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Involuntary Denied Boarding on Baby's First Flight

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Old Sep 24, 2016, 12:05 pm
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From the United Website...

Rule 25 Denied Boarding Compensation

Denied Boarding (U.S.A./Canadian Flight Origin) - When there is an Oversold UA flight that originates in the U.S.A. or Canada, the following provisions apply:
1. Request for Volunteers
a. UA will request Passengers who are willing to relinquish their confirmed reserved space in exchange for compensation in an amount determined by UA (including but not limited to check or an electronic travel certificate). The travel certificate will be valid only for travel on UA or designated Codeshare partners for one year from the date of issue and will have no refund value. If a Passenger is asked to volunteer, UA will not later deny boarding to that Passenger involuntarily unless that Passenger was informed at the time he was asked to volunteer that there was a possibility of being denied boarding involuntarily and of the amount of compensation to which he/she would have been entitled in that event. The request for volunteers and the selection of such person to be denied space will be in a manner determined solely by UA.
2. Boarding Priorities - If a flight is Oversold, no one may be denied boarding against his/her will until UA or other carrier personnel first ask for volunteers who will give up their reservations willingly in exchange for compensation as determined by UA. If there are not enough volunteers, other Passengers may be denied boarding involuntarily in accordance with UA’s boarding priority:
a. Passengers who are Qualified Individuals with Disabilities, unaccompanied minors under the age of 18 years, or minors between the ages of 5 to 15 years who use the unaccompanied minor service, will be the last to be involuntarily denied boarding if it is determined by UA that such denial would constitute a hardship.
b. The priority of all other confirmed passengers may be determined based on a passenger’s fare class, itinerary, status of frequent flyer program membership, and the time in which the passenger presents him/herself for check-in without advanced seat assignment.
3. Transportation for Passengers Denied Boarding - When UA is unable to provide previously confirmed space due to an Oversold flight, UA will provide transportation to such Passengers who have been denied boarding whether voluntarily or involuntarily in accordance with the provisions below.
a. UA will transport the Passenger on its own flight to the Destination without Stopover on its next flight on which space is available at no additional cost to the Passenger, regardless of class of service.
b. If space is available on another Carrier’s flight regardless of class of service, such flights may be used upon United’s sole discretion and the Passenger’s request at no additional cost to the Passenger only if such flight provides an earlier arrival than the UA flight offered in 3) a) above.
4. Compensation for Passengers Denied Boarding Involuntarily
a. For passengers traveling in interstate transportation between points within the United States, subject to the EXCEPTIONS in section d) below, UA shall pay compensation to Passengers denied boarding involuntarily from an Oversold Flight at the rate of 200% of the fare to the Passenger’s first Stopover or, if none, Destination, with a maximum of 675 USD if UA offers Alternate Transportation that, at the time the arrangement is made, is planned to arrive at the Passenger’s Destination or first Stopover more than one hour but less than two hours after the planned arrival time of the Passenger’s original flight. If UA offers Alternate Transportation that, at the time the arrangement is made, is planned to arrive at the Passenger’s Destination or first Stopover more than two hours after the planned arrival time of the Passenger’s original flight, UA shall pay compensation to Passengers denied boarding involuntarily from an Oversold Flight at the rate of 400% of the fare to the Passenger’s first Stopover or, if none, Destination with a maximum of 1350 USD.
b. For passengers traveling from the United States to a foreign point, subject to the EXCEPTIONS in section d) below, UA shall pay compensation to Passengers denied boarding involuntarily from an Oversold Flight originating at a U.S. airport at the rate of 200% of the fare to the Passenger’s first Stopover or, if none, Destination, with a maximum of 675 USD if UA offers Alternate Transportation that, at the time the arrangement is made, is planned to arrive at the Passenger’s Destination or first Stopover more than one hour but less than four hours after the planned arrival time of the Passenger’s original flight. If UA offers Alternate Transportation that, at the time the arrangement is made, is planned to arrive at the Passenger’s Destination or first Stopover more than four hours after the planned arrival time of the Passenger’s original flight, UA shall pay compensation to Passengers denied boarding involuntarily from an Oversold Flight at the rate of 400% of the fare to the Passenger’s first Stopover or, if none, Destination with a maximum of 1350 USD.
