mherdeg

Tomorrow morning's 6:15am BOS-SFO is booked 16/28 in business class, with zero revenue passengers on the upgrade list, and with J9 inventory.

Revenue inventory is naturally wide open (J9 … P9 … Y9 … XN9) except for a few noticeable zeroes:
R0
I0

So if you're flying on an afternoon BOS-SFO and want to fly earlier, you can SDC onto this flight, but under United's rules you cannot waitlist an RPU/GPU on the flight, even though there is no reason to think it wouldn't clear. You can SDC, but it guarantees coach. This seems kind of silly with a wide-open J cabin.

dparkinson

You can at the airport.

Miggles

If you need F that badly, then just pay the TOD upgrade at check in for whatever flight you change to. It would probably be cheaper than burning an RPU/GPU for such a flight, and would save you a lot of aggravation (which has to be worth something).

Kacee

The real unfairness here is that UA no longer opens R at T-24 in these situations.

Remember when that used to happen as a matter of course?

sfo789

Agree this is a bit annoying when it's obvious R "should" open, but I'm struggling to establish why this is a issue. You know it'll go R9 at T-2 unless UA somehow manages to sell a shocking number of ToDs overnight. Just call in and apply the RPU to clear into open R on your way to the airport in the morning.

Of course, there is talk of instrument usage being disallowed within T-3 but I haven't encountered that rule in a while from phone agents and, as dparkinson points out, the airport can always override it.

The real RM problem here from an upgrade-clearing perspective is not the wide-open-in-J flights but PS flights that are (say) J6 and go to J2 on the back of ToDs while R stays shut till you're at the gate.

mherdeg

The last few times I tried to do this (in March 2017) I had roughly ten phone agents as well as several airport agents tell me that it was impossible to apply an RPU/GPU within a few hours of a flight's departure to confirm available R inventory.

This was on domestic sectors. Phone agents cited a new "3 hour" guidance that they have been given that you may not claim confirmable upgrade inventory with an instrument (RPU/GPU/miles) within 3 hours of travel. I tried talking to about ten phone agents for two separate flights (both an R1 777-200 SFO-BOS and an R7 777-200 SFO-ORD), in both cases rebooked because of irrops (but could have SDC'd too!) and trying to upgrade about 2 hours before departure. I tried some HUACA and some fairly long conversations and had no luck.

Maybe there was some kind of short-lived experiment in March 2017 that has since been rolled back. I don't know whether sniping R is still possible (I have not tried it since then). I'm kind of wary to experiment with a live itinerary tho.

Kacee

I'm struggling to see how you could not spot the problem.

First, is the fact that many of us can't wait until T-2 to change our flights. It basically means you have to leave for the airport prior to making the change, and hope everything works out. By contrast, you used to be able to reliably SDC into open R right at T-24 on ps flights. That was an awesome FT trick and many of us miss it badly.

Second, the open J seats that were there at T-24 may all have been sold for $299 by T-2.

Third, UA does not always open R at T-2.

Finally, there are numerous recent reports of agents refusing to clear instruments into R inside T-3.

johnden

I have a sneaky feeling the T-3 no instrument rule is a result of folks that claim "upgrade shenanigans." I've witnessed at least 2 arguments at the gate over upgrade space.

Once a passenger was # 1 on the CPU list and the flight had 2 open F seats at T-60min. That person could not understand why 2 new passengers "magically" appeared on the confirmed list without being at the top of the waiting list. The reason was upgrade instruments.

A cautionary tale. While it is nice to be able to "snatch" upgrades at the airport ahead of CPU waitlisters, maybe we should be a bit more cautious when complaining about another passenger doing the same "shenanigans".

sfo789

I had the same experience and indeed posted about it in March iirc. Since ~June, though, I haven't faced issues applying an RPU into R within T-3. Maybe I've gotten lucky 4-5x in a row on separate days but I sort of assumed either UA had given up on the rule or realised why it was a bad idea.

Additionally, the apply-at-airport option has always been available and ime still is, even relatively close to departure.

mherdeg

That's super interesting, thanks. Will see if I can find a way to experiment with this later this week.

Huh, I have never successfully applied an RPU/GPU to an itinerary at the airport. That's really interesting to know that it works tho. What kind of agents can do this -- pre-security check in, centralized CS, club attendants, gate agents, someone else? I have tried with gate agents and they have said they don't know how to do it. (Circa 2011 I was able to apply SWUs at the airport with the help of Club agents and, at an outstation, contract check-in agents.)

NeoOfTheCRS

The "apply for upgrade at the airport" means that upgrades will be sold aggressively to anyone with cash and you will sit on and expire on the upgrade list.

I am ok if they either decided to sell TODs to elites first and everyone else later, but this likely spells the end of T-24 upgrades unless they can't sell them as TODs

sfo789

UC is the best place, or else the service desk (ex. at SFO I've always had success at the desk by 82). Never tried landside or with a GA.

Would be interested to see how you fare with a phone agent and/or at the airport itself.

Kacee

No question it is designed to prevent queue jumping. Because UA's systems can't process upgrades dynamically such that #1 in line automatically gets the upgrade, they have to implement rules like this to prevent FT'ers from calling in and snagging the open R before UA can run a sweep.

docbert

You can't waitlist a NEW RPU, but if you've already waitlisted and then SDC onto that flight, your waitlist will follow.

So if you were on a later flight and wanted to move to this flight, just make sure you waitlist the RPU before the 24 hour mark for the original flight, and when you SDC you'll be on the list.

Or as others have said, do it at the airport.

mherdeg

I looked at this fairly closely; ultimately the 6:15am BOS-SFO (booked 16/28 in J) went from R0 to R9 some time after 4:37am and before 4:46am. Probably a T-90 thing. Would be a little dicey for SDC & re-apply RPU, but it's nice to know how things work these days.