Creating a Premium Brand -- What "is" United?
May 19, 2017, 4:55 pm
#61
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Verdi, NV, SFO & Olympic (aka Squaw )Valley.
Programs: Ikon Pass Full + AS Gold + Marriott Titanium + Hilton Gold. Recovering UA Plat. LT lounge AA+DL+UA
Posts: 3,822
If I were running UA, I'd be more worried of the domestic competitors like B6/AS+VX/WN which offer more compelling Y experiences for most pax.
A few anecdotes:
•Flying UA E+ to LA last Friday, and VX Main Cabin back up Sunday, it was no competition VX offered a better product. With more SFO AS+VX destinations, I'm tempted.
•On my winter weekly flights OAK-RNO the WN 737 had only one weakness compared to a UA RJ...which Amex solved this week with access to the OAK Escape lounge. On this route WN is usually 1/3 the price of UA.
•As a Gold or Plat my upgrade position always seems to be just a few folks back from F.
•And finally my Presidential Plus card fee as a LT Club member might go from $99 to $450.
For me the net/net is that the UA value proposition keeps on attenuating. Even though I love so many people at our SFO base, and want to continue flying my chosen airline, it is hard to consistently pay more and get less.
May 19, 2017, 7:06 pm
#62
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 57,502
While the extensive commentary on Delta is indicative of the strong connection the brand has made with certain market segments, Delta's brand shouldn't have an influence on United's brand, or lack thereof. Branding of commodities is not about positioning relative to competitors.
Why is competitive brand positioning important?
I can’t think of any business that doesn’t compete with something (another company, a changing market, emerging technology, etc.) And in order to effectively compete, you must understand what you’re competing against for whom, and how best to position your brand to leverage your strengths and take advantage of market opportunities.
Without a competitive brand positioning, your brand might only remain a conceptual vision or a set of cultural values which sound great but don’t really make a difference in the marketplace. A meaningful, powerful, valuable brand is based a clear, crisp articulation of your competitive strategy.
How do you develop a competitive brand positioning?
In-depth knowledge of your target, your competitors, and your own business enables you to define a strong positioning. Use rigorous market research and competitive intelligence to uncover new insights and develop a proprietary point of view about the market opportunities and competitive landscape (see my research and competitive landscape map tools). You also need a fresh and objective assessment and analysis of your own company’s capabilities, resources, and assets (a brand diagnostic can help.)
I can’t think of any business that doesn’t compete with something (another company, a changing market, emerging technology, etc.) And in order to effectively compete, you must understand what you’re competing against for whom, and how best to position your brand to leverage your strengths and take advantage of market opportunities.
Without a competitive brand positioning, your brand might only remain a conceptual vision or a set of cultural values which sound great but don’t really make a difference in the marketplace. A meaningful, powerful, valuable brand is based a clear, crisp articulation of your competitive strategy.
How do you develop a competitive brand positioning?
In-depth knowledge of your target, your competitors, and your own business enables you to define a strong positioning. Use rigorous market research and competitive intelligence to uncover new insights and develop a proprietary point of view about the market opportunities and competitive landscape (see my research and competitive landscape map tools). You also need a fresh and objective assessment and analysis of your own company’s capabilities, resources, and assets (a brand diagnostic can help.)
All of the A320/A319's have lost Channel 9. None of the 738's have channel 9. None of the 739's have channel 9. None of the sCO 752/753 have channel 9. None of the 788/799 have channel 9. The only aircraft that have added channel 9 since the merger are the sCO 764, the sCO 772, and the 773. How do you get "increasing percentage" out of this?
Last edited by halls120; May 19, 2017 at 7:15 pm
May 19, 2017, 7:54 pm
#63
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 3,361
Despite attempts at creating correlation, how a customer perceives Delta and how a customer perceives United can be mutually exclusive.