c. For passengers traveling from Canada to a foreign point, subject to the EXCEPTIONS in section d) below, UA shall pay compensation to Passengers denied boarding involuntarily from an Oversold Flight originating at a Canadian airport with a maximum of 200 CAD if UA offers Alternate Transportation that, at the time the arrangement is made, is planned to arrive at the Passenger’s Destination or first Stopover more than one hour but less than four hours after the planned arrival time of the Passenger’s original flight. If UA offers Alternate Transportation that, at the time the arrangement is made, is planned to arrive at the Passenger’s Destination or first Stopover more than four hours after the planned arrival time of the Passenger’s original flight, UA shall pay compensation to Passengers denied boarding involuntarily from an Oversold Flight with a maximum of 300 CAD. At the passenger’s request, compensation in the form of check, wire transfer, visa card, or a travel voucher will be made by UA, and if accepted by the Passenger, the Passenger will provide a signed receipt to UA.
d. EXCEPTIONS: A Passenger denied boarding involuntarily from an Oversold Flight shall not be eligible for denied boarding compensation if:
The flight is cancelled;
The Passenger holding a Ticket for confirmed reserved space does not comply fully with the requirements in this Contract of Carriage Requirements regarding ticketing, check-in, reconfirmation procedures, and acceptance for transportation;
The flight for which the Passenger holds confirmed reserved space is unable to accommodate the Passenger because of substitution of equipment of lesser capacity when required by operational or safety reasons or, on an aircraft with a designed passenger capacity of 60 or fewer seats, the flight for which the passenger holds confirmed reserved space is unable to accommodate that passenger due to weight/balance restrictions when required by operational or safety reasons;
The Passenger is offered accommodations or is seated in a section of the aircraft other than that specified on his/her ticket at no extra charge. Provided, if a Passenger is seated in a section for which a lower fare applies, the Passenger will be entitled to a refund applicable to the difference in fares;
The Passenger is accommodated on Alternate Transportation at no extra cost, which at the time such arrangements are made, is planned to arrive at the airport of the Passenger’s next Stopover, (if any), or at the Destination, not later than 60 minutes after the planned arrival time of the flight on which the Passenger held confirmed reserved space;
The Passenger is an employee of UA or of another Carrier or other person traveling without a confirmed reserved space; or
The Passenger does not present him/herself at the loading gate for boarding at least 15 minutes prior to scheduled domestic departures, and 30 minutes prior to scheduled international departures. See Rule 5 D) for additional information regarding boarding cut-off times.
5. Payment Time and Form for Passengers Traveling Between Points within the United States or from the United States to a Foreign Point
a. Compensation in the form of check will be made by UA on the day and at the place where the failure to provide confirmed reserved space occurs, and if accepted by the Passenger, the Passenger will provide a signed receipt to UA. However, when UA has arranged, for the Passenger’s convenience, Alternate Transportation that departs before the compensation to the Passenger under this provision can be prepared and given to the Passenger, the compensation shall be sent by mail or other means to the Passenger within 24 hours thereafter.
b. UA may offer free or reduced rate air transportation in lieu of a check payment due under this Rule, if the value of the transportation credit offered is equal to or greater than the monetary compensation otherwise due and UA informs the Passenger of the amount and that the Passenger may decline the transportation benefit and receive the monetary compensation.
6. Limitation of Liability - If UA’s offer of compensation pursuant to the above provisions is accepted by the Passenger, such payment will constitute full compensation for all actual or anticipatory damages incurred or to be incurred by the Passenger as a result of UA’s failure to provide the Passenger with confirmed reserved space. If UA’s offer of compensation pursuant to the above provisions is not accepted, UA’s liability is limited to actual damages proved not to exceed 1350 USD per Ticketed Passenger as a result of UA’s failure to provide the Passenger with confirmed reserved space. Passenger will be responsible for providing documentation of all actual damages claimed. UA shall not be liable for any punitive, consequential or special damages arising out of or in connection with UA’s failure to provide the Passenger with confirmed reserved space.
[/INDENT]
B. Denied Boarding Non-U.S.A./Canada Flight Origin - Where there is an Oversold UA flight that originates outside the U.S.A. or Canada, no compensation will be provided except where required by local or international laws regulating Oversold flights.
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Involuntary Denied Boarding on Baby's First Flight

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Old Oct 7, 2015, 4:53 pm
  #76  
 
Join Date: May 2013
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Originally Posted by 110pgl
Got it. Just floating a (wrong) idea to try to help OP.
It's a valid question and one more data point to help the OP understand the situation better.
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Old Oct 12, 2015, 12:53 pm
  #77  
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It has been 10 days since I submitted our written complaint to United regarding our IDB and I have yet to hear back from anyone. I was hoping to have at least received a courtesy call or email saying that they are still looking into my issue, but I haven't. If I don't receive any communication this week, my plan is to send a demand letter to United's registered agent in Tennessee giving them 5 business days to respond.

