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North TATL 757 fuel stops / diversion delays [2015]

North TATL 757 fuel stops / diversion delays [2015]

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Old Jul 15, 17, 1:19 pm   -   Wikipost
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Due to winter (most common Dec/Jan) weather/jetstream conditions for northern TATL flights, the 757-200's UA uses for the thin european routes need to make fuel stop / diversions. Typically at Bangor (BGR) / Goose Bay(YYR) / Gander (YQX) /St. John's (YYT), ....
The most commonly affected European routes are Barcelona (BCN), Berlin (TXL), Hamburg (HAM), Madrid (MAD), Oslo (OSL), Stockholm (ARN)

Interesting maps
Weather Model - North Atlantic Jet Stream Wind
North Atlantic Jet Stream Forecasts

Related / previous threads
Why does United put 757s on certain flights from EWR to europe

[757-200 diversions] CO starting hubs at Gander, Goose Bay, etc. [threads merged] pmCO

UA69 (ARN-EWR): Wrong plane, wrong fuel calculations, or bad weather?

2013 Westbound TATL 757 "Short Stops"

Consolidated "United 757 TATL Fuel Stop" Thread [Merged] 2012
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Old Jan 6, 15, 11:24 am
  #76  
 
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Originally Posted by PV_Premier View Post
1/6 diversions that I found:

UA123 (LHR-IAD) to BGR (also 3 hours late out of LHR)
UA63 (MAD-EWR) to BGR (departed 45 mins late from MAD)
UA65 (LIS-EWR) to YQX (departed 2hr 20 mins late from LIS)

As mentioned above UA55 is also headed to BGR and left CDG around 50 mins late
inexcusable!
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Old Jan 6, 15, 12:10 pm
  #77  
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Originally Posted by PV_Premier View Post
1/6 diversions that I found:

UA123 (LHR-IAD) to BGR (also 3 hours late out of LHR)
UA63 (MAD-EWR) to BGR (departed 45 mins late from MAD)
UA65 (LIS-EWR) to YQX (departed 2hr 20 mins late from LIS)

As mentioned above UA55 is also headed to BGR and left CDG around 50 mins late
Some of this may be related to weather issues at the destination. EWR and other east coast airports have a traffic management program in place for WEATHER / SNOW-ICE.
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Old Jan 6, 15, 12:31 pm
  #78  
 
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AA CDG-JFK is also diverting. The 757 just can't handle these winds on the westbound. The 767's should stay a bit longer, or some more 788 are needed for these routes.

UA has more diversions, since they have more 757 flights. People have a choice, connect or fly another carrier.
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Old Jan 6, 15, 12:33 pm
  #79  
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Originally Posted by WineCountryUA View Post
Some of this may be related to weather issues at the destination. EWR and other east coast airports have a traffic management program in place for WEATHER / SNOW-ICE.
perhaps, but the WX doesn't seem to be impacting the widebody operations quite the same way...
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Old Jan 6, 15, 1:31 pm
  #80  
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Originally Posted by LASUA1K View Post
AA CDG-JFK is also diverting. The 757 just can't handle these winds on the westbound. The 767's should stay a bit longer, or some more 788 are needed for these routes.
UA has more diversions, since they have more 757 flights. People have a choice, connect or fly another carrier.
Exactly, mentioned this upthread - US and AA 757s are also diverting, at the same rate as UA ones.

UA can serve smaller cities like BFS, OSL, TXL with these planes. I'd rather have that than the pathetic European route network of AA.
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Old Jan 6, 15, 1:42 pm
  #81  
 
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Originally Posted by PV_Premier View Post
perhaps, but the WX doesn't seem to be impacting the widebody operations quite the same way...
That's because widebodies can hold more fuel. They are able to load extra fuel to hold en route if necessary due to destination weather, as well as hold the fuel necessary to get to their alternate. If the 757 were to load holding and alternate fuel, with the headwinds across the ocean, they'd be above the fuel tank capacity.
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Old Jan 6, 15, 1:48 pm
  #82  
 
