notquiteaff

From the WaPo article https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...=.b6e656e3e59e

and from her FB post linked in the story:

mahasamatman

Will people never take responsibility for their own actions?

eng3

A cowoker of mine (flying DL) told me a story of how a young (20 something) lady couldnt hold it and hand go to go (I think #2 ) in her seat. His wife handed her a sweater to cover herself. apparently it was very long between pushback and takeout/climbout due to rush hour traffic lining up at the runway and she just couldnt hold it.

but guess what, if I have to go, I'm getting up and going. I'll tell the crew its an emergency (because it is). If the plane has to pull over for a minute, then that's what they'll have to do. I've seen then pull over just before the runway to do a safety demo because the directv system was broke so its not like its impossible. I'm pretty sure I can time it well enough so they arent actually on the runway or 10 seconds from touch down and pick a more reasonable time. I've also seen a parent and child in the lav and not come out until after we passed the OM.

wolf72

Here comes the next big question for discussion: what is sensible action and what is a sensible reaction from the flight attendents.

A) Deny the passenger the right to use the toilet though they realize it is desperate times for the passenger and he/she cannot hold any longer and leave it to the passenger to solve this problem on their own

B) Allow the passenger to use the toilet but advise them they have 5 minutes and warn the captain.

C) Allow the passenger to use the toilet and tell the passenger to remain seated in the toilet for the take off until the seat belt sign is off.

D) None of the above.

I understand and respect the safety rules in place by airliners and the fact the crew are responsible for passenger safety and they themselves have to adhere to rules put in place for the safety of all. And I also do realize the crew can be cited if they disobey the safety rules for take off's and landing's.

Transpacificflyer

The ER nurse says she has an "over active" bladder. Ok, that's a common enough condition in women and in the elderly. It really isn't an over active bladder, but a loss of the muscular control that prevents leakage. It can be managed through exercise, medication, surgery or the use of adult diapers. The undergarments are absorbent and are are no longer bulky. This woman chose to fly knowing that she had a leaky bladder. She had a responsibility to manage her physical condition, just as a person with any other chronic condition must do so.

I am not excusing the behavior of the FA. Rudeness and nastiness is not acceptable. However, people like this pax must take some responsibility for their lives.

As an aside, maybe it's time the people who work at the implicated US air carrier(s) and who are the customers of these airlines should reflect on their lack of basic manners, absence of civility and overall dispositions. Everyone has an excuse and it's always someone else's fault. Fighting, shouting, racist insults, bullying is the new norm for some people and it's an indication of the collapse of civil society.

wolf72

What you said is correct and I wholly agree she already know's she has a bladder problem and there are solutions she could look at to make her travel more comfortable.

Mike Jacoubowsky

If this person flies much, then I'd hope she's figured out that she should be seated very close to a lav, and if that means paying for an E+ seat, will then that's just what you have to do.

I have great sympathy for people who have health issues, but to some extent you have to learn the system and make it work as best as possible for you. I don't have a medical problem per se but definitely feel uncomfortable going more than a couple hours in the air without using the lav. Just one of those things, y'know? So I deliberately choose seats, especially TATL or TPAC, that have easy lav access. No big thing right? Easy.

And when the plane begins to descend, even if you don't have to go, you go anyway, because you might get hung up at the gate etc.

But it's such a good story to tell... that United forced someone to pee in a cup. Sadly it detracts from legitimate issues in the same area, such as captains who forget or are too conservative about leaving the seatbelt sign on. That's perhaps even part of the problem here. Passengers routinely ignore the seatbelt sign if it's been on too long, and are rarely scolded for doing so. Why do we expect a passenger to treat the seatbelt sign differently at different times? Sure, the FTer understands the differences, but to the typical passenger, their only guideline is that they generally don't see it happen. There's nobody telling you that it's OK to ignore the seatbelt sign during "light chop" but not after landing. Why do we assume everyone knows?

notquiteaff

There seem to be two very different stories. Not a surprise, but I don't know that I am ready to make a judgement call about behavior that I have not observed.

Cruss74

What, no smartphone video of the incident?

FlyingNone

I can't imagine the contortions she would have had to go through to pee in a cup (even if she was wearing a skirt ?). No female could hold the cup underneath her without unfastening her seatbelt and raising herself (squatting) above the seat, so right there she would have been violating the fasten seatbelt rules. (sorry for the visual). No one else in the row was be offended by this?? .... what if there were children watching this scenario, while their "horrified" parents were objecting ?? Everyone is so iPhone happy, where's the video or offensive photos ?
ALL OF THIS IS WHY I DON'T BELIEVE THIS HAPPENED. Exaggerated or embellished or something else but not the way she narrates it. If it is true then she should have just ignored the flight attendant, brushed off her objections and gone into the lavatory! We all know that no police were going to arrest her when she landed.

JakiChan

For her side of it:

https://www.facebook.com/Nikki.Jo.Harper/posts/10102944103929264

It was not on descent, the drinks cart was out. I suggest before passing judgement you at least read her own words.

Duke787

Wait but I thought we were all against the smartphone recording of everything because it's intrusive and makes a hostile work environment.

This is getting ridiculous. Could this have happened on any airline? Yes. Is anyone surprised it was UA specifically? No, sadly. The rotten culture where we are all self-loading cargo has led us to a place where the majority of FAs seem to lack any empathy and seemingly don't think any exception can be made ever.

It's becoming increasingly frustrating to someone who supports UA. Particularly when the looks you get from your friends / family when you mention flying UA. I find myself more and more on Delta these days for a number of reasons (free Exit row and C+ on corporate fares + much better route network out of RDU) but the main is the general feeling that I'm actually treated as a human on a DL plane, especially in Y. I'm sure there are exceptions but they seem to happen with far less frequency on DL than on UA IME.

GUWonder

It doesn't happen always. I've been on a few UA flights this year where the seatbelt sign never went off from gate departure to gate arrival. While this flight with this incident was almost certainly not of that sort, there are flights where the seatbelt sign just never is turned off long enough for even one passenger to go to the lavatory during the course of the trip from gate departure to gate arrival.

flyertalker54234

The seat belt sign observance is for passenger safety. With the rise of "medical" bladder related stories in the wake of the Chinese Doctor's removal, do we come to a point where people suffering from such medical conditions either have to have a medical solution or like certain other medical conditions are prohibited from flying? There are medical devices for use in such emergencies. Maybe sufferers of such conditions should have to declare them on the booking so the airline and the crew are aware of the pax needs in advance. I feel certain if the pax had been allowed to get up to use the bathroom and the plane had encountered severe chop and she had been injured, she would have been straight round to an attorney.

GUWonder

Most people injured on planes in the US don't seem to sue. I've seen plenty of injuries on planes -- including seeing mishandled cabin luggage causing injuries to seated passengers, airline trolley carts in the aisles causing passenger injuries, and FA bodies/bodyparts causing aisle passengers to get some bad bruises -- and I can't recall hearing about any such lawsuit arising from my flights. The narrative of people seeking lawsuits out of injuries on flights isn't being bought by me -- call the narrative "fake news" if you wish -- but such litigation is the very rare exception and not the norm for most injuries arising on US flights.