Boutique Air now bookable on United.com

Old Apr 25, 17, 10:48 pm
  #16  
 
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Originally Posted by CaptainMiles View Post
I presume that the SLC-VEL-DEN is a similar setup. Notice that Boutique Air uses different flight numbers for SLC-VEL and VEL-DEN, even thought it's clearly the same aircraft. And yes, there is TSA at VEL, you can even leave a compliment. Even if there wasn't TSA, Boutique Air would still make you get a separate BP for the other flight number.
This is kind of genius. Has no one done this before (use an EAS city as a "focus city" to sell subsidized travel between hubs)?

Could AA do this with e.g. ORD-SUX-DFW? Is there a similar route where UA won hub-to-X and X-to-hub EAS routes and could publish the hub-X-hub flight at a $200 discount versus the nonstop?
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Old Apr 25, 17, 11:03 pm
  #17  
 
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Originally Posted by Zeug View Post
Hey COSPILOT,

I'm in the Springs as well. I have never flown on a PC-12 but after the comments in this thread, I am really considering this flight. I'm curious about your admiration of this aircraft. What makes it so cool?

Zeug
Large single engine Turboprops in the late 90's were always on my wish list to own. Few were capable of hauling my entire family, however the Cessna Caravan could, but isn't very fast. The Pilatus on the other hand could haul the family in a pressurized environment at far greater speed. But didn't matter as I could never afford one. Then one day a friend of mine purchased a new PC-12, back in 99 if memory serves, and my desire to have one became a lifelong promise to myself that I would someday find the money to purchase one. Sadly I haven't won the lottery yet...

Anyhow, since you are in the Springs, PM me sometime and we can meet for a beer.

COSPILOT
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Old Apr 25, 17, 11:03 pm
  #18  
 
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Originally Posted by returnoftheyeti View Post
Boutique flys OAK-MCE-LAX. Its on my to do list, I just have not done it.
I have; it works pretty well. It is a total EAS game; as others have said. I was made to get off the plane in MCE (for safety reasons while fueling, which I somewhat believe) but was not made to clear security. I did anyway though, because the only bathroom in MCE is outside the secure area.

I'd do it again, although not if I'm in a hurry. It's a novel experience but it takes a lot of extra time.
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Old Apr 26, 17, 12:29 am
  #19  
 
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Originally Posted by CaptainMiles View Post
Their pricing is a racket to exploit the EAS (Essential Air Service) subsidies. Every passenger flown into or out of an EAS airport earns the airline a subsidy of about $200 (varies by market).
OK I read the underlying rules a little more carefully and I'm not sure this characterization is exactly right.

Per https://www.transportation.gov/polic...al-air-service , carriers are paid on a "per flight completed" basis -- in principle the DOT pays the same subsidy amount for OAK-MCE flight as long as the flight operated, no matter whether the flight went out booked 1/8 or 8/8.

*However*, there is a $200-per-passenger subsidy cap which applies to communities close to a large or medium hub airport -- so if VEL or MCE are within 210 miles of the nearest large or medium hub, then the DOT will not pay more than $200 in subsidies per pax.

So I don't see how EAS carriers are incentivized to carry extra pax *unless* the subsidies they are getting are so high that they're hitting the $200 per pax cap and need more pax to avoid maxing out the subsidy payment.
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Old Apr 26, 17, 7:21 am
  #20  
 
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Originally Posted by mherdeg View Post
OK I read the underlying rules a little more carefully and I'm not sure this characterization is exactly right.

Per https://www.transportation.gov/polic...al-air-service , carriers are paid on a "per flight completed" basis -- in principle the DOT pays the same subsidy amount for OAK-MCE flight as long as the flight operated, no matter whether the flight went out booked 1/8 or 8/8.

*However*, there is a $200-per-passenger subsidy cap which applies to communities close to a large or medium hub airport -- so if VEL or MCE are within 210 miles of the nearest large or medium hub, then the DOT will not pay more than $200 in subsidies per pax.

So I don't see how EAS carriers are incentivized to carry extra pax *unless* the subsidies they are getting are so high that they're hitting the $200 per pax cap and need more pax to avoid maxing out the subsidy payment.
The $200 per pax cap is very much at play. VEL is less than 210 miles from SLC, therefore the $200 cap per pax applies. Let's look at VEL numbers.

Boutique Air operates 2,446 flights a year to/from VEL (24 weekly round trips multiplied by 2 directions multiplied by 52 weeks multiplied by a 98% completion factor), using a 9-pax King Air 350, to get a maximum subsidy of $3,324,848. To reach that subsidy they have to board a minimum of 16,625 ($3,324,848/$200) pax to/from VEL. So they need to fill an average of 6.8 (16,625/2,446) seats of that 9-seat airplane on every single flight. And that is measured each week. Any week they don't average 6.8 pax per flight they lose subsidy. So there is a very strong incentive to fill seats, and the $49 and $69 fares are very much a part of it. $49+$69 is $118 for SLC-VEL-DEN which is quite competitive with other airlines, especially when you consider the free checked baggage. Without the connecting pax they may not reach that average of 6.8.

