Jan 4, 2021, 1:37 am
Last edit by: WineCountryUA
This is an archive thread, the archive thread is https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/united-airlines-mileageplus/1960195-b737max-cleared-faa-resume-passenger-flights-when-will-ua-max-flights-resume.html
Thread Topic
The reason for continuing this thread is to inform the UA traveler on the status of the MAX recertification and if / when UA might deploy the MAX aircraft. And UA flyer's thoughts about UA deploying the MAX if that was to happen.
United does not fly the 737 MAX 8 that has been involved in two recent crashes, but it does operate the 737 MAX 9.
How to tell if your flight is scheduled to be operated by the MAX 9:
View your reservation or flight status page, either on the web or on the app. United lists the entire aircraft type. Every flight that is scheduled to be on the 737 MAX will say "Boeing 737 MAX 9." If you see anything else -- for example, "Boeing 737-900," it is not scheduled to be a MAX at this time.
The same is true in search results and anywhere else on the United site.
For advanced users: UA uses the three letter IATA identifier 7M9 for the 737 MAX 9.
All 737 MAX aircraft worldwide (MAX 8, MAX 9, and MAX 10) are currently grounded.
Thread Topic
The reason for continuing this thread is to inform the UA traveler on the status of the MAX recertification and if / when UA might deploy the MAX aircraft. And UA flyer's thoughts about UA deploying the MAX if that was to happen.
READ BEFORE POSTING
Once again many posters in this thread have forgotten the FT rules and resorted to "Personal attacks, insults, baiting and flaming " and other non-collegial, non-civil discourse. This is not allowed.
Posters appear to be talking at others, talking about others, not discussing the core issues. Repeating the same statements, saying the same thing LOUDER is not civil discourse. These problems are not with one poster, they are not just one point of view, ...
As useful as some discussion here has been, continuing rules violations will lead to suspensions and thread closure. Please think about that before posting.
The purpose of FT is to be an informative forum that, in this case, enables the UA flyer to enhance their travel experience. There are other forums for different types of discussions. This thread was had wide latitude but that latitude is being abused.
Bottom line, if you can not stay within the FT rules and the forum's topic areas, please do not post.
And before posting, ask if you are bringing new contributing information to the discussion -- not just repeating previous points, then please do not post.
WineCountryUA
UA coModerator
Once again many posters in this thread have forgotten the FT rules and resorted to "Personal attacks, insults, baiting and flaming " and other non-collegial, non-civil discourse. This is not allowed.
Posters appear to be talking at others, talking about others, not discussing the core issues. Repeating the same statements, saying the same thing LOUDER is not civil discourse. These problems are not with one poster, they are not just one point of view, ...
As useful as some discussion here has been, continuing rules violations will lead to suspensions and thread closure. Please think about that before posting.
The purpose of FT is to be an informative forum that, in this case, enables the UA flyer to enhance their travel experience. There are other forums for different types of discussions. This thread was had wide latitude but that latitude is being abused.
Bottom line, if you can not stay within the FT rules and the forum's topic areas, please do not post.
And before posting, ask if you are bringing new contributing information to the discussion -- not just repeating previous points, then please do not post.
WineCountryUA
UA coModerator
This thread has engendered some strongly felt opinions and a great tendency to wander into many peripherally related topics. By all normal FT moderation standards, this thread would have been permanently closed long ago ( and numerous members receiving disciplinary actions).
However, given the importance of the subject, the UA Moderators have tried to host this discussion but odd here as UA is not the top 1 or 2 or 3 for MAX among North America carriers. However, some have allowed their passion and non-UA related opinions to repeatedly disrupt this discussion.
The reason for continuing this thread is to inform the UA traveler on the status of the MAX recertification and if / when UA might deploy the MAX aircraft. And UA flyer's thoughts about UA deploying the MAX if that was to happen.
Discussion of Boeing's culture or the impact on Boeing's future is not in scope. Nor is comments on restructuring the regulatory process. Neither is the impacts on COVID on the general air industry -- those are not UA specific and are better discussed elsewhere. And for discussion of UA's future, there is a separate thread.
Additionally repeated postings of essentially the same content should not happen nor unnecessarily inflammatory posts. And of course, the rest of FT posting rules apply including discuss the issue and not the posters.
