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Old Nov 22, 2018, 4:01 pm
  #16  
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Originally Posted by findark
but LH is known for being really squirrelly with inventory.
This may be the best explanation.
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Old Nov 22, 2018, 4:36 pm
  #17  
 
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Here's the desired itin at $4268 and correct itin at $8516.

Some thoughts:

1) Hopefully UA is not (re)validating inventory! I'd like to think that LH is doing so (either with native or codeshare FRA-DEL flight) and this is causing ticketing to fail. Married segments have been reported on multi-airline journeys so that is a real possibility.

2) Phantom inventory?

3) UA is not obligated (legally or otherwise) to sell you anything that pops up on its site.
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Old Nov 22, 2018, 5:45 pm
  #18  
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If you have it in Matrix have you tried getting it to price on Matrix PowerTools via Orbitz?

I don't love to book via OTAs but I have had a couple fares where that was the only way to get it done.
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Old Nov 22, 2018, 6:05 pm
  #19  
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Originally Posted by findark
Historically, the multi-city approach worked well for getting around this. If they fixed this on the website, that's very disappointing. I wasn't going to submit cc details so I can't confirm one way or the other, except to confirm that the UA site will go to seat selection with the itinerary priced in D.
.

Thats what I was trying to ask about. Using multi-city in the past hasn’t re-validated prior to purchase with married segments. Think I’ve had something similar (on all UA, in Y though) done within the last year at least.

On the the other hand, Im wondering if this is the same kind of issue I faced a couple of weeks ago trying to book a trip to BLR (with return from TPE), where I got the same error after plugging in my card info, also with an LH connection in FRA. I initially thought it was a ‘you really shouldn’t try booking on the UA site on a Friday night’ Kind of error. I was told a couple of different reasons why it wasn’t working, turns out LH wasn’t confirming their inventory (even though LH had V space on the FRA-BLR flight). I was also really confused because doesn’t it usually tell you something specific about the inventory no longer being available if it’s inventory. I couldn’t figure out if for some reason UA didn’t like the card I gave it, it didn’t like that I had a lap infant on the booking, etc. in my case, an agent eventually did something and left us on the UA segments in V, and somehow had us put in the LH segment in Q, though didn’t charge me anything extra (I was a good little buyer and asked about it, but they said because I was on the phone for an hour and a half with them (and that didnt even include the 3 prior calls), they’d just honor it.

After hearing this story also, I do wonder if it’s soemthng related to LH, as they’re inventory is supposed to be in real time so theoreticallly should be available to book at the moment one is searching.
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Old Nov 22, 2018, 6:24 pm
  #20  
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Originally Posted by emcampbe
After hearing this story also, I do wonder if it’s soemthng related to LH, as they’re inventory is supposed to be in real time so theoreticallly should be available to book at the moment one is searching.
Well, the problem here is that there is no inventory for the married SFO-FRA-DEL segment.
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Old Nov 22, 2018, 7:35 pm
  #21  
 
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Originally Posted by cfischer
That's strange. Looking at UA/LH or UA/UA I am not seeing and D inventory. I wonder if this would sell. Is it a POS restriction perhaps?
Originally Posted by findark
I'm not sure how you priced that gokeeper

I am using US POS, and didn't use any "trick", somehow these 2 segment simply not showing married in my system. Detail here if interested http://img.gd/L5DjoW . Works in multiple GDS http://img.gd/wnS6xK

Last edited by gokeeper; Nov 22, 2018 at 7:45 pm
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Old Nov 23, 2018, 1:42 am
  #22  
 
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Gokeepers' Sabre example matches what EF is showing. Comment #2 invoking EF above used UA codeshare number instead of native LH number, using codeshare number does result in D0.



Not sure why UA was unable to price this, since OP did use native LH number in his quote. Agree with gokeeper that married segment availability is there. OP should have been able to get this ticketed (and save $$$$) through a travel agency. Unfortunately, the DWNC76S fare is no longer available today due to "UNLESS OTHERWISE SPECIFIED TICKETS MUST BE ISSUED ON/BEFORE 22NOV 18", and the current available D-fare is more than double the price, meaning OP probably has lost out on a good price if not ticketed by now.

emcampbe, I agree you might be onto something here, this may warrant a dedicated topic if more reports pour in...

Last edited by mozilla; Nov 23, 2018 at 2:13 am
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Old Nov 23, 2018, 2:20 am
  #23  
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I think part of the differing results are getting caused by actual shifts in inventory. I now see J5 D1 for LH760 when married to the UA inbound and J5 D2 without (not J6, guessing they sold a seat). It also seems like D space was released somewhere during this conversation.

Originally Posted by emcampbe
Thats what I was trying to ask about. Using multi-city in the past hasn’t re-validated prior to purchase with married segments. Think I’ve had something similar (on all UA, in Y though) done within the last year at least.
Best guess, UA validates again at purchase because of the LH native segment. I'm hoping the workaround is still good for all-UA itineraries.
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Old Nov 23, 2018, 2:30 am
  #24  
 
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Note however that gokeeper's first response confirming availability was made less than 2 hours after OP's initial post.

