Baby Almost Dies Due to Airplane Temperature
Jun 27, 2017, 11:11 am
#46
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: KEWR
Programs: Marriott Platinum
Posts: 794
It's usually 10-15 degrees warmer in the cockpit than it is in the cabin. I found it comical that people buy in to the fact the pilots are willing to sweat their butts off to save on APU fuel costs. Folks, that's just not the case.
Passenger (pilot comfort) takes precedence over fuel savings. Always has, always will...
It's been a long time since I've flown a CRJ. I remember the APU always struggled to cool the airplane, that unfortunately is a systems limitation. Near impossible to cool the plane with the door open...
Passenger (pilot comfort) takes precedence over fuel savings. Always has, always will...
It's been a long time since I've flown a CRJ. I remember the APU always struggled to cool the airplane, that unfortunately is a systems limitation. Near impossible to cool the plane with the door open...
Jun 27, 2017, 11:46 am
#47
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: MFR
Programs: UA 1K 1.9MM, Hilton Gold, Marriott Gold
Posts: 2,879
Jun 27, 2017, 11:58 am
#48
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: ATL
Programs: DL DM, Hyatt LT DM, Wyndham DM, Hertz PC, HH Gold, SPG Gold, Marriott Gold
Posts: 2,038
wow...
Jun 27, 2017, 1:21 pm
#49
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: PHL
Programs: UA 1K 1MM, Marriott Gold, IHG Platinum, Raddison Platinum, Avis Presidents Club
Posts: 5,265
I realize the APU has limitations but can't the pilot start up an engine or two? wouldn't that provide enough power to cool the entire aircraft? Ofcourse that would burn up more fuel/money
Jun 27, 2017, 1:32 pm
#50
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 38,410
Besides, there's a better way to do it: Make the airline owe the passengers say $1/minute when the cabin temperature exceeds some threshold. Nothing cancelled but they're pressured to fix it pronto.
Jun 27, 2017, 2:03 pm
#51
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Houston
Programs: UA Plat, Marriott Gold
Posts: 12,686
And if it's a limitation of the packs, more power doesn't do you any good.
Jun 27, 2017, 2:14 pm
#52
Join Date: Dec 2014
Programs: UA GS ,QF Plat
Posts: 686
It's usually 10-15 degrees warmer in the cockpit than it is in the cabin. I found it comical that people buy in to the fact the pilots are willing to sweat their butts off to save on APU fuel costs. Folks, that's just not the case.
Passenger (pilot comfort) takes precedence over fuel savings. Always has, always will...
It's been a long time since I've flown a CRJ. I remember the APU always struggled to cool the airplane, that unfortunately is a systems limitation. Near impossible to cool the plane with the door open...
Passenger (pilot comfort) takes precedence over fuel savings. Always has, always will...
It's been a long time since I've flown a CRJ. I remember the APU always struggled to cool the airplane, that unfortunately is a systems limitation. Near impossible to cool the plane with the door open...
Jun 27, 2017, 3:53 pm
#53
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: BNA
Programs: HH Gold. (Former) UA PP, DL PM, PC Plat
Posts: 8,178
Even if they could, the engines at ground-idle don't provide enough air pressure to keep the cabins cool. The APU does a better job on the ground.
Lots of people are saying that the airplanes are hot because we are supposed to save money and not run the APU but our manuals say otherwise. Comfort comes second only to safety.
The order of operating priorities, straight from our flight manual, are:
1. Safe
2. Comfortable
3. On-time
4. Efficient
Jun 27, 2017, 3:55 pm
#54
Join Date: Feb 2008
Programs: 6 year GS, now 2MM Jeff-ugee, *wood LTPlt, SkyPeso PLT
Posts: 6,526
In my experience this is post-merger change for the worse that remains till this day. In my experience pmUA normally ran the APU at the gate and taxi out, keeping the cabin comfortably cool. Time and time again I recall flying on CO metal with sweat running down my back as we baked during boarding and taxi. Name your airport, always the same experience. The CO answer to the problem was to ask passengers to lower their window shades on arrival so the plane would be “cool” for the next flight. Eventually it must have become SOP across both UA and CO metal to only use ground power where available. However with crews always pressed for time it's somehow lower on their checklist while sitting at the gate. Often boarding has been running for 20 or more minutes before the ground AC is connected.
