United 48 BOM-EWR grounded in BOM because of "badly damaged" engine cover on 777
#47
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Posts: 69,232
#48
Join Date: May 2008
Location: BOI (formerly ORD)
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Posts: 465
A fleeting return of UA RTW service, albiet BOM-HKG instead of the old DEL-HKG route, and sans pax.
#49
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Posts: 11,439
#50
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 19,502
So...if the Indian authorities are correct in their assessment of the extent of the damage then this should be a boost for Boeing: "Boeing aircraft suffers major damage on takeoff, then flies ~8000 miles with no one onboard the plane noticing and lands safely at destination."
#51
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Washington, DC
Programs: UA 1K 1MM, AA, DL
Posts: 7,418
"United Airlines, in a statement mailed to this correspondent, maintained the cowl was intact, while admitting it was damaged. DGCA officials, however, insisted the cowl was missing. "
I find the above excerpted statement (from the Mumbai Mirror) to be as a minium confusing and at worst contradictory. Strictly speaking, something cannot be intact while being damaged.
I find the above excerpted statement (from the Mumbai Mirror) to be as a minium confusing and at worst contradictory. Strictly speaking, something cannot be intact while being damaged.
#52
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#53
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Boston MA
Programs: UA 1K/1.5 million miler, SU Gold, JL Sapphire
Posts: 529
The flight of doom - UA49 (BOM->EWR) Thursday Feb 20th
Mumbai has the reputation of one of the worst airports in the world. That new building will do little to change this if the people are not more professional.
The incoming plane had an issue. Apparently, a big hole in the engine. Everyone at the gate asks what is going on. Local gate agents seem completely panicked, keep on telling everyone "don't worry, they are working on the plane, the plane will eventually take off".
This FF knows better. And United's computers do as well. Eventually, calls get through, the app tells the truth: the flight is canceled. Gate agents just don't know it yet.
OK, what do we do now? Nobody is rebooking anyone. So people start making their own calls. United Reservations puts me on Lufthansa to Munich. Great! Leaves in 2 hours. Cool. What do I do now?
Well, the Lufthansa guy says I need to go through immigration again. Indian regulation. I also need to have someone escort me - from United - to the departure level. That is not happening. Wait 90 minutes, with other FF. We are just stuck. Lufthansa leaves by the time we are taken in charge by United Mumbai agents.
Go to one level. Immigration authorities say no way, can't come through here. OK, then let's go another way. Pass security in opposite directions after negotiating for 20 minutes with CISF. Then, somehow get in arrival hall. Get the luggage.
The chaos still reigns supreme. I try to be helpful: can I fly from Delhi tomorrow please? "Sure". Ensues discussion in Marathi. My flight is "confirmed, please go to the hotel sir, you can verify everything with UA reservations".
By the time I get to the hotel, it is 3:45AM. Get right away in touch with United Reservations. Hell ensues. The Mumbaikars never rebooked me through Delhi. Delhi flight is full anyway. They tried to book through Dubai, but failed - there is space in Dubai, but not to get TO Dubai. Earliest schedule they can get me out? Monday night. And, one agent tells me that I may need to pay money since, after all, I missed my Lufthansa flight!
Not deterred, I contacted a few companies. There is space on Indigo to Mumbai. But international credit cards don't work. I finally get space on Jet Airways. Sure, the flight is overbooked, but then I check in right away for my flight, and get seating.
Call back United. Get Stephanie from SLC. Nice person who saved a miserable day. No problem: grab a seat from Dubai to IAD. And even confirm an upgrade with a Global instrument. Nice. Because by then it is 8:30AM, I am working on reserve batteries.
Mumbai calls me at 11:50, upon me getting kicked out of my hotel room. Saying "I see there has been changes". I tell them in no uncertain terms to back off, they "helped" enough already!
Finally back in the US, I write to United to explain my ordeal with the crew in Mumbai and compliment Stephanie (as opposed to other agents which were less than helpful... what, you screwed up and I end up spending money). I also have them note that I spent some $435 to help them get me back home. I don't get everything back, but I get an answer, and a voucher. Answer is pretty fast arriving, voucher as well.
Voucher that I am more than happy to redeem for a flight back from India. But we'll try Delhi this time, so far I got a better run from that place.
This 1K is obviously not happy. But I am seeing good things nonetheless:
1- There are still some agents that are helpful and will try to rescue you. We should cherish them, and frankly United needs to cherish them too.
2- The Mumbai gate agents are in need of training and leadership. They tried to help, but were ineffectual. They were really caught with their pants down. Communication-wise, their performance was a big zero.