The Moderator team feels there is a reason / need for this thread but it has been exhausting to have to repeated re-focus the discussion -- don't be the reason this thread is permanently closed ( and get yourself in disciplinary problems).
Stick to the relevant topic which is (repeating myself)
The reason for continuing this thread is to inform the UA traveler on the status of the MAX recertification and if / when UA might deploy the MAX aircraft. And UA flyer's thoughts about UA deploying the MAX if that was to happen.
WineCountryUA
UA coModerator
However, given the importance of the subject, the UA Moderators have tried to host this discussion but odd here as UA is not the top 1 or 2 or 3 for MAX among North America carriers. However, some have allowed their passion and non-UA related opinions to repeatedly disrupt this discussion.
The reason for continuing this thread is to inform the UA traveler on the status of the MAX recertification and if / when UA might deploy the MAX aircraft. And UA flyer's thoughts about UA deploying the MAX if that was to happen.
Discussion of Boeing's culture or the impact on Boeing's future is not in scope. Nor is comments on restructuring the regulatory process. Neither is the impacts on COVID on the general air industry -- those are not UA specific and are better discussed elsewhere. And for discussion of UA's future, there is a separate thread.
Additionally repeated postings of essentially the same content should not happen nor unnecessarily inflammatory posts. And of course, the rest of FT posting rules apply including discuss the issue and not the posters.
The Moderator team feels there is a reason / need for this thread but it has been exhausting to have to repeated re-focus the discussion -- don't be the reason this thread is permanently closed ( and get yourself in disciplinary problems).
Stick to the relevant topic which is (repeating myself)
The reason for continuing this thread is to inform the UA traveler on the status of the MAX recertification and if / when UA might deploy the MAX aircraft. And UA flyer's thoughts about UA deploying the MAX if that was to happen.
WineCountryUA
UA coModerator
United does not fly the 737 MAX 8 that has been involved in two recent crashes, but it does operate the 737 MAX 9.
How to tell if your flight is scheduled to be operated by the MAX 9:
View your reservation or flight status page, either on the web or on the app. United lists the entire aircraft type. Every flight that is scheduled to be on the 737 MAX will say "Boeing 737 MAX 9." If you see anything else -- for example, "Boeing 737-900," it is not scheduled to be a MAX at this time.
The same is true in search results and anywhere else on the United site.
For advanced users: UA uses the three letter IATA identifier 7M9 for the 737 MAX 9.
All 737 MAX aircraft worldwide (MAX 8, MAX 9, and MAX 10) are currently grounded.
B737MAX Recertification - Archive
Jul 16, 2019, 8:12 am
#2071
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Jul 16, 2019, 8:23 am
#2072
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: USA
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I hope the questions about emergency evacuation of that many people will never be answered but I don't plan to ever fly it. There is nothing on the aircraft that interests me and I will book away from any itinerary using it (have only encountered 1 or 2 trips where it was an option anyway).
There are a lot of factors that go into multi-billion dollar purchase decisions. The factors I see cited on FT by Airbus advocates tend to be "newness", comfort, and entertainment systems -- somehow I don't think these are big players in airline purchasing decisions. Annual (and end) costs, logistic concerns, political pressures, ability to incorporate in the fleet(s), etc. are probably much more important factors in airline decisions.
Jul 16, 2019, 8:39 am
#2073
Join Date: Jun 2014
Programs: UA MM
Posts: 4,107
That decision isn't made in a vacuum. The manufacturer takes new design proposals to its customers and the decision to launch is based on what he customers want to buy. The customers overwhelming wanted an updated, more efficient, less expensive, 737 that could be delivered sooner instead of an all-new design that, while even more efficient, would have been more expensive and not available until a number of years later. Boeing could have ignored their customers and pressed ahead with the new design but most of the airlines would not have waited for them.
edit: Lastly, not all of Boeing's customers wanted what Boeing was proposing. DL, for one, passed on the MAX.
Jul 16, 2019, 9:49 am
#2074
Join Date: Dec 2014
Programs: UA GS ,QF Plat
Posts: 686
For interest,I wonder how this all fits into the compensation equation...not a Ryanair fan BTW
https://www.bbc.com/news/business-49000796
https://www.bbc.com/news/business-49000796
Jul 16, 2019, 9:53 am
#2075
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You're trying to compare the VLA market to the narrow body. It's about like trying to compare the market for Toyota Corollas to the market for luxury buses.
