BrianCUnited

The exhausting debate that continues on FT about UA's new E175 can be summed up like this:

BAD: Horrible meals in F!!

GOOD: Planes are more comfortable!! No middle seats!!

SO, if you often by F or get upgraded you are understandably pissed about this decision. If, like me, you never pay for UA's crap F and haven't seen an upgrade this year and think the E170/175 are more comfortable than any UA mainline then it's not the end of the world.

LarkSFO

What does this sentence even mean?

UA is (mostly) eliminating mainline on this route
UA is introducing a second daily frequency
The E175's will not have all the amenities of mainline, so be prepared (buy food ahead of the flight)

What am I missing?

Good luck with Sun Country - please share your feedback here for all to review.

Kacee

You have missed what is for many of us the key point: Express is unreliable and much more likely to cancel than mainline UA. That for me (and several others who have posted in this thread) is the primary reason I will not fly this route on UA once they switch to Express.

Be prepared for cancellations, missed meetings, and those lovely two-days-later Express rebookings.

LarkSFO

Statistically, if I fly 1,000 UAEX flights, how many will cancel?

channa

Using the DOT stats on SkyWest and ExpressJet from the most recent reporting period, somewhere between 2.3% and 5.1%, so probably about 37 of the 1,000 flights will cancel.

Compare to DL's mainline cancel rate of 0.2%, or about 2 in 1,000.

So you're 19 times more likely to cancel than if you flew DL.

trk1

Your data will not apply to MSP-SFO. The bulk of the cancels are for 50 seaters
with EWR leading the pack along with Cle and Ord. Due to aircraft size the 76 seaters on this route will not be part of the east cast/ohare weather issues.

channa

You seem to be confused:

- UA mainline has the horrible meals in F.
- UA Express has no meals in F.


No middle seats, but those new UA RJ seats they've been putting in are awful.

I'll take a mainline plane over that any day.

If you're worried about middle seats, take one of DL's 767s on this route. Yes, DL flies a couple widebodies on MSP-SFO. Even the MD90's have no middles on one side of the plane.



MSP-SFO is blocked at over 4 hours. Add boarding time, and that's easily 4.5 hours on that plane with rock hard slimline seats.

DXjr

Cancelled? Not likely*. Heavily delayed in flow? Very likely.


*Part 117 rest issues aside.

LarkSFO

Wait a sec. We're going from 'horrible meals' to 'no meals'. How is this not an improvement? emoticon:

Thanks channa.

So, in 1,000 flights I will not cancel 950 to 980 times. (100 flights, will not cancel 95 to 98 times)

Granted, it's worse than DL (per your figures), but are these odds a reason to not fly UA?

Also - I imagine with the upgauging (from the smaller RJ's to these Cadillac RJ's), cancellation rates will decrease?

Kacee

Yes, this would absolutely cause me to book away from UA. Same way I already refuse to book SFO-ORD-MSP. I've had too many bad experiences with UAEX.

GoAmtrak

That I feel empathy and solidarity with UA's in-house labor force. That if I was one of them, I'd be looking over my shoulder constantly as the core operation continues to be outsourced. It used to be parody to suggest that mainline flying will be reduced to hub-hub and overwater, but that sure seems to be the way things are headed.

Sure, there are a few reports elsewhere on FT, but here's a quick summary of my experiences with them. I hope this is helpful to would-be Kayakers.

Booking: All fares are o/w based, and either on o/w or r/t SY is usually very competitive for MSP routes. Great calender view on their site. No mobile app, unfortunately (though they do have a mobile site). Seat selection is fee-based until T-24. Bulkheads available at the airport, exit rows for a fee. Domestic change fee is $100.

Schedules: Competitive in the SFO-MSP market (2x-3x daily depending on season), which is all I care about. On-time performance stats aren't available via BTS, but I've never had a problem with them. FlightStats has OTP at 97% overall.

FFP: uFly is spend-based, a straightforward rebate program useful only on SY. Points accrue at 10 for every $1 spent, redeem at roughly 100/$1, and don't expire for three years after any activity. Elites ($5,000/year spend) get comped upgrades at the gate and fee waivers. One great benefit: Just being a member allows for use of priority check-in and security lanes, at least per practice at SFO.

TSA Pre: Not yet, but there's a field to submit one's KTN. Pre hopefully coming soon.

Upgrades: Transparent ToD scheme available at T-24. $119 for SFO-MSP.

Staff: Everyone, from the phone agents to the GAs (outsourced here at SFO) to the FAs, are uniformly friendly. Minnesota cheer all around.

Facilities: MSP T2 is modern and functional. General security line can be long at peak times. At SFO they use the Int'l. A concourse.

Equipment: 737s and 738s. Not the newest aircraft, but consistently clean. Comfortable cloth non-slim Y seats. F pitch is more restrictive on the 737s than the 738s, but the seats are comfier.

In-flight service: Robust BoB program in Y, including rental of digEplayers, which are complimentary in F. Food in F consists of meals at mealtime (or a snack tray on late flights). Sparkling wine is available. Dinner is three courses and starts with a cheese plate, followed by the main tray with salad and entree, and finally a slice of cake. There's usually just one entree, but the last time I faced an entree I couldn't eat, the FA was happy to comp a snack box (as evidenced by the below plate with jerky on it).

kettle1

That is sad when Sun Country is better than UA. Looking at price, Sun Country beats UA hands down on SFO-MSP. I may try them on LAS-MSP.

LarkSFO

Thanks!

Why would anyone fly DL on this route?

Kacee

Six daily nonstops?

channa

I was thinking the same thing.

Even the SY website said full meals are served on flights departing up to 8:00 PM. I think UA's dinner ends at 7:15 PM or so, and becomes a "Snack" thereafter.