sure what was inferred from what I said that made it seem more dire than it was.
Honestly I was much more inconvenienced by not having Internet at all on my flight back from Shanghai, and that was made worse by the fact that I was not aware until AFTER we reached altitude, and so I had no way of warning my office and delegating tasks before the cabin door closed. By the time I landed it was already after EOD and all I could do was read the email s to see what had happened in my ansence and what I would need to fix.
I did not discuss what my personal expcetations were because I didnt really think it was too relavant. But personally I was not planning to sleep for the first half of the flight because my trip to Asia had been short and I was working each day so I needed to be working diring business hours on the East Coast.
If I had not been in the center section I would have loved to be able to "open" (undim) a window for light. Yes, we had cabin lights for the dinner service. We had daylight by window for the pre-arrival meal. In the center section that was kind of dark, adn many people were not undimming their window.
As I said, I was personally grateful that I had Internet and would have been inconvenienced much more by its lack then then IFE. My laptop did lose power eventually, and I had to switch to using my phone for emails. I had power packs to keep my phones charged.
The email from customer service simply said that the compensation was for the lack of IFE, and I feel that the rest of it was important, too.
To be very clear: I am VERY grateful we did not divert to Tokyo! I am VERY gratefeul that they did not leave the electricity on and let that incessant seat belt chime continue!! I never felt that there was a safety issue, and I was by and large comfortable on the flight. I think that most of us agree that SOME compensation is fair. I am not expecting a refund of the fare difference between Polaris and coach. Not even close. But I do think that $175 is about half or less of what would be fair considering the multitude of issues.
I apologize if my original post appeared misleading. I thought that I did make clear that the Internet did work, that they were able to put my seat down once I realized that was possible, and that they were able to cook the food. I am not exactly sure what was inferred from what I said that made it seem more dire than it was.
Honestly I was much more inconvenienced by not having Internet at all on my flight back from Shanghai, and that was made worse by the fact that I was not aware until AFTER we reached altitude, and so I had no way of warning my office and delegating tasks before the cabin door closed. By the time I landed it was already after EOD and all I could do was read the email s to see what had happened in my ansence and what I would need to fix.
I did not discuss what my personal expcetations were because I didnt really think it was too relavant. But personally I was not planning to sleep for the first half of the flight because my trip to Asia had been short and I was working each day so I needed to be working diring business hours on the East Coast.
If I had not been in the center section I would have loved to be able to "open" (undim) a window for light. Yes, we had cabin lights for the dinner service. We had daylight by window for the pre-arrival meal. In the center section that was kind of dark, adn many people were not undimming their window.
As I said, I was personally grateful that I had Internet and would have been inconvenienced much more by its lack then then IFE. My laptop did lose power eventually, and I had to switch to using my phone for emails. I had power packs to keep my phones charged.
The email from customer service simply said that the compensation was for the lack of IFE, and I feel that the rest of it was important, too.
To be very clear: I am VERY grateful we did not divert to Tokyo! I am VERY gratefeul that they did not leave the electricity on and let that incessant seat belt chime continue!! I never felt that there was a safety issue, and I was by and large comfortable on the flight. I think that most of us agree that SOME compensation is fair. I am not expecting a refund of the fare difference between Polaris and coach. Not even close. But I do think that $175 is about half or less of what would be fair considering the multitude of issues.
Mar 24, 2019, 1:52 pm
#85
Original Poster
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Raleigh, NC
Programs: United 1K
Posts: 72
Update: In the origonal post I said that we were offered $125 each. My husband had clicked through the customer cares site during the flight and that is what he got. I only just followed up and I was offered $175. I am Platinum and he is Silver. I did send a message expressing my furstration, and they increased it to $200 for each of us and stated that it was what they gave to 1K flyers. I am going to use them now to book a flight for us to Brazil. I still think that Customer Service does not really understand that this is more thatn no movies, but as someone else said, I am going to take it and move on.
Mar 24, 2019, 1:55 pm
#86
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: HNL
Programs: UA GS4MM, MR LT Plat, Hilton Gold
Posts: 6,447
Update: In the origonal post I said that we were offered $125 each. My husband had clicked through the customer cares site during the flight and that is what he got. I only just followed up and I was offered $175. I am Platinum and he is Silver. I did send a message expressing my furstration, and they increased it to $200 for each of us and stated that it was what they gave to 1K flyers. I am going to use them now to book a flight for us to Brazil. I still think that Customer Service does not really understand that this is more thatn no movies, but as someone else said, I am going to take it and move on.
Mar 24, 2019, 4:13 pm
#87
Join Date: Apr 2015
Programs: United Global Services, Amtrak Select Executive
Posts: 4,088
Update: In the origonal post I said that we were offered $125 each. My husband had clicked through the customer cares site during the flight and that is what he got. I only just followed up and I was offered $175. I am Platinum and he is Silver. I did send a message expressing my furstration, and they increased it to $200 for each of us and stated that it was what they gave to 1K flyers. I am going to use them now to book a flight for us to Brazil. I still think that Customer Service does not really understand that this is more thatn no movies, but as someone else said, I am going to take it and move on.
Mar 24, 2019, 4:51 pm
#88
Join Date: Apr 2010
Programs: AA PP, UA 1K/MM, WoH Globalist, HH Gold
Posts: 1,187
I was recently on a United flight in Polaris that after a rolling 5 hour delay ultimately cancelled. We were scheduled on a flight the following day. As a 1K the compensation was $500 or 20,000 miles. I was told that the maximum compensation for an issue that lasted less than 24 hours was $500.
So in that context, the compensation offered would fit.
But it just shows you how how cheap United is. I'm in the camp of people that feel United does not compensate for their service issues.
So in that context, the compensation offered would fit.
But it just shows you how how cheap United is. I'm in the camp of people that feel United does not compensate for their service issues.
Mar 24, 2019, 5:15 pm
#89
Moderator: United Airlines
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: SFO
Programs: UA Plat 1.99MM, Hyatt Discoverist, Marriott Plat/LT Gold, Hilton Silver, IHG Plat
Posts: 66,735
What airlines do better (outside of those forced to by the likes of EU261 or other local requirement -- and even then it appears only a single digit percentage get the mandated compensation).
Mar 24, 2019, 5:56 pm
#90
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 73
I was on a LH flight, SEA-FRA, last year, in biz class. The seat was stuck in the a "20% reclined" position for most of the flight. I was refunded the full ticket price - and, no, I did not ask for it. No status on LH.