Thoughts?
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Old Oct 12, 2015, 1:20 pm
  #78  
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Just file the DOT complaint, then you know what the timeline is (acknowledgement within 30 days, substantive response within 60 days)
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Old Oct 12, 2015, 1:27 pm
  #79  
 
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Originally Posted by mduell
Just file the DOT complaint, then you know what the timeline is (acknowledgement within 30 days, substantive response within 60 days)
+1 on this, if it could have been solved by UA, it would have been already.
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Old Oct 12, 2015, 2:18 pm
  #80  
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Originally Posted by jhayes_1780
+1 on this, if it could have been solved by UA, it would have been already.
I filed a complaint online with the DOT on the same night I filed my complaint with United. Haven't heard back on that either.

The auto-confirmation email I received when I submitted my complaint to United said that they are responding to most inquiries within 7-10 business days. They are still within that time frame, but I have a feeling I'm wasting my time waiting on an offer that will be far below what they owe.

Last edited by jljones000; Oct 12, 2015 at 2:29 pm
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Old Oct 12, 2015, 2:23 pm
  #81  
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Originally Posted by jljones000
I filed a complaint online with the DOT on the same night I filed my complaint with United. Haven't heard back on that either.

I'm just wondering if I'm wasting my time waiting on United to reach out in response to my online complaint submission.
Don't worry about working directly with United via the front door at this point. The DOT will contact United and someone from United should subsequently be contacting yu with regard to your complaint.
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Old Oct 12, 2015, 5:01 pm
  #82  
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Originally Posted by jljones000
I filed a complaint online with the DOT on the same night I filed my complaint with United. Haven't heard back on that either.

The auto-confirmation email I received when I submitted my complaint to United said that they are responding to most inquiries within 7-10 business days. They are still within that time frame, but I have a feeling I'm wasting my time waiting on an offer that will be far below what they owe.
the DOT should have gotten back to you within 24 hours. They have always for me when it was an obvious case. UA never took more than 48 hours to reply.
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Old Oct 12, 2015, 7:05 pm
  #83  
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Originally Posted by cfischer
the DOT should have gotten back to you within 24 hours. They have always for me when it was an obvious case. UA never took more than 48 hours to reply.
The OP indicates that the DoT acknowledgement message was received. After that it is mostly up to UA to reply. From a prior complaint I filed:
I will forward your complaint to the airline and ask the company to respond directly to you with a copy to us. Airlines are required to acknowledge receipt of a consumer complaint within 30 days and provide a substantive response to the complainant within 60 days.
Don't worry about the timing. The complaint is in the matrix and it'll be processed when it happens. But it is not necessarily a 7-10 day sort of thing.
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Old Oct 22, 2015, 7:52 pm
  #84  
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I finally received a response to my online complaint from United. The text of the email is as follows:

Dear Mr. [OP]:

Thank you for contacting us, regarding your flight 5607 operated by SkyWest Airlines. I am sorry to learn about your experience.

United Airlines strives to have the highest level of professionalism exemplified through our services and employees. Based on your comments, regarding the lack of customer service. This is never acceptable. I truly apologize that we did not meet your valid expectations for quality service during this trip.

If our airport staff is able to arrange alternate transportation and you arrive at your stopover or destination within one hour of your original flight, no compensation applies. However, if your alternate transportation is planned to arrive at your stopover or destination more than one hour after your original flight, but less than two hours you will receive compensation at the rate of 200% of that segment. Our records indicate you were rebooked on flight 4299 departing at 6:20 and arriving at 8:05. This can be found on United.com by clicking on our Contract of Carriage at the bottom of the page. Please view Rule 25A
Paragraph 4.