3- NEVER, EVER run down your battery before a out-of-Mumbai flight, thinking you can charge in the plane anyway. You need that phone, it can be your lifeline, because you cannot count on the local team to help you. Only United Reservations really can.
4- Indian immigration regulations are a joke. Hey, I already got out of the country, why do you care which airline I use to do so? From what I know, in other countries, the problem would have been solved.
5- Albeit short of full reimbursement, these compensation miles and travel vouchers were appreciated. They were not puny, and they were a balm.
6- An airport is much more than a building. In Mumbai, the terminal is brand new (a plus - I saw huge roaches in the old terminal). But the problem is that you have the same people operating it with the same dubious procedures. And it has nothing to do with Indians: Indians and Philippinos are running the show in Dubai, and DXB is light miles away from BOM as far as experience goes.
7- That BOM->EWR flight is cursed for me. They once denied me boarding because we were flying in a snowstorm. And back then, I got a $700 voucher. The good old days, 5 year ago, prior to merger.
The incoming plane had an issue. Apparently, a big hole in the engine. Everyone at the gate asks what is going on. Local gate agents seem completely panicked, keep on telling everyone "don't worry, they are working on the plane, the plane will eventually take off".
This FF knows better. And United's computers do as well. Eventually, calls get through, the app tells the truth: the flight is canceled. Gate agents just don't know it yet.
OK, what do we do now? Nobody is rebooking anyone. So people start making their own calls. United Reservations puts me on Lufthansa to Munich. Great! Leaves in 2 hours. Cool. What do I do now?
Well, the Lufthansa guy says I need to go through immigration again. Indian regulation. I also need to have someone escort me - from United - to the departure level. That is not happening. Wait 90 minutes, with other FF. We are just stuck. Lufthansa leaves by the time we are taken in charge by United Mumbai agents.
Go to one level. Immigration authorities say no way, can't come through here. OK, then let's go another way. Pass security in opposite directions after negotiating for 20 minutes with CISF. Then, somehow get in arrival hall. Get the luggage.
The chaos still reigns supreme. I try to be helpful: can I fly from Delhi tomorrow please? "Sure". Ensues discussion in Marathi. My flight is "confirmed, please go to the hotel sir, you can verify everything with UA reservations".
By the time I get to the hotel, it is 3:45AM. Get right away in touch with United Reservations. Hell ensues. The Mumbaikars never rebooked me through Delhi. Delhi flight is full anyway. They tried to book through Dubai, but failed - there is space in Dubai, but not to get TO Dubai. Earliest schedule they can get me out? Monday night. And, one agent tells me that I may need to pay money since, after all, I missed my Lufthansa flight!
Not deterred, I contacted a few companies. There is space on Indigo to Mumbai. But international credit cards don't work. I finally get space on Jet Airways. Sure, the flight is overbooked, but then I check in right away for my flight, and get seating.
Call back United. Get Stephanie from SLC. Nice person who saved a miserable day. No problem: grab a seat from Dubai to IAD. And even confirm an upgrade with a Global instrument. Nice. Because by then it is 8:30AM, I am working on reserve batteries.
Mumbai calls me at 11:50, upon me getting kicked out of my hotel room. Saying "I see there has been changes". I tell them in no uncertain terms to back off, they "helped" enough already!
Finally back in the US, I write to United to explain my ordeal with the crew in Mumbai and compliment Stephanie (as opposed to other agents which were less than helpful... what, you screwed up and I end up spending money). I also have them note that I spent some $435 to help them get me back home. I don't get everything back, but I get an answer, and a voucher. Answer is pretty fast arriving, voucher as well.
Voucher that I am more than happy to redeem for a flight back from India. But we'll try Delhi this time, so far I got a better run from that place.
This 1K is obviously not happy. But I am seeing good things nonetheless:
1- There are still some agents that are helpful and will try to rescue you. We should cherish them, and frankly United needs to cherish them too.
2- The Mumbai gate agents are in need of training and leadership. They tried to help, but were ineffectual. They were really caught with their pants down. Communication-wise, their performance was a big zero.
3- NEVER, EVER run down your battery before a out-of-Mumbai flight, thinking you can charge in the plane anyway. You need that phone, it can be your lifeline, because you cannot count on the local team to help you. Only United Reservations really can.
4- Indian immigration regulations are a joke. Hey, I already got out of the country, why do you care which airline I use to do so? From what I know, in other countries, the problem would have been solved.
5- Albeit short of full reimbursement, these compensation miles and travel vouchers were appreciated. They were not puny, and they were a balm.
