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New routes SFO-AMS (30 Mar19),EWR-NAP (seasonal 22 May19),EWR-PRG(seasonal 06 June19)

Old Aug 30, 2018, 11:39 am
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Last edit by: WineCountryUA
Originally Posted by JOSECONLSCREW28
SFO-AMS year round 789 begins March 30 Daily
EWR - NAP summer seasonal 763 begins May 22 Daily
EWR - PRG summer seasonal 763 begins June 6 Daily
"Hello, Buongiorno, Ahoj, Hallo!"
United Airlines Announces New Nonstop Service to the Amalfi Coast, the Czech Republic and the Netherlands

August 30, 2018
CHICAGO, Aug. 30, 2018 /PRNewswire/ -- Strengthening the world's most comprehensive route network, United Airlines today announced customers have new international routes to choose from in 2019 including daily, year-round service between San Francisco and Amsterdam and new nonstop seasonal summer service between New York/Newark and Naples, Italy, the only nonstop flight from North America to Naples, as well as New York/Newark and Prague, subject to government approval. Tickets are now available for purchase on united.com or the United app.

"We've built an unparalleled global network and we continuously look for opportunities to make United the first choice for travelers booking flights to Europe and beyond," said Patrick Quayle, United's vice president of International Network. "Whether customers are traveling for business or leisure, United offers more choice than ever before to connect to the places, people and moments that matter most."

New Daily, Year-Round Service Between San Francisco and Amsterdam
Beginning March 30, 2019, United will be the only U.S. carrier to offer nonstop service between San Francisco and Amsterdam and is the airline's fifth nonstop flight to the Netherlands. United currently operates daily, year-round services between Amsterdam and Chicago, Houston, New York/Newark and Washington Dulles.United has operated nonstop service to Amsterdam for more than 25 years and currently offers daily nonstop service between Amsterdam and its hubs in Chicago, Houston, New York/Newark and Washington, D.C.

New Summer Service Between New York/Newark and Naples, Italy
United will be the only carrier offering customers nonstop service between the U.S. and Naples, Italy, beginning May 22, 2019 through Oct. 4, 2019.United's daily, summer service will connect customers traveling from New York/Newark to Naples, Southern Italy's largest city. Visitors to Naples enjoy the city's castles, architecture, art and world-famous cuisine as well as nearby Mount Vesuvius, the volcano that destroyed the nearby Roman town of Pompeii. Naples also serves as a gateway to the Amalfi Coast, a UNESCO World Heritage Site and popular tourist destination.United's new service to Naples will be its sixth nonstop service to Italy and is conveniently timed for connecting customers from more than 60 destinations across the United States.

New Summer Service Between New York/Newark and Prague, Czech Republic
Beginning June 6, 2019 through Oct. 4, 2019, United will offer daily nonstop seasonal service between New York/Newark and Prague, also known as the Golden City, the City of a Hundred Spires and the jewel in the crown of Central Europe. Prague is considered one of Europe's most charming, colorful and beautiful cities and has become one of the most popular destinations in Central Europe. Visitors to Prague enjoy its Old Town Square lined with colorful baroque architecture, Gothic churches and its famous medieval astronomical clock, the Orloj. United's service to Prague is conveniently timed to connect customers from more than 65 destinations across the United States.

Building the world's best global route network
In addition to offering customers new service to Amsterdam, Naples and Prague, United is continuing to build its global network of nearly 360 international destinations in 49 countries. Next year United will resume nonstop seasonal service between eight U.S. airports and more than 20 destinations in Europe, the Caribbean and Mexico including popular destinations like Porto, Portugal; Reykjavik, Iceland; Athens, Greece and Venice, Italy. As previously announced, United will also begin the only nonstop service between Washington Dulles and Tel Aviv, Israel next year.
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New routes SFO-AMS (30 Mar19),EWR-NAP (seasonal 22 May19),EWR-PRG(seasonal 06 June19)

Old Aug 30, 2018, 11:39 am
  #91  
 
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Originally Posted by emcampbe
probably because there’s not enough demand from the west only. If you’re starting SFO-EU somewhere, you need enough traffic from the pacific states and maybe a bit of traffic close enough to the east that it makes a sensible connection. Likewise, if you have a destination in Asia that only has one flight, you’re going to send it from west coast, because someone in Chicago isn’t going to backtrack to say, EWR to catch a flight an asian city, much less someone in SFO.