Jul 16, 2019, 10:09 am
#2076
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No he isn't and no it's not. Narrow body, wide body, the major customers (airlines) care about profitability and other concerns more than passenger comfort when selecting aircraft type to buy. Comfort comes into play when they decide how to configure the interior (and again, profitability is a major factor -- they will certainly outfit the interior more comfortably if they could make more profit off it).
Jul 16, 2019, 10:13 am
#2077
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No he isn't and no it's not. Narrow body, wide body, the major customers (airlines) care about profitability and other concerns more than passenger comfort when selecting aircraft type to buy. Comfort comes into play when they decide how to configure the interior (and again, profitability is a major factor -- they will certainly outfit the interior more comfortably if they could make more profit off it).
Jul 16, 2019, 10:20 am
#2078
Join Date: Jun 2016
Posts: 233
Airbus got bitten with the costs and lack of a market with the 380 and that’s why Boeing is being cautious with launching the 797.
Jul 16, 2019, 10:20 am
#2079
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There is tons wrong with its economics and extremely narrow mission. The A380 was the answer to a question almost no airline was asking. Risk assessment in that arena versus risk assessment for a true 757 successor, to which Boeing should have committed a decade ago, is night and day.
Jul 16, 2019, 10:25 am
#2080
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They are different products but the same decision-making process applies. He was using the A380 as another example where the customer (airlines) focus on profitability. A lot of the discussion in this thread about A320 vs B737 has been from the passenger perspective and focused on comfort but the aircraft purchase decisions are based on other factors. For some airlines, further investment in the A320 makes sense, for others, it doesn't. Regardless of narrow vs. wide body, the airlines have to consider profitability, logistics, personnel base, etc.
Jul 16, 2019, 10:29 am
#2081
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No, that’s not what the OP was saying. They were saying that investing in a new aircraft is very expensive and making sure there is an adequate market for that plane is of primary importance to airbus and Boeing.
Airbus got bitten with the costs and lack of a market with the 380 and that’s why Boeing is being cautious with launching the 797.
Airbus got bitten with the costs and lack of a market with the 380 and that’s why Boeing is being cautious with launching the 797.
So then why use the A380 as the example? It isn't relevant. Yes the cost to develop the A380 may have been high, and sales did not perform exceedingly well, however, this is a direct result of the market segment that it's in.
The 777 could also be used as an example here, who's development causes were also high, however was in a completely different market segment and is a major success for Boeing.
Every aircraft is going to cost money to develop, successful or not. Comparing the very limited success of the A380 in the very limited VLA market to the potential success of a new aircraft in the narrow body market is not a relevant comparison.
Jul 16, 2019, 10:35 am
#2082
Join Date: Jun 2016
Posts: 233
So then why use the A380 as the example? It isn't relevant. Yes the cost to develop the A380 may have been high, and sales did not perform exceedingly well, however, this is a direct result of the market segment that it's in.
The 777 could also be used as an example here, who's development causes were also high, however was in a completely different market segment and is a major success for Boeing.
Every aircraft is going to cost money to develop, successful or not. Comparing the very limited success of the A380 in the very limited VLA market to the potential success of a new aircraft in the narrow body market is not a relevant comparison.
The 777 could also be used as an example here, who's development causes were also high, however was in a completely different market segment and is a major success for Boeing.
Every aircraft is going to cost money to develop, successful or not. Comparing the very limited success of the A380 in the very limited VLA market to the potential success of a new aircraft in the narrow body market is not a relevant comparison.
Jul 16, 2019, 10:38 am
#2083
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Jul 16, 2019, 10:45 am
#2084
Join Date: Jun 2016
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I’m pretty sure Boeing understands the economics of developing a new airplane in that market very well. Sometimes it makes sense to remodel the bathroom rather than imploding your house and building from scratch.
Jul 16, 2019, 10:56 am
#2085
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“Photos shared on Twitter show a plane in Ryanair colours outside Boeing's manufacturing base, with the name 737 Max replaced by 737-8200.“
https://www.bbc.com/news/business-48995509
https://www.bbc.com/news/business-48995509