I complain about the hot cabin temperature to Customer Care and in surveys every time it happens. It’s going to take someone having a resulting health issue on board for United to react. While boarding a recent steam jet, the FA at the door saw my reaction and said with an eye roll “It costs money to run the AC” as she fanned herself with a safety card. It’s been proven over and over that hot temperatures can make people irritable — last thing you want on a plane.
In contrast I have boarded an AA321 in PHX on a 95 degree day and the cabin was icy cold. Sometimes the simple things aren't simple at United.
I complain about the hot cabin temperature to Customer Care and in surveys every time it happens. It’s going to take someone having a resulting health issue on board for United to react. While boarding a recent steam jet, the FA at the door saw my reaction and said with an eye roll “It costs money to run the AC” as she fanned herself with a safety card. It’s been proven over and over that hot temperatures can make people irritable — last thing you want on a plane.
In contrast I have boarded an AA321 in PHX on a 95 degree day and the cabin was icy cold. Sometimes the simple things aren't simple at United.
Jun 27, 2017, 4:38 pm
#56
Join Date: Apr 2011
Programs: WN, AA, UA, DL
Posts: 1,313
Sounds like Trans States and UA did everything they could. Once again a fake news story. What was good service is spun as bad service because it's an airline. The ultimate kicker is that the mother GOT BACK ON the known warm plane. Stupid. That baby should have stayed in the cool terminal and gotten attention.
We almost had to divert on one of my recent mainline DL flights. It was uncomfortably warm on the plane, and on the ground the air simply wasn't enough to cool it down. And to top it off, we had a small delay at the gate for a mechanical issue, so we sat and warmed the plane even more. Once we got into the air, the passenger directly front of me got very overheated. He was in his early 20s and in the middle of a big life changing move, so that didn't help. It all compounded to where he was very visibly not doing well. The crew brought ice and kept monitoring him, keeping help ready in case he got worse. The pilots were notified of the situation and that a divert might be necessary. Thankfully he cooled down and felt better, allowing the flight to continue as planned.
We almost had to divert on one of my recent mainline DL flights. It was uncomfortably warm on the plane, and on the ground the air simply wasn't enough to cool it down. And to top it off, we had a small delay at the gate for a mechanical issue, so we sat and warmed the plane even more. Once we got into the air, the passenger directly front of me got very overheated. He was in his early 20s and in the middle of a big life changing move, so that didn't help. It all compounded to where he was very visibly not doing well. The crew brought ice and kept monitoring him, keeping help ready in case he got worse. The pilots were notified of the situation and that a divert might be necessary. Thankfully he cooled down and felt better, allowing the flight to continue as planned.
Jun 27, 2017, 8:45 pm
#58
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Denver, CO, USA
Programs: Sometimes known as [ARG:6 UNDEFINED]
Posts: 26,674
No. The ground crews can't service and load the aircraft with engines running. It wouldn't be safe.
Even if they could, the engines at ground-idle don't provide enough air pressure to keep the cabins cool. The APU does a better job on the ground.
Lots of people are saying that the airplanes are hot because we are supposed to save money and not run the APU but our manuals say otherwise. Comfort comes second only to safety.
The order of operating priorities, straight from our flight manual, are:
1. Safe
2. Comfortable
3. On-time
4. Efficient
Even if they could, the engines at ground-idle don't provide enough air pressure to keep the cabins cool. The APU does a better job on the ground.
Lots of people are saying that the airplanes are hot because we are supposed to save money and not run the APU but our manuals say otherwise. Comfort comes second only to safety.
The order of operating priorities, straight from our flight manual, are:
1. Safe
2. Comfortable
3. On-time
4. Efficient
Jun 27, 2017, 9:00 pm
#59
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 3,361
Pilots have the final say on using the APU and making other decisions about the operation of the aircraft that impact passenger comfort.
Jun 27, 2017, 9:16 pm
#60
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Denver, CO, USA
Programs: Sometimes known as [ARG:6 UNDEFINED]
Posts: 26,674
Thanks for sharing a new perspective. I don't think we've heard any of those points before. However, since pilots don't configure airplanes, your thoughts are not relevant.
Pilots have the final say on using the APU and making other decisions about the operation of the aircraft that impact passenger comfort.
Pilots have the final say on using the APU and making other decisions about the operation of the aircraft that impact passenger comfort.
You can try to say that this incident should only be seen in an isolated lens. That's not how most people are going to integrate this into their overall thinkng.
I stand by my statement. Comfort and UA are not particularly congruent in 2017. When a pilot makes a claim that "comfort" is second on the priority list, I will push back, because as a customer, I just don't see it.