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Originally Posted by cpyankees25 View Post
That's because widebodies can hold more fuel. They are able to load extra fuel to hold en route if necessary due to destination weather, as well as hold the fuel necessary to get to their alternate. If the 757 were to load holding and alternate fuel, with the headwinds across the ocean, they'd be above the fuel tank capacity.
I would normally be saying "thank goodness that I've booked my TATLs on 767s and 777s," but with their operational reliability, I'm not sure there is a big difference between the 757s and 767/777s.
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Old Jan 6, 15, 2:56 pm
  #83  
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Originally Posted by cpyankees25 View Post
That's because widebodies can hold more fuel. They are able to load extra fuel to hold en route if necessary due to destination weather, as well as hold the fuel necessary to get to their alternate. If the 757 were to load holding and alternate fuel, with the headwinds across the ocean, they'd be above the fuel tank capacity.
i understand that

it still doesn't explain why all the 757s were late off the gate today relative to the widebodies, but now we are getting off topic. late off the gate then diverting is really adding insult to injury when it comes to flying UAL across the pond.
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Old Jan 6, 15, 3:25 pm
  #84  
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Originally Posted by WineCountryUA View Post
and UA is service more of the second tier cities.
That is true, but UA also has 757 arrivals to EWR today from LHR (the single largest foreign gateway to the U.S.), CDG (#3 from Europe) and MAD (#6). Those are not 2nd-tier cities.

Into JFK, DL ran from those airports today without diversions:

LHR: 764, 2x763

CDG: 333

MAD: 763
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Old Jan 6, 15, 3:45 pm
  #85  
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Originally Posted by 3Cforme View Post
That is true, but UA also has 757 arrivals to EWR today from LHR (the single largest foreign gateway to the U.S.), CDG (#3 from Europe) and MAD (#6). Those are not 2nd-tier cities.

Into JFK, DL ran from those airports today without diversions:

LHR: 764, 2x763

CDG: 333

MAD: 763
to be fair it's not like UA only had one 757 CDG-EWR and LHR-EWR and nothing else.

it was CDG: 764+752 and LHR: 777+2x763+2x757

1x752 to MAD, though, is MADness, i agree.
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Old Jan 6, 15, 3:46 pm
  #86  
 
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Originally Posted by 3Cforme View Post
That is true, but UA also has 757 arrivals to EWR today from LHR (the single largest foreign gateway to the U.S.), CDG (#3 from Europe) and MAD (#6). Those are not 2nd-tier cities.

Into JFK, DL ran from those airports today without diversions:

LHR: 764, 2x763

CDG: 333

MAD: 763
UA is fixing LHR with widebody only service from EWR, including a 787. CDG is a Sky Hub, AA also ran a 757 on CDG-JFK, which also diverted. MAD, probably should be a 767.
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Old Jan 6, 15, 4:21 pm
  #87  
 
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Originally Posted by LASUA1K View Post
UA is fixing LHR with widebody only service from EWR, including a 787. CDG is a Sky Hub, AA also ran a 757 on CDG-JFK, which also diverted. MAD, probably should be a 767.
IAD-MAD used to be operated by a wet leased A330 from EI, but I think that UA got rid of that when JK went under so there is very little in the way of a *A presence in Spain. Now LIS, on the other hand, should be up-gauged from a 757 since TP does have connections to Africa and other parts in Europe that are not easily accessible by other *A partners.
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Old Jan 6, 15, 4:49 pm
  #88  
 
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Originally Posted by boss315 View Post
inexcusable!
Exactly!!! They should cancel the flight, leaving everyone stranded. Or cut the route! Or just let the airplane land in the ocean. Adding three extra hours to a flight is egregious
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Old Jan 6, 15, 5:03 pm
  #89  
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Originally Posted by BB2220 View Post
Exactly!!! They should cancel the flight, leaving everyone stranded. Or cut the route! Or just let the airplane land in the ocean. Adding three extra hours to a flight is egregious
Hah. Clearly a lot of people don't think like an airline planner when they're a passenger.

I think many people have unaware benefitted from a route that flies reliably nonstop and at a good price to these secondary European cities -- most of the year. They get upset on the couple of days when it has to stop on the way back.

Hard to explain that to them. (or maybe it isn't so hard?)
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Old Jan 6, 15, 5:10 pm
  #90  
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as a Canadian I appreciate the planes dropping by to buy some fuel!
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