Part of it is also going to be demographics, and where the pax are coming from. To most EU ports, and not saying that there isn’t some exceptions, there is going to be more of that traffic based on east coast vs. west. If theres enough demand for flights from other hubs also, you can start adding capacity to hubs farther away. Not that there are aren’t people coming from them at all, but you can also connect SFO folks to PRG via EWR, but no one in their right mind would do EWR-SFO-PRG - unless you count the minuscule amount of folks on FT looking at MRs. it also costs a heck of a lot more to route folks on a routing that flying 8000 miles out of the way (says a guy who has twice routed CVG-IAH -YYZ on last minute awards since that was all that was available, ensuring I flew 800+ miles south to get on a flight to YYZ that basically overflies CVG anyway).
I am sure this was a suggestion for an additional route, not replacing East Coast flights.

I think ORD-PRG or LAX-PRG would find their market on both sides very quickly. There are 3,000+ Americans staying in Prague on any given day as tourists (2017 data: https://www.praguecitytourism.cz/fil...rze_en_web.pdf), so am really surprised the connectivity between the US and the Czech Republic is still so limited.
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Old Aug 30, 2018, 11:39 am
  #92  
 
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Originally Posted by DA201

Nope. Boeing advertises the 78J as a "shorter range" twin because the 789 and 788 can both fly farther, but it still has a pretty impressive range at 6,430 mmi. It is far enough for any LAX/SFO/DEN-Europe flight. That being said, UA has said they are flying the 78Js from EWR to Europe.



DEN-CDG is a very good candidate because LH already flies DEN-MUC/FRA and WK flies seasonal DEN-ZRH. Plus, DY flies seasonal DEN-CDG and UA has shown it is willing to compete head to head against DY by starting DEN-LHR and making EWR-FCO year round.


The only year round daily intercontinental flight from ORD on AA is about to be LHR. On the other hand, UA has year round daily AMS/PEK/BRU/FRA/HKG/LHR/MUC/CDG/GRU/PVG/NRT. UA was rumored to be looking at ORD-TLV, but it seems IAD got the route instead. I think the new "UA route" from ORD is ORD-AKL on JV partner NZ.

Plus, UA is starting ORD-BJX in October... isn't that a new international route for ORD?

I wish that UA continued LAX-BJX, but they would run that flight 2x/day, with one being the middle of the day and a late night redeye.
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Old Aug 30, 2018, 11:44 am
  #93  
 
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Originally Posted by williambruno1975


You do realize the net effect of AA’s announcement is a massive reduction at ORD - adding just ATH but cancelling MAN, cancelling PVG, and dropping NRT below acceptable levels (on top of cancelling ORD PEK that was previously announced)

The AMS announcement is far larger because it’ll be UA’s 5th gateway flown year round to AMS, a rival fortress hub (SFO IAH ORD IAD EWR)

Compare that to AA to AMS, which is barely PHL year round + DFW seasonal
Again, I'm not comparing UA to AA. Please don't make it into that. My point is, Chicago's hometown airline, has not seen any love and the one route that they could've added seasonal was ORD-ATH.
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Old Aug 30, 2018, 11:53 am
  #94  
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With DEN in play, I am curious, if this is not a time to review the LAX-EU potential, e.g. LAX-FRA?
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Old Aug 30, 2018, 12:53 pm
  #95  
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Originally Posted by EWR764
There aren't any toes to step on... LH and UA are essentially one and the same when it comes to TATL service, since revenue is shared and pricing/capacity/route decisions are coordinated. A second DEN-FRA frequency seems to be the prohibitive favorite, likely an earlier departure in both directions to time with LH's first omnidirectional departure bank. The current schedule meets the early afternoon longhaul departures (like India) but there is a ~10am bank with a bunch of other connections, including Central Europe, ME and North Africa.
UA briefly tried DEN-FRA (or was it MUC?) then pulled out. I honestly don't see two widebodies-worth of demand to FRA (even with connecting pax). Maybe only in the summer; and, yes, an earlier departure ex-DEN would be fabulous. The current LH schedule typically means I wouldn't reach ARN until 6/7pm, and I still have 4-5 hours of travel after that. (It's also why I avoid BA's DEN-LHR unless it's significantly cheaper.)
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Old Aug 30, 2018, 1:06 pm
  #96  
 
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Originally Posted by pseudoswede
UA briefly tried DEN-FRA (or was it MUC?) then pulled out. I honestly don't see two widebodies-worth of demand to FRA (even with connecting pax). Maybe only in the summer; and, yes, an earlier departure ex-DEN would be fabulous. The current LH schedule typically means I wouldn't reach ARN until 6/7pm, and I still have 4-5 hours of travel after that. (It's also why I avoid BA's DEN-LHR unless it's significantly cheaper.)
I think DEN-FRA was a seasonal add for UA in Summer 2001, launched at the same time as year-round LH service, which didn't come back for 2002. The local market certainly has changed a lot (and grown) since then.