May 19, 2017, 9:20 pm
#64
Join Date: Apr 2011
Programs: WN, AA, UA, DL
Posts: 1,313
All of the A320/A319's have lost Channel 9. None of the 738's have channel 9. None of the 739's have channel 9. None of the sCO 752/753 have channel 9. None of the 788/799 have channel 9. The only aircraft that have added channel 9 since the merger are the sCO 764, the sCO 772, and the 773. How do you get "increasing percentage" out of this?
May 19, 2017, 10:49 pm
#65
Join Date: Jan 2013
Programs: Mileage Plus
Posts: 186
If I fly in a premium cabin, I am happy to fly United. If I fly economy, especially now that I have lost my United status, I seek out an airline like Jet Blue, Virgin American or Hawaiian Air because my perception is that they treat "no status, back of the bus" pax better than UA, DL, or AA.
Giving redeemable miles for flying is getting to be a joke. I get far more miles on credit card offers and credit card spends. And I am beginning to think that Chase's travel card points are better used for Hyatt than United.
Giving redeemable miles for flying is getting to be a joke. I get far more miles on credit card offers and credit card spends. And I am beginning to think that Chase's travel card points are better used for Hyatt than United.
May 20, 2017, 7:20 am
#66
Join Date: Feb 2008
Programs: 6 year GS, now 2MM Jeff-ugee, *wood LTPlt, SkyPeso PLT
Posts: 6,526
Comparing product attributes (e.g. posting self-determined seat widths in many, many threads) is quite different from competitive brand positioning, an internal marketing analysis.
Despite attempts at creating correlation, how a customer perceives Delta and how a customer perceives United can be mutually exclusive.
Despite attempts at creating correlation, how a customer perceives Delta and how a customer perceives United can be mutually exclusive.
And product attributes directly lead to branding. VX has branded itself as "hip" and well, the onboard product matches that description. But they have also branded themselves as "comfortable" (as has b6). They reinforce this message in advertisements, graphics, etc. Why do they do this? Well they have wider seats in Y (18") as a result of having airbus vs.Boeing equipment, and they have also selected a better pitch (32") and have more padding on the seats.
I would personally rather take a VX seat in Y on a TCON over any plane that United has flying TCON at this point (other than the odd international 772/763). (But I would rather take Delta Comfort on their airbus, especially the A321, vs. VX in Y) That is product attributes lining up with branding.
United's problem is that the branding is something that people at United basically pulled out of their you know what. It has nothing to do with the experience or product United actually offers.
Actually flying United is more likely to result in cognitive dissonance rather than reinforcing the brand messages.
If I fly in a premium cabin, I am happy to fly United. If I fly economy, especially now that I have lost my United status, I seek out an airline like Jet Blue, Virgin American or Hawaiian Air because my perception is that they treat "no status, back of the bus" pax better than UA, DL, or AA.
Giving redeemable miles for flying is getting to be a joke. I get far more miles on credit card offers and credit card spends. And I am beginning to think that Chase's travel card points are better used for Hyatt than United.
Giving redeemable miles for flying is getting to be a joke. I get far more miles on credit card offers and credit card spends. And I am beginning to think that Chase's travel card points are better used for Hyatt than United.
BTB, I agree that the mileage program at this point no longer drives the buying decision like it used to given how watered down the benefits have become.
May 20, 2017, 8:25 am
#67
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 1,123
The biggest issue with these carriers, and even WN to a certain extent, is that depending on travel patterns, one may not be able to use them, as you mention - they only have certain routes. If you are outside some of the biggest US metro's, there's no way. And anything internationally beyond Mexico and Carribean (AS still serves YVR, I think, and that's all for Canada, too) and you can't use these guys.