6- An airport is much more than a building. In Mumbai, the terminal is brand new (a plus - I saw huge roaches in the old terminal). But the problem is that you have the same people operating it with the same dubious procedures. And it has nothing to do with Indians: Indians and Philippinos are running the show in Dubai, and DXB is light miles away from BOM as far as experience goes.
7- That BOM->EWR flight is cursed for me. They once denied me boarding because we were flying in a snowstorm. And back then, I got a $700 voucher. The good old days, 5 year ago, prior to merger.
#54
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Charlotte
Programs: Hilton Diamond, Marriott Platinum Elite, AA Platinum Pro, Hertz Presidents
Posts: 1,214
Making me feel doubly lucky. First, I flew UA 48 and 49 with no issues, actually arrived a couple hours early EWR-BOM. Second, I'm going back to India, but connecting through DEL, and not BOM! BOM is ridiculous.
#55
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: WAS/ BOM
Programs: UA 1K, Marriott Gold, HHonors Gold
Posts: 1,567
Mumbai has the reputation of one of the worst airports in the world. That new building will do little to change this if the people are not more professional.
The incoming plane had an issue. Apparently, a big hole in the engine. Everyone at the gate asks what is going on. Local gate agents seem completely panicked, keep on telling everyone "don't worry, they are working on the plane, the plane will eventually take off".
This FF knows better. And United's computers do as well. Eventually, calls get through, the app tells the truth: the flight is canceled. Gate agents just don't know it yet.
OK, what do we do now? Nobody is rebooking anyone. So people start making their own calls. United Reservations puts me on Lufthansa to Munich. Great! Leaves in 2 hours. Cool. What do I do now?
Well, the Lufthansa guy says I need to go through immigration again. Indian regulation. I also need to have someone escort me - from United - to the departure level. That is not happening. Wait 90 minutes, with other FF. We are just stuck. Lufthansa leaves by the time we are taken in charge by United Mumbai agents.
Go to one level. Immigration authorities say no way, can't come through here. OK, then let's go another way. Pass security in opposite directions after negotiating for 20 minutes with CISF. Then, somehow get in arrival hall. Get the luggage.
The chaos still reigns supreme. I try to be helpful: can I fly from Delhi tomorrow please? "Sure". Ensues discussion in Marathi. My flight is "confirmed, please go to the hotel sir, you can verify everything with UA reservations".
By the time I get to the hotel, it is 3:45AM. Get right away in touch with United Reservations. Hell ensues. The Mumbaikars never rebooked me through Delhi. Delhi flight is full anyway. They tried to book through Dubai, but failed - there is space in Dubai, but not to get TO Dubai. Earliest schedule they can get me out? Monday night. And, one agent tells me that I may need to pay money since, after all, I missed my Lufthansa flight!
Not deterred, I contacted a few companies. There is space on Indigo to Mumbai. But international credit cards don't work. I finally get space on Jet Airways. Sure, the flight is overbooked, but then I check in right away for my flight, and get seating.
Call back United. Get Stephanie from SLC. Nice person who saved a miserable day. No problem: grab a seat from Dubai to IAD. And even confirm an upgrade with a Global instrument. Nice. Because by then it is 8:30AM, I am working on reserve batteries.
Mumbai calls me at 11:50, upon me getting kicked out of my hotel room. Saying "I see there has been changes". I tell them in no uncertain terms to back off, they "helped" enough already!
Finally back in the US, I write to United to explain my ordeal with the crew in Mumbai and compliment Stephanie (as opposed to other agents which were less than helpful... what, you screwed up and I end up spending money). I also have them note that I spent some $435 to help them get me back home. I don't get everything back, but I get an answer, and a voucher. Answer is pretty fast arriving, voucher as well.
Voucher that I am more than happy to redeem for a flight back from India. But we'll try Delhi this time, so far I got a better run from that place.
This 1K is obviously not happy. But I am seeing good things nonetheless:
1- There are still some agents that are helpful and will try to rescue you. We should cherish them, and frankly United needs to cherish them too.
2- The Mumbai gate agents are in need of training and leadership. They tried to help, but were ineffectual. They were really caught with their pants down. Communication-wise, their performance was a big zero.
3- NEVER, EVER run down your battery before a out-of-Mumbai flight, thinking you can charge in the plane anyway. You need that phone, it can be your lifeline, because you cannot count on the local team to help you. Only United Reservations really can.
4- Indian immigration regulations are a joke. Hey, I already got out of the country, why do you care which airline I use to do so? From what I know, in other countries, the problem would have been solved.
5- Albeit short of full reimbursement, these compensation miles and travel vouchers were appreciated. They were not puny, and they were a balm.