By all accounts, DEN has been successful for LH, and so the time may be right for a go at a seasonal 2nd frequency to FRA.
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Old Aug 30, 2018, 2:35 pm
  #97  
 
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Originally Posted by cesco.g
With DEN in play, I am curious, if this is not a time to review the LAX-EU potential, e.g. LAX-FRA?
All of the recent adds to West Coast-Europe have been ex-SFO. I think it seems pretty clear that UA is not going to add many (any?!) international routes ex-LAX in the near future, despite what past rumors may have been. Giving up on LAX-SIN after 1 year is a pretty good indication of the level of tolerance they have for seeing how things pan out there. They were pretty quick to pull the plug on the second LAX-LHR frequency as well, IIRC.
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Old Aug 30, 2018, 2:50 pm
  #98  
 
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Originally Posted by PsiFighter37
Giving up on LAX-SIN after 1 year is a pretty good indication of the level of tolerance they have for seeing how things pan out there. They were pretty quick to pull the plug on the second LAX-LHR frequency as well, IIRC.
Despite the narrative ("UA can't compete at LAX", that was my initial thought too), I have it on good authority it had as much to do with performance as anything else, and perhaps more so. UA just doesn't have the right airplane for LAX-SIN... the 789 took a significant payload hit to operate the route reliably. This competes with the opportunity cost of using the frame on a 2nd SFO frequency, which can operate with a better payload and offer more connection options (with 2 daily flights at different times). It's the same reason SQ can fly the standard A359 on SIN-SFO but is waiting for the 900ULR for LAX service. 300nm makes a difference, especially that far on the margin.

If it were all about poor returns to SIN, UA could have dropped the route entirely, not replaced it with another expensive ULH route, and redeployed the frame elsewhere in the system on a less risky sector.
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Old Aug 30, 2018, 3:30 pm
  #99  
 
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when I visit PRG every summer I am surprised at how many U.S. Americans visit, including myself. I recall DL flies there and could only conclude UA was missing out on some good revenue. Well here we go!

and yes why not BUD too? I think AA is flying there now offering seasonal summer service.
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Old Aug 30, 2018, 11:33 pm
  #100  
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Originally Posted by EWR764
Despite the narrative ("UA can't compete at LAX", that was my initial thought too), I have it on good authority it had as much to do with performance as anything else, and perhaps more so. UA just doesn't have the right airplane for LAX-SIN... the 789 took a significant payload hit to operate the route reliably. This competes with the opportunity cost of using the frame on a 2nd SFO frequency, which can operate with a better payload and offer more connection options (with 2 daily flights at different times). It's the same reason SQ can fly the standard A359 on SIN-SFO but is waiting for the 900ULR for LAX service. 300nm makes a difference, especially that far on the margin.
It's kind of a headscratcher that 300nm seem to make such a difference !? - not questioning your assessment though, EWR764.
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Old Aug 31, 2018, 2:30 am
  #101  
 
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Originally Posted by usbusinesstraveller

Delta’s route announcement included a second daily NYC-TLV. That’s copying UA.
That’s hardly copying UA when they are resuming their second frequency for the summer like in past years based on current market dynamics.
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Old Aug 31, 2018, 3:16 am
  #102  
 
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Great to see an AMS-West Coast flight! I was bummed when DL started AMS-LAX as I thought UA could have fit well on that route to compete with KL.
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Old Aug 31, 2018, 6:05 am
  #103  
 
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Originally Posted by cesco.g
It's kind of a headscratcher that 300nm seem to make such a difference !? - not questioning your assessment though, EWR764.
At the extreme margin of the airplane’s range, it makes a difference. You’re basically trading seats for fuel, at that point, so every little bit counts, and 300nm is material both in terms of distance and in its effect on P&L.

The 789 is an incredibly capable airplane, but it has its economical limits.
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Old Aug 31, 2018, 8:59 am
  #104  
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Originally Posted by cesco.g
It's kind of a headscratcher that 300nm seem to make such a difference !? - not questioning your assessment though, EWR764.
As EWR764 indicated, the plane is at its max. Top it of that the great circle distance is always going to be less than what actually gets flown due to takeoff and landing maneuvers, getting routed around weather, headwinds, the plane will have to be at max fuel load but less than max weight in order to reliably and safely make each flight.

David
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Old Sep 1, 2018, 4:30 am
  #105  
 
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So glad to see NAP in the UA route map. I am just wondering if there is enough demand for this skinny route
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