Take me - I'm in CVG - I'd say its a pretty standard mid-size city. WN is coming back next month - they last flew out of here before I moved and started coming here - that's over 10 years (pushed out by DL at the time - though given DLs much lower presence here now, and the expansion with ULCCs, doubtful that will happen this time) - with two nonstop routes (BWI/MDW). Not big enough for Virgin and Alaska. So that makes it a non-starter for me. WN, even if they had flown here prior couldn't get a good potion of my business because they don't fly to the other end of where I go much of the time (much of my travel is to YYZ, for example). I have no choice but to use a legacy - I do a host of domestic travel, but also to Canada and often a trip to India every year. That leaves me without a lot of options aside from the legacies - as I need a carrier that flies domestically, to Canada and TATL/TPAC. I suppose I could split my business, but until next month, WN isn't an option (unless I want to drive to another airport), and AS/Virgin aren't an option either because I would have to go even further (I'd guess ORD is the closest destination they serve, though would have to check).
While I get why these carriers focus on the larger metros - there are a lot of mid-size/smaller metro's where a lot of people live, the combined population may be even more vs. the big metro's (I'm not sure)....just not all in the same place. If there was a way to target people in cities like mine, then yes, they could be a good alternative. Until then, there's a large chunk of the US population that these carriers will never have a shot at their business.
Take me - I'm in CVG - I'd say its a pretty standard mid-size city. WN is coming back next month - they last flew out of here before I moved and started coming here - that's over 10 years (pushed out by DL at the time - though given DLs much lower presence here now, and the expansion with ULCCs, doubtful that will happen this time) - with two nonstop routes (BWI/MDW). Not big enough for Virgin and Alaska. So that makes it a non-starter for me. WN, even if they had flown here prior couldn't get a good potion of my business because they don't fly to the other end of where I go much of the time (much of my travel is to YYZ, for example). I have no choice but to use a legacy - I do a host of domestic travel, but also to Canada and often a trip to India every year. That leaves me without a lot of options aside from the legacies - as I need a carrier that flies domestically, to Canada and TATL/TPAC. I suppose I could split my business, but until next month, WN isn't an option (unless I want to drive to another airport), and AS/Virgin aren't an option either because I would have to go even further (I'd guess ORD is the closest destination they serve, though would have to check).
While I get why these carriers focus on the larger metros - there are a lot of mid-size/smaller metro's where a lot of people live, the combined population may be even more vs. the big metro's (I'm not sure)....just not all in the same place. If there was a way to target people in cities like mine, then yes, they could be a good alternative. Until then, there's a large chunk of the US population that these carriers will never have a shot at their business.
May 20, 2017, 8:54 am
#68
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jul 1999
Location: ORD/MDW
Programs: BA/AA/AS/B6/WN/ UA/HH/MR and more like 'em but most felicitously & importantly MUCCI
Posts: 19,718
- Buddy / neighbor
- Guru / mentor / role model
- One-night stand
- Casual distant acquaintance
- Trusted colleague
- Former fling
- Went our separate ways
- Bad, hurtful breakup
- Enemy / nemesis
... and so on. I can't recall all the 10-12 standard pigeonholes, but you get the idea. Who here thinks United qualifies as a "mentor" or "trusted" or "neighbor"? If UA is even bothering to do this kind of market analysis, I have no doubt the "bad breakup" and "went our separate ways" answers come tops. That is crisis territory for any company.
That's working out real well for Pan Am and TWA right now.
Last edited by WineCountryUA; May 20, 2017 at 11:10 am Reason: Discuss the issues, not the poster(s)
May 20, 2017, 12:06 pm
#69
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: LAX/TPE
Programs: United 1K, JAL Sapphire, SPG Lifetime Platinum, National Executive Elite, Hertz PC, Avis PC
Posts: 42,155
An equally common thought experiment in brandwork is to have people imagine the company as a person with whom they have -- or had -- a relationship with, and then suggest a spectrum of relationship types that might define the respondent's attitude:
... and so on. I can't recall all the 10-12 standard pigeonholes, but you get the idea. Who here thinks United qualifies as a "mentor" or "trusted" or "neighbor"? If UA is even bothering to do this kind of market analysis, I have no doubt the "bad breakup" and "went our separate ways" answers come tops. That is crisis territory for any company.