I have also went in and refunded $200 chg fees $69 BHP $55 BHP $69 BHP $59 BHP $25 EX1 $25 EX1 totaling $702 in change fees, upgrade fees, and bag fees.

You may check the status of the refund by using the link below at United.com, and your ticket numbers above beginning with 016.

http://www.united.com/web/en-us/cont...7B948F14CA1116

We appreciate your business and look forward to welcoming you on board a future United Airlines flight.

Kind regards,

L**** ****
Corporate Customer Care
First, it still appears that United believes that we were not denied boarding on our second flight which is incorrect. Second, it isn't even clear from the email if they are offering any compensation at all. I followed the link in the email and the status of my "refund" is still pending so I'm not sure what exactly they are offering, but this isn't going to cut it. Thoughts?

Last edited by jljones000; Oct 22, 2015 at 8:44 pm
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Old Oct 22, 2015, 8:18 pm
  #85  
 
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Originally Posted by jljones000
I finally received a response to my online complaint from United. The text of the email is as follows:



First, it still appears that United believes that we were not denied boarding on our second flight which is incorrect. Second, it isn't even clear from the email if they are offering any compensation at all. I followed the link in the email and the status of my "refund" is still pending so I'm not sure what exactly they are offering, but this isn't going to cut it. Thoughts?
This response (which should be anonymized) sounds like it came from a 'standard' customer care channel, not a DOT complaint specialist. Did you file either, or both, of a direct complaint and a DOT complaint?
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Old Oct 22, 2015, 8:28 pm
  #86  
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Originally Posted by transportprof
This response (which should be anonymized) sounds like it came from a 'standard' customer care channel, not a DOT complaint specialist. Did you file either, or both, of a direct complaint and a DOT complaint?
I filed a complaint with United and with the DOT.
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Old Oct 23, 2015, 12:06 am
  #87  
 
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Originally Posted by jljones000
First, it still appears that United believes that we were not denied boarding on our second flight which is incorrect. Second, it isn't even clear from the email if they are offering any compensation at all...
Based on the grammar-challenged and condescending tone of UA's response ("your 'valid expectations' of quality" -- really UA? ), it seems to me that UA is suggesting that it was your fault for not making the second flight. UA can easily tell that you did not board that flight, but it might be more difficult, but still doable, to determine that someone needed to access your reservation after the second flight's departure in order to process the initial compensation that was offered to you at the airport.

FWIW, I would reply to UA by saying that, at this point, if UA isn't able to confirm or admit that you were also denied boarding for that second flight, there is no reason to continue the current dialogue, and that you have sought the assistance of DOT in order to reach a fair resolution. Good luck, and thanks again for updating us with your experiences.
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Old Oct 23, 2015, 4:16 am
  #88  
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Maybe follow up w the DOT. perhaps the mail got lost. reponses are usually much more prompt.
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Old Oct 23, 2015, 6:26 am
  #89  
 
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Thats actually a great email to receive IMO, as you now have another piece of evidence that you were confirmed on the 2nd flight

Keep us updated please and gl
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Old Oct 23, 2015, 9:03 am
  #90  
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I have copied my response to the CustomerCare email below. I'm not sure anyone actually checks responses, but the email did not include any disclaimer saying "do not respond" so hopefully someone recieves it. Regardless, I'm sending a copy via actual mail to United's corporate office and its Tennessee registered agent.

Dear Customer Care,

Your information is inaccurate and I do not accept your proposed refund in satisfaction of my claim.

First, my complaint was with regard to two tickets for flight 5607. Both my wife and I were involuntarily denied boarding. Therefore any refund or compensation which takes into account only one ticket is insufficient.

Second, we were involuntarily denied boarding (“IDB”) on both Flight 5607 and Flight 4299 for the stated reason that this flights were overbooked. After we were IDBed from Flight 4299, we were told that United could not arrange alternative transportation that would arrive at our destination until the next day, which was more than four hours after our original scheduled arrival.

Third, after the IDB from Flight 4299, I demanded my written statement of rights as well as a full refund of both tickets and, at a minimum, the 400% one-way fare value for each of mine and my wife's ticket. I further demanded a full refund of both round trip tickets as is my right under 14 CFR 250, et seq. I was denied all of these by the acting supervisor and was instead offered a check in the amount of approximately $360 and an offer that my wife and I be booked on a United flight the next day. I explained that this was an egregious DOT violation and a violation of United's Contract of Carriage, and demanded to speak with a United corporate representative, but I was denied.