While I'm also certain that inventory has changed in meanwhile (expected for a flight in a week), I'm not sure if the D space wasn't there from the beginning. I think UA's booking engine did find actual D space for OP's query. Why it failed to reserve that space remains a mystery.
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Old Nov 23, 2018, 4:27 am
  #25  
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Originally Posted by Kacee
New term: "Married segment unavailability."
It’s neither a new term nor a new phenomenon. Despite some confusion on this board, married inventory refers to the practice of filing inventory information for itineraries that consist of multiple flights. So, for SFO-IAH-AUS on UA1234 and UA2345, UA will file three sets of relevant inventory: SFO-IAH 1234, IAH-AUS 2345, and SFO-AUS UA1234/UA2345. There is absolutely no guarantee that they have anything in common.

Originally Posted by mozilla
Why it failed to reserve that space remains a mystery.
I don’t think it’s a mystery at all. LH is applying married inventory restrictions that do not get published through to the GDS, and that gets caught when UA attempts to validate the ticket with LH prior to purchase. Specifically, LH marries inventory on overnight itineraries (I think the 1:30 AM departure is being considered as next day) whereas UA (and the GDSes) don’t appear to do so.

I’ve had this exact issue happen to me. There’s no workaround, because ultimately LH is the arbiter of what inventory they want to sell, and it’s an LH inventory check that’s preventing this from pricing.
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Old Nov 23, 2018, 5:11 am
  #26  
 
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Originally Posted by jsloan
I don’t think it’s a mystery at all. LH is applying married inventory restrictions that do not get published through to the GDS, and that gets caught when UA attempts to validate the ticket with LH prior to purchase. Specifically, LH marries inventory on overnight itineraries (I think the 1:30 AM departure is being considered as next day) whereas UA (and the GDSes) don’t appear to do so.

I'd like to think this is the easy acceptable explanation, however, if I understand this correctly, this also implies that a travel agent (say gokeeper in this case) would be unable to book this inventory. If I may generalize the statement, it implies that what a GDS offers to a travel agent isn't the slightest guarantee of actual availability, since an air carrier can deliberately publish fabricated inventory to the GDS, then happily accept/decline whatever it wants when an agent requests a reservation through the GDS. If this is true, airlines wouldn't wait to exploit this in their favor (and to the TA and their customer's detriment).

While I do agree that small fluctuations are possible due to reservations being sold/canceled, it is my understanding that there's no systematic publication of inaccurate information by airlines into a GDS, and that what is offered through a GDS is an indication of actual, unfabricated inventory with the reasonable expectation for an IATA-licensed TA that the airline is willing to honor reservations for the inventory it publishes. However, I may be wrong here, or it might really be an LH thing. Hoping gokeeper or another TA will chime in.

Originally Posted by jsloan
I’ve had this exact issue happen to me. There’s no workaround, because ultimately LH is the arbiter of what inventory they want to sell, and it’s an LH inventory check that’s preventing this from pricing.
I believe the issue that emcampbe encountered is also related to this.
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Old Nov 23, 2018, 10:36 am
  #27  
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@gokeeper rocks and he helped me get the right itin booked and the right price... but! last minute change and my office decided to cancel the trip.
I appreciate everyone's help
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Old Nov 23, 2018, 10:55 am
  #28  
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Originally Posted by justsawaufo
but! last minute change and my office decided to cancel the trip.
That is seriously sad after all that.

David
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Old Nov 23, 2018, 11:24 am
  #29  
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Originally Posted by LBJ
The root issue is with ITA Software's code (used by the UA fare search engine).
I love learning trivia like this. Thanks!
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Old Nov 23, 2018, 2:14 pm
  #30  
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Originally Posted by jsloan
I don’t think it’s a mystery at all. LH is applying married inventory restrictions that do not get published through to the GDS, and that gets caught when UA attempts to validate the ticket with LH prior to purchase. Specifically, LH marries inventory on overnight itineraries (I think the 1:30 AM departure is being considered as next day) whereas UA (and the GDSes) don’t appear to do so.
I did see the lack of D space when querying through EF though, so not entirely sure what will/won't get published. At some point later during this thread, LH released D space on the married itinerary, which I think has inserted quite a bit of confusion (and may have enabled OP to book this trip).

Originally Posted by mozilla
I'd like to think this is the easy acceptable explanation, however, if I understand this correctly, this also implies that a travel agent (say gokeeper in this case) would be unable to book this inventory. If I may generalize the statement, it implies that what a GDS offers to a travel agent isn't the slightest guarantee of actual availability, since an air carrier can deliberately publish fabricated inventory to the GDS, then happily accept/decline whatever it wants when an agent requests a reservation through the GDS. If this is true, airlines wouldn't wait to exploit this in their favor (and to the TA and their customer's detriment).
Hypothesis: Some/all GDS make the assumption during validation that a split-carrier connection will never marry inventory (as I think this is pretty uncommon), and so was missing the fact that LH voided the D space when connecting to a UA flight. The weirdest thing about the inventory report I got is that the D space was voided by marrying the UA segment but the J space was unequal (J5 versus J6). I'm guessing LH would have rejected ticketing if tried before the actual D space release.
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