- Buddy / neighbor
- Guru / mentor / role model
- One-night stand
- Casual distant acquaintance
- Trusted colleague
- Former fling
- Went our separate ways
- Bad, hurtful breakup
- Enemy / nemesis
... and so on. I can't recall all the 10-12 standard pigeonholes, but you get the idea. Who here thinks United qualifies as a "mentor" or "trusted" or "neighbor"? If UA is even bothering to do this kind of market analysis, I have no doubt the "bad breakup" and "went our separate ways" answers come tops. That is crisis territory for any company.
I've seen no effort by UA to conduct thought leadership around branding, and no, wasting millions on a stadium in LA does not count. Right now, if you ask anyone off the street how they identify with the United brand, I guarantee you 80% will reply with something related to the Dao or subsequent incidents, and that is not just bad, but something that should have UA in crisis mode.
If you don't give people a reason why you are different, and your product lacks a series of USPs, then customers will only buy on the basis of price and schedule and the worst-case scenario becomes self-fulfilling.
Last edited by WineCountryUA; May 20, 2017 at 12:41 pm Reason: Discuss the issues, not the poster(s)
May 20, 2017, 4:14 pm
#70
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: NYC: UA 1K, DL Platinum, AAirpass, Avis PC
Posts: 4,599
What Delta is doing is measuring NPS and using that to guide decisions, so as you note unlikely they're spending much time on emotional response surveys. They believe NPS has a relationship with their revenue premium.
And key to that - Bastian said recently the number one driver of NPS for them by far is a 100% on time arrival (0 minutes late - not the DOT definition).
Not the kind of coffee, not the livery.
He views Keep Climbing as much an internal message as an external one, and frankly most airline brand ads these days are meant for the front line workers. Because motivated workers get planes out on time.
So they are spending more $$ investing in getting closer to 0 min late on more flights. And we're seeing the quality of the domestic F food service decline.
And key to that - Bastian said recently the number one driver of NPS for them by far is a 100% on time arrival (0 minutes late - not the DOT definition).
Not the kind of coffee, not the livery.
He views Keep Climbing as much an internal message as an external one, and frankly most airline brand ads these days are meant for the front line workers. Because motivated workers get planes out on time.
So they are spending more $$ investing in getting closer to 0 min late on more flights. And we're seeing the quality of the domestic F food service decline.
I don't think any US airline is doing this right now - maybe Delta to some extent, but it appears the industry sees itself as a tight oligopoly with little need to compete given the same product is distributed across every US carrier - the only attempt at differentiation is international business, and the gap in product between UA/DL/AA is not that big, although Delta seems to feel a small door will make the difference for them, which remains to be seen, but if they are successful with differentiating with a door, they will render Polaris obsolete before it's even deployed systemwide.
I've seen no effort by UA to conduct thought leadership around branding, and no, wasting millions on a stadium in LA does not count. Right now, if you ask anyone off the street how they identify with the United brand, I guarantee you 80% will reply with something related to the Dao or subsequent incidents, and that is not just bad, but something that should have UA in crisis mode.
If you don't give people a reason why you are different, and your product lacks a series of USPs, then customers will only buy on the basis of price and schedule and the worst-case scenario becomes self-fulfilling.
I've seen no effort by UA to conduct thought leadership around branding, and no, wasting millions on a stadium in LA does not count. Right now, if you ask anyone off the street how they identify with the United brand, I guarantee you 80% will reply with something related to the Dao or subsequent incidents, and that is not just bad, but something that should have UA in crisis mode.
If you don't give people a reason why you are different, and your product lacks a series of USPs, then customers will only buy on the basis of price and schedule and the worst-case scenario becomes self-fulfilling.
May 21, 2017, 4:36 am
#71
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: SRQ, PDX
Programs: UA 1 MM, AA, DL
Posts: 929
Agree, though I refer to the AA/DL/UA relationship as a cabal