Pursuant to the terms of the United Contract of Carriage, both my wife and I were IDBed on two separate flights. First on our originally scheduled flight 5607 and then on 4299. We met all of the Contract of Carriage requirements for IDB compensation on both flights. For Flight 5607, my wife and I are entitled to 200% of our one-way fare because United did make arrangements to put us on Flight 4299 within two hours of our original arrival time. However, when United IDBed us from Flight 4299 and failed to offer alternative arrangements arriving at our destination within 4 hours of Flight 4299’s stated arrival time, we were entitled to an additional 400% compensation.

Finally, pursuant to the United Contract of Carriage and 14 CFR 250, et seq, we are not obligated to accept alternative transportation arriving later than 4 hours after our scheduled arrival time and can, instead, request a full refund for the round trip ticket value, including the fees, taxes, baggage and upgrades.

For these reasons, we are entitled to compensation and refunds as set forth below:

REFUND:

[OP] roundtrip fare:
Airfare: 306.04 USD
U.S. Transportation Tax: 22.96
U.S. Flight Segment Tax: 8.00
September 11th Security Fee: 11.20
U.S. Passenger Facility Charge: 4.50
Per Person Total: 352.70 USD

[OP Wife] roundtrip fare:
Airfare: 306.04 USD
U.S. Transportation Tax: 22.96
U.S. Flight Segment Tax: 8.00
September 11th Security Fee: 11.20
U.S. Passenger Facility Charge: 4.50
Per Person Total: 352.70 USD

Additional charges eligible for refund:

55.00 USD for the following: Bulkhead Premium Seat
69.00 USD for the following: Bulkhead Premium Seat
69.00 USD for the following: Bulkhead Premium Seat
59.00 USD for the following: Bulkhead Premium Seat
200.00 USD for the following: Change Fee
200.00 USD for the following: Change Fee
$25 USD for the following: Checked bag
$25 USD for the following : Checked bag

TOTAL REFUND - $1,407.40


IDB COMPENSATION:

OP – Flight 5607 (200% of $176.35 one way fare) - $352.70
OP Wife – Flight 5607 (200% of $176.35 one way fare)- $352.70

OP – Flight 4299 (400% of $176.35 one way fare) - $705.40
OP Wife – Flight 4299 (400% of $176.35 one way fare)- $705.40

TOTAL IDB COMPENSATION - $2,116.20
__________________________________________________ __

TOTAL DUE TO OP and Wife - $3,523.60

Lastly, the Department of Transportation has determined on numerous occasions that failing to follow DOT regulations when dealing with involuntarily denied passengers is an unfair and deceptive business practice as set forth in 49 USC 41712. This conduct is also in violation of the Tennessee Consumer Protection Act, T.C.A. 47-18-104, which provides that violators will be liable for triple damages as well as attorney’s fees and costs. Further, based on the conduct of the supervisor in refusing to provide any information with regards to my rights as a passenger or the reason why proper refunds and compensation were denied, while attempting to have me sign a waiver and release in order to obtain said information, United is also liable for fraud and intentional misrepresentation which are subject to punitive damages in Tennessee.

It seems unlikely, given the strict passenger reporting guidelines required by the FAA, that United is somehow unaware that my wife and I were not allowed to board Flight 4299, especially in light of the fact that we were dealing with an United supervisor after Flight 4299 had left the airport. More likely is that this offer represents a further attempt by United to take advantage of a customer’s lack of knowledge or need for an immediate payment in less than the full amount owed. However, I am sending this email in the hopes that your below offer is truly a mistake rather than an intentionally unfair and fraudulent business practice. As such, I would request that United confirm that it will be remitting $3,523.60 in total refunds and compensation as required under the United Contract of Carriage and Department of Transportation Regulations, or otherwise respond within 5 days of receipt of this email. I will also send a hard copy of this email to United’s principal office and Tennessee registered agent.

Please note that if a response is not received as requested, I will move forward with a legal action for breach of contract, fraud, and violations of the Tennessee Consumer Protection Act.

Thank you for your prompt attention to this matter.

Sincerely,

OP
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