My ATL-MSL-BNA flight was a good example. Without the connecting pax, they would have gotten 2 pax who were truly MSL pax. With the connecting pax, they got 14.
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Old Aug 28, 17, 9:07 pm
  #21  
 
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Originally Posted by mherdeg View Post
This is kind of genius. Has no one done this before (use an EAS city as a "focus city" to sell subsidized travel between hubs)?

Could AA do this with e.g. ORD-SUX-DFW? Is there a similar route where UA won hub-to-X and X-to-hub EAS routes and could publish the hub-X-hub flight at a $200 discount versus the nonstop?
boutique air bookable on united but not working properly.

e.g.

if you try to book silver city to abq ,get message ua doesnt fly to these cities can you go close by?
if you say yes,then it gives option of silver city to santa fe (via guess where?)

abq with boutique air!
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Old May 29, 18, 7:50 am
  #22  
 
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Flights on Boutique Air (4B) can now be credited to Mileage Plus: https://www.united.com/ual/en/us/fly...tique-air.html

Furthermore, UA is actually codesharing with 4B on several routes; not only some of the old Great Lakes routes out of Denver, and the ATL-MSL-BNA route mentioned earlier in the thread, but also MSP-TVF (Thief River Falls, MN) and PDX-PDT (Pendleton, OR): https://www.routesonline.com/news/38...late-may-2018/

Given the number of non-earning fare classes listed, I'd be curious to hear about peoples' experience booking the codeshare flights.

Press Release: https://www.boutiqueair.com/news/271
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Old May 29, 18, 8:38 am
  #23  
 
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I think the PC-12 is a great airplane and PT6A a fantastic motor, but I'm a little less than sanguine about hopping in a single engine aircraft for a flight over the Rockies. Not exactly forgiving terrain if the proverbial you-know-what hits the fan.

With MP earning, some of the other 4B routes are a now bit more enticing!
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Old May 29, 18, 9:58 am
  #24  
 
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Originally Posted by EWR764 View Post
I think the PC-12 is a great airplane and PT6A a fantastic motor, but I'm a little less than sanguine about hopping in a single engine aircraft for a flight over the Rockies. Not exactly forgiving terrain if the proverbial you-know-what hits the fan.
Think of it as an adventure!
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Old May 29, 18, 11:04 am
  #25  
 
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Originally Posted by COSPILOT View Post
Large single engine Turboprops in the late 90's were always on my wish list to own. Few were capable of hauling my entire family, however the Cessna Caravan could, but isn't very fast. The Pilatus on the other hand could haul the family in a pressurized environment at far greater speed. But didn't matter as I could never afford one. Then one day a friend of mine purchased a new PC-12, back in 99 if memory serves, and my desire to have one became a lifelong promise to myself that I would someday find the money to purchase one. Sadly I haven't won the lottery yet...

Anyhow, since you are in the Springs, PM me sometime and we can meet for a beer.

COSPILOT

​​​​​​​I got a quick tour of a PC12 while waiting at an FBO in college years ago. Really slick plane, has had a soft spot in my heart ever since. Though those TBMs are pretty nice, that's probably what I'd pick up if I won the lottery. Plus a Cub, for the low and slow $100 burger trip.
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Old May 29, 18, 4:30 pm
  #26  
 
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Routes available on the UA codeshares:
https://www.routesonline.com/news/38...late-may-2018/
Atlanta – Muscle Shoals
Denver – Alamosa
Denver – Cortez
Denver – Dodge City
Denver – McCook
Minneapolist/St. Paul – Thief River Falls
Nashville – Muscle Shoals
Portland OR – Pendleton

Fares are far better on the underlying 4B codes when I checked this morning.
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Old May 29, 18, 7:04 pm
  #27  
 
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Originally Posted by jjclancy View Post
Fares are far better on the underlying 4B codes when I checked this morning.
These are intended to be sold as part of a larger UA itinerary, not on their own. Fares for AUS-IAH-PDX-PDT didn't seem outrageous, for example.
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Old May 29, 18, 9:00 pm
  #28  
 
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I just booked into TVF, which isnít much farther to Grafton, ND than GFK is. Iíd resigned myself to flying Delta to get there or taking a long drive from Fargo.

Fares seem to be priced similarly to FAR minus a few dollars. Buying to MSP and then a separate 4B segment would probably be cheaper for many markets, eg, ORD.
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Old May 29, 18, 9:03 pm
  #29  
 
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Originally Posted by mherdeg View Post
This is kind of genius. Has no one done this before (use an EAS city as a "focus city" to sell subsidized travel between hubs)?

Could AA do this with e.g. ORD-SUX-DFW? Is there a similar route where UA won hub-to-X and X-to-hub EAS routes and could publish the hub-X-hub flight at a $200 discount versus the nonstop?
Iíve often wondered why some enterprising carrier like OneJet hasnít done this, particularly in a place with lots of markets where there isnít other nonstop route competition.
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Old Aug 13, 19, 12:30 pm
  #30  
 
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Anyone have any luck booking award tickets through UA on Boutique? Trying to fly into TEX but there seems to be no availability. Called in to try and book but the agent told me the same thing.
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