FLYMSY

shaddie

shaddie

I have to ask. Would you ever consider "talking to them first". Maybe have a little compassion and ask what their issues are?
I will bet you $1000 dollars they are just frustrated because many complaints have went unanswered.

757FO instead of going directly to expel maybe find out what issue is.
My job works on systems costing 150k-1 million. 1-3 times a year I have to go in where a customer is very upset. I introduce myself and ask, what are issues? NEVER interrupt or say "but" while they are talking. If multiple issues, I will write them down. Then I will explain what I think issues are, or say I will bump up complaint to engineering. 99.9999999% of the time they are just happy that someone cares.

I will bet that the shirts were made cause many complaints went unanswered or canned email was sent.

Now to next scenario. Customer wearing t-shirt gets on 757FO plane. FO "confronts" him. Words are exchanged and customer is de-planed. Customer maybe works for multi-million $ UA account. All these complaints get sent to travel coordinator and they decide enough is enough. FO's name gets sent to UA rep as part of issue why we have decided to go with another company.
Believe me I know this works. When I was young and dumb I would argue with a stump. I really don't care about most of my customer's complaints but I can at least fake it.

COSPILOT

Thinking that XYZ company or any individual is so important, even a 1K or GS member, makes it ok to suffer abuse is wrong. I'm in sales, and intimately familiar with every single client. When they start treating my staff horrible, they are shown the door. As a vendor to others I've fired 3 clients over the years, and all 3 were top 5 clients. All 3 became good friends after I stood my ground and came running back, thankfully not treating my staff with daily foul language. I did nothing different, other than not tolerate the abuse they were giving. I've always been clear that my company isn't perfect, nobody is. However, we try hard and go the extra mile more often than not. I will not tolerate daily abuse that puts my team in a position that they update their resume to avoid a prick client.

I do $5 Million a year in my territory, and have fired 3 (as said above) clients that each exceeded $250K (all very profitable by the way) , do you really think UA cares about some 1K or GS?

So I'm with 757FO on this, he/she has been open and honest, even conflicted in what to do in some responses. Sounds like a pilot that is welcome in my home anytime.

VegasGambler

Please explain how complaining that the wifi sucks is the same as abusing staff.

COSPILOT

I'll stereotype to an extent, but someone that takes the time to make a shirt with a complaint is likely very vocal in person or on the phone. Or the person is the most spineless person on the planet and has zero backbone and can only communicate via a shirt. Either way, if UA's wifi is crap, don't buy it. I don't waste time with it, and while last year was a slow year, I'm usually in the 120 segment/year or more domestic road warrior. I get a ton done on the airplane just fine.

VegasGambler

Or maybe they are just not abusive.

Kicking someone off a plane because they are being abusive towards staff is one thing. Doing it because they are wearing a shirt complaining about one part of the product (not the staff) is quite another. Trying to equate the two is ridiculous.

COSPILOT

Guess I'm getting old, we can disagree, which is fine.

That said, and given your name, could you walk into the MGM with a shirt the says "MGM slots effing suck" and not be asked to leave or change the shirt? You will be fine for a while, but at some point someone will remove you. Right or wrong, you are not welcome at the MGM in my example. It's disruptive to the other guests at the casino if they are sober enough to realize what your shirt says.

My local Sprouts location is awesome but sucks at having enough checkout locations open. Not the person's fault that I eventually get to in the checkout line, but I don't think it would be taken kindly if every time I visited I wore a shirt that was harsh toward the store.

greenpau

Zurick

Somewhere there is a piece of paper that the US was founded on that gives him the right to wear that shirt - or you to wear same to his place of work. If the FAs refuse to fly, they should be fired. I don't see the problem

RFNJ

This is the only thing that I can see as a problem. A tshirt with some quasi-profanity? Who cares, as long as it is not crossing clear lines of "ism" or "phobia". it's a big bad world out there, and this really falls into the realm of trivial complaint, regardless of how the wearer views it. If this was a "critical" issue, they would be flying another airline.

To me I would mentally flag this person as "do not talk to" because they are obviously pushing an agenda, and frankly what I want on a plane is peace and quiet.

So "offensive" or not, the most effective way to deal with this specific type of takiness? Ignore it. Refusing to engage, especially if you are a United employee, is exactly what this person does NOT want. Only make it an issue if the person's behavior is disruptive.

