Expansion of Israel Service

Old Mar 26, 18, 10:09 pm
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Originally Posted by worldwidedreamer View Post
IAH-TVL almost has to fly over ORD. Chicago makes more sense.
I am not sure when flying over another hub without service has stopped UA from starting a new service.

I would love TLV from IAH, but I know it's extremely unlikely, but flying over ORD doesn't really mean anything.
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Old Mar 26, 18, 10:48 pm
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In addition, while the Jewish population of Chicago metro area is slightly smaller than that of San Francisco or Los Angeles, it is concentrated near O'Hare itself (NW side and NW suburbs). Dunno if that makes a big difference but makes sense to me.
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Old Mar 27, 18, 7:25 am
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At this point, ORD-TLV would most likely launch with a 777 since itís not a 787 domicile. Thatís a lot of seats to fill on a new route in a market UA has already grown significantly in the last two years.

I think itís quite possible, but probably not imminent. Maybe a Summer 2019 launch?
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Old Mar 27, 18, 9:53 am
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ORD-TLV would be a nice add. Certainly there's a significant O/D component, as well there is likely a desire to shift some connecting traffic out of EWR onto ORD if possible to improve EWR's performance. I don't know if it justifies a 777. Maybe a 788 would do the trick.
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Old Mar 27, 18, 9:56 am
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ORD-TLV is well within the range of a 763.

Originally Posted by EWR764 View Post
At this point, ORD-TLV would most likely launch with a 777 since itís not a 787 domicile.
Originally Posted by entropy View Post
I don't know if it justifies a 777. Maybe a 788 would do the trick.
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Old Mar 27, 18, 9:58 am
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Would it be within the range of a 763?
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Old Mar 27, 18, 10:02 am
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ORD-TLV = 6180 NM.

I can't find a single source that has a 767-300ER with a Max range of over 6000. Maybe someone can provide a link to show that it is within range.
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Old Mar 27, 18, 10:07 am
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Originally Posted by 764toHI View Post
ORD-TLV is well within the range of a 763.
Originally Posted by segiddins View Post
Would it be within the range of a 763?

A ~5400nm (approx. 12h) sector is at the very far end of the envelope for a 767-300ER, and would be UA's longest-ever scheduled 767 route by a considerable margin.

ORD-TLV would likely launch with a 772ER or 787.

Originally Posted by chermorg View Post
ORD-TLV = 6180 NM.
6180sm. I don't think the 30/184 763ER would make it westbound without considerable weight restrictions.
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Last edited by EWR764; Mar 27, 18 at 10:13 am
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Old Mar 27, 18, 10:14 am
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Originally Posted by threeoh View Post
In addition, while the Jewish population of Chicago metro area is slightly smaller than that of San Francisco or Los Angeles, it is concentrated near O'Hare itself (NW side and NW suburbs). Dunno if that makes a big difference but makes sense to me.
I don't see the exact geographic distribution as a critical issue, the real question is population numbers in the area that uses ORD as their primary departure airport and if those who travel to TLV are loyal to whatever route they're currently using. They need to get to ORD for all sorts of flights and in this case those in the NW burbs can have the worst travel to the airport in the area. My friends in Skokie and Niles complain bitterly about the lack of convenient public transportation and whether you're driving surface roads or doing the Edens to the Kennedy loop traffic can be a bear.
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Old Mar 27, 18, 10:15 am
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Originally Posted by EWR764 View Post
A ~5400nm (approx. 12h) sector is at the very far end of the envelope for a 767-300ER

6180sm. I don't think the 30/184 763ER would make it westbound without considerable weight restrictions.
Lovely units. Thanks for the correction there. Within max range, but not within scope and min-fuel requirements most likely for this route unless restricted westbound. Alternatively, they could run it on some form of circle route with the return passing through EWR or IAD when it would normally need to be weight restricted.. but they might as well use one of the 787s they rotate through ORD to run the route at that point.
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Old Mar 27, 18, 11:38 am
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Why not

Originally Posted by EWR764 View Post
At this point, ORD-TLV would most likely launch with a 777 since itís not a 787 domicile. Thatís a lot of seats to fill on a new route in a market UA has already grown significantly in the last two years.

I think itís quite possible, but probably not imminent. Maybe a Summer 2019 launch?
why couldnít they use 767s on the ORD-TLV route ? They used to use 767s on the EWR-IST route and they use 767s on the EWR-ATH route.
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Old Mar 27, 18, 11:55 am
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Originally Posted by gpicur View Post
why couldn’t they use 767s on the ORD-TLV route ? They used to use 767s on the EWR-IST route and they use 767s on the EWR-ATH route.
ORD-TLV is 20+% longer

map from http://www.gcmap.com/
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Old Mar 27, 18, 2:19 pm
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Originally Posted by gpicur View Post


why couldnít they use 767s on the ORD-TLV route ? They used to use 767s on the EWR-IST route and they use 767s on the EWR-ATH route.
If memory serves right, Continental had specially equipped 777s for this route. Again (and this might be a decade out of date) if this is correct would it make more sense to use a 787 just because of fleet commonality with SFO?
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Old Mar 27, 18, 3:46 pm
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Originally Posted by BThumme View Post
Houston would be more logical IMO as it's also a bit of a tech hub with IAH and the AUS area.
AUS is certainly heavy tech but IAH not so much which is rather very heavy Oil & Gas instead..
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Old Mar 27, 18, 3:57 pm
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Originally Posted by nunusguy View Post
AUS is certainly heavy tech but IAH not so much which is rather very heavy Oil & Gas instead..
AUS-IAH-TLV is a longer-haul premium product international than ORD-TLV (10 hour flight time vs likely 11.5 or so for IAH-TLV), and a shorter domestic hop.

If we're talking about AUS, having been on AUS-IAH and AUS-ORD (and vice versa) multiple times and eyeballing the passengers and load factors.. I'm pretty certain that AUS-IAH could support connections to a TLV, whereas AUS-ORD would need more frequency or more 739s. That being said, AUS is probably about 1% of the equation (if even that) as to the hub to get a new TLV flight.
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