sfozrhfco

How many times have we heard, I will never fly XX airline again because of baggage fees, change fees, carry on fees etc? Time goes by and people accept it and continue to give money to carriers that charge those fees. Somehow millions of people keep forgetting that Spirit s+cks, just as people continue to "forgive" other carriers which devalue frequent flyer programs and many other aspects of travel.

I could see every fare eventually being no-frills. Even first class could be XX price for the seat--if you want a meal it is YY extra. The legacy carriers and the ULCC keep selling the fact that people love to only pay for what they want. Not everybody in first class wants the meal that is offered. Millions of people just follow along so why wouldn't the airlines continue on this path? The elite members get excited about getting perks which everybody used to get as part of the ticket price. Elite membership becomes even more "valuable." They have people well conditioned.

TennisNoob

Is E+ included in these no frills fares for those that usually get it free?

nerdbirdsjc

Consumers traveling in Economy Class have demonstrated that *price* is, far and away, the #1 driver of airline ticket buying decisions. Virtually all 21st century industry efforts to offer a domestic service differentiator to most pax (e.g., More Room Throughout Coach, meals at mealtime, etc.) have failed to result in tangible revenue/yield increases. The few customers who care about such things are taken care of through the FFP elite tiers.

awu25

[deleted]

morelegroom

Can't speak for anyone else but I few Ryanair 3 times in 2007-8 and have steadfastly refused to fly them again under any circumstances. I turned down conference invitations to avoid them .

I don't fly on the ATR 42/72 either. Or helicopters.

I would never fly Spirit. EVER

I've landed on beaches in Alaska, puddle jumped in Afrca and flew on the last seaplane route in the Virgin Islands. I will not fly ryanair

TA

I get you, but I don't mean "compete" in the sense of gain market share of customers by offering similar ticket prices as LCCs. I mean to be a competitive well-performing airline.

Almost all large legacy carriers get confused. They think that they should compete for market share of passengers that the LCCs are pulling away from them. But they do not figure out until too late that they should not be competing for this business.

Competition for LCC passengers requires having a low cost structure, which UA will never have. All they do by lowering ticket prices is to eat into their revenues without decreasing costs. That is why I say they have not learned the lessons of TED.

OK, if they provide a lower ticket price tier by the amount that FF miles costs them to provide, then they can access some of the LCC pax market. But they will be making a big mistake if they try to cut fares to LCC levels. UA is not built for that $hitfight.

aCavalierInCoach

What does that have to do with any of this? This has nothing to do with keeping prices lower or offering lower fares. This is a way of affecting a price INCREASE on all of the FF/seating bennies currently ensconced in an economy class airfare.

This is a very convoluted way of saying "we are going to begin introducing more fees on more things you are used to having included in your fare."

No, basic fares will not go down.

Karl-MDW

THIS is the big unanswered question.

How will the few remaining "free" perks of "status" be handled - or not - in attempting to use the basic economy fare?

My guess is that "status" will be bumped to the bottom of the line according to fare paid, status, etc. - like with upgrades now. My hunch is that if I try to use the lower fare, I will be not be able to book a seat until the day of the flight and then wait listed for E+ or even an aisle or window seat in E-. I 'll bet upgrades to business or domestic first will not be allowed - unless maybe as a benefit of the Explorer Card.

We'll see.

TA

I tend to agree with this. Or at least basic fares will not go down in the long run. UA struggles to sustain the fares it offers right now, how can they lower fares further?

findark

If we use DL as the example, no.

This is my biggest worry. So far on DL, the differential between the E fares and normal V fares has been $10-20 and booking for myself it would be zero thought to make the choice. But I have no trouble at all seeing corporations who already have Y- only travel policies forcing everyone to travel in this "new and improved" cattle class. Seat assignments? Why should we pay for those?

milypan

Ironically, that's probably exactly what they're looking for. The ideal scenario for them is that the "higher value" flyers (e.g. those with Premier status) continue to purchase the more expensive fare classes, while the new "no frills" fare class is only purchased by super-price-sensitive customers who otherwise might have flown NK, F9, etc.

manneca

Something like this, depending on the price differential, would drive me to kayak. I'm all leisure on my own dime. If I don't get the benefits of status, why should I choose UA, particularly when they have horrible on time/cancellation and awful IRROPS.

I think that's really the question UA should ask of its HVF--would you continue to choose UA if you had to pay for benefits you now receive for free.

escapefromphl

I though spend based earn allowed them discriminate between business and leisure travelers already. I don't see the point of not awarding miles and I assume they will still award miles for these "no frills" fares as Delta does.

awu25

I agree, most casual flyers aren't even choosing seats currently because E- fills up, and they end up in E+. I can already see the glitches occurring though: someone purchases a regular ticket and wants to choose a seat, but then no seats available in E-. Customers will argue that they would've chosen the no frills fare.

Bonehead

One can view the seat map prior to purchase. Of course, they would have to know the difference between white and blue seats. Also, they can cancel the purchase without penalty within 24 hours.