I get the complaint, and I get the "employees on the front lines" desire to fix the issue. But confrontation over this is simply just making the flight less tolerable for the people who frankly just want to get to their destination with as little drama as possible.

chadbag

This shirt is more effective than choosing to fly elsewhere. A single or small group of people choosing to fly with someone else instead won't be noticed at all by UA management. Viral photos of the shirt will more likely be noticed (has already been mentioned the photo has been forwarded on to some level of management).

I flew to Japan on UA twice. Besides the outrageously small and cramped seats, and terrible service, their in-flight entertainment had migrated from seat-back to WiFi based on my own device. Except the WiFi bandwidth was not enough to provide service to any reasonable sub-set of passengers, and when you were lucky enough to get a connection, it usually lasted about 5 minutes or less before you lost it and had to try again for 30 minutes or more. That was the last time I flew United and I don't plan on flying them again unless the situation is such that there are no other partially affordable flights. If I do choose UA, it will be on a code share flight with one of their partners. We've since flown to Japan at least once, maybe twice and the wife flew again this past Christmas. United was not in the running. (Any US airline is not in the running except as last choice -- Wife flew a code share Delta flight on Korean there and Delta back and sad the Korean experience was 100% better than the Delta experience -- But United is the very last of the airlines we consider). So I HAVE stopped flying UA and they have not noticed. My no longer buying occasional tickets on UA for 4 people is a drop in the bucket and they will never know. But a t-shirt gets noticed and the squeaky wheel gets the grease.

Bear96

OK, this keeps coming up on this thread, so I'll bite.

What piece of paper gives someone the right to wear whatever they want to without repercussion in the U.S. at a private business like an airline?

jybrick

Rbt001

Never, Fully, Works

Never, Flitting, Works

Never, Fudging, Works

There's a lot of ways to substitute "effing" If you choose to fill in the blank with something else, what does it say about you? Oh wait... I did a google search on "scummy" and I'm curious if you meant the 3rd definition found in the Urban Dictionary or the 4th?

And yes, the Urban Dictionary does define "effing" pointing out the censors find it an appropriate alternative. Just like in G-Rated wholesome TV or movies you'll hear "Oh, Fudge!" Do you find that profane? What do you explain to a child then?

Small minded? Actually it's pretty clever! Sometimes the fun in television shows is simply hearing what clever ways the writers slipped by the censors: Two Broke Girls was a favorite for this.

Now IF Flight Crew grow uncomfortable by this particular t-shirt to the point where they want to remove the passenger ... and let's all be clear that it was NOT REPORTED that the passenger was removed .... I think we should all be worried about the mental stability of these highly trained and skilled workers --either flying the plane or there for our safety-- who would appear to lack the emotional competence to perform their duties because they don't like or don't agree with a T-Shirt!

As for "Free Speech," take note that it's not a free-for-all, and there are limits. In an airport, I doubt anyone would make it through TSA with the word BOMB on a T-shirt. Not sure, but I bet a lawyer would confirm that United or ANY business for that matter could simply decide at random one day to refuse service to anyone wearing the color blue. It certainly doesn't violate any rights. And while it's a form of discrimination, it's not a protected form of discrimination. United could impose a dress code, prohibiting any clothing that contains words or characters of any language, and they would be within their rights. Of course they probably would never do this, simply because of the controversy and bad publicity. But they could. Note that in this paragraph I am referring to a company policy vs. a knee-jerk reaction of a single employee in the previous paragraph.

I wonder how many flight crew feel a bit of shame and embarrassment for their company when they confirm in their hand-held device (or don't the FA's have them at United yet) that the passenger wearing the t-shirt is a GS member, supposedly one of their most loyal passengers. Where is the brave FA who sympathizes with the passenger while admitting they wished they could fix it, perhaps asking to take a picture with the intention of forwarding it upwards internally.

New paragraph and new point: ...forwarding it upwards...NOT further shaming the airline on social media. Someone mentioned in another posting here about disgruntled FA's wearing union related pins. I can remember AA FA's grumbling and bad-mouthing the airline while in their jump seat within earshot of passengers. NONE of that is appropriate "free speech," given the airline defines dress code for the uniform AND the FA's were "on duty."

If there are enough GS members who choose to wear these t-shirts, perhaps a national news outlet will pick-up their quiet protest, which is much better that seeing a bloodied passenger forcibly removed as they are dragged from an aircraft.