6- An airport is much more than a building. In Mumbai, the terminal is brand new (a plus - I saw huge roaches in the old terminal). But the problem is that you have the same people operating it with the same dubious procedures. And it has nothing to do with Indians: Indians and Philippinos are running the show in Dubai, and DXB is light miles away from BOM as far as experience goes.
7- That BOM->EWR flight is cursed for me. They once denied me boarding because we were flying in a snowstorm. And back then, I got a $700 voucher. The good old days, 5 year ago, prior to merger.
The incoming plane had an issue. Apparently, a big hole in the engine. Everyone at the gate asks what is going on. Local gate agents seem completely panicked, keep on telling everyone "don't worry, they are working on the plane, the plane will eventually take off".
This FF knows better. And United's computers do as well. Eventually, calls get through, the app tells the truth: the flight is canceled. Gate agents just don't know it yet.
OK, what do we do now? Nobody is rebooking anyone. So people start making their own calls. United Reservations puts me on Lufthansa to Munich. Great! Leaves in 2 hours. Cool. What do I do now?
Well, the Lufthansa guy says I need to go through immigration again. Indian regulation. I also need to have someone escort me - from United - to the departure level. That is not happening. Wait 90 minutes, with other FF. We are just stuck. Lufthansa leaves by the time we are taken in charge by United Mumbai agents.
Go to one level. Immigration authorities say no way, can't come through here. OK, then let's go another way. Pass security in opposite directions after negotiating for 20 minutes with CISF. Then, somehow get in arrival hall. Get the luggage.
The chaos still reigns supreme. I try to be helpful: can I fly from Delhi tomorrow please? "Sure". Ensues discussion in Marathi. My flight is "confirmed, please go to the hotel sir, you can verify everything with UA reservations".
By the time I get to the hotel, it is 3:45AM. Get right away in touch with United Reservations. Hell ensues. The Mumbaikars never rebooked me through Delhi. Delhi flight is full anyway. They tried to book through Dubai, but failed - there is space in Dubai, but not to get TO Dubai. Earliest schedule they can get me out? Monday night. And, one agent tells me that I may need to pay money since, after all, I missed my Lufthansa flight!
Not deterred, I contacted a few companies. There is space on Indigo to Mumbai. But international credit cards don't work. I finally get space on Jet Airways. Sure, the flight is overbooked, but then I check in right away for my flight, and get seating.
Call back United. Get Stephanie from SLC. Nice person who saved a miserable day. No problem: grab a seat from Dubai to IAD. And even confirm an upgrade with a Global instrument. Nice. Because by then it is 8:30AM, I am working on reserve batteries.
Mumbai calls me at 11:50, upon me getting kicked out of my hotel room. Saying "I see there has been changes". I tell them in no uncertain terms to back off, they "helped" enough already!
Finally back in the US, I write to United to explain my ordeal with the crew in Mumbai and compliment Stephanie (as opposed to other agents which were less than helpful... what, you screwed up and I end up spending money). I also have them note that I spent some $435 to help them get me back home. I don't get everything back, but I get an answer, and a voucher. Answer is pretty fast arriving, voucher as well.
Voucher that I am more than happy to redeem for a flight back from India. But we'll try Delhi this time, so far I got a better run from that place.
This 1K is obviously not happy. But I am seeing good things nonetheless:
1- There are still some agents that are helpful and will try to rescue you. We should cherish them, and frankly United needs to cherish them too.
2- The Mumbai gate agents are in need of training and leadership. They tried to help, but were ineffectual. They were really caught with their pants down. Communication-wise, their performance was a big zero.
3- NEVER, EVER run down your battery before a out-of-Mumbai flight, thinking you can charge in the plane anyway. You need that phone, it can be your lifeline, because you cannot count on the local team to help you. Only United Reservations really can.
4- Indian immigration regulations are a joke. Hey, I already got out of the country, why do you care which airline I use to do so? From what I know, in other countries, the problem would have been solved.
5- Albeit short of full reimbursement, these compensation miles and travel vouchers were appreciated. They were not puny, and they were a balm.
6- An airport is much more than a building. In Mumbai, the terminal is brand new (a plus - I saw huge roaches in the old terminal). But the problem is that you have the same people operating it with the same dubious procedures. And it has nothing to do with Indians: Indians and Philippinos are running the show in Dubai, and DXB is light miles away from BOM as far as experience goes.
7- That BOM->EWR flight is cursed for me. They once denied me boarding because we were flying in a snowstorm. And back then, I got a $700 voucher. The good old days, 5 year ago, prior to merger.
#56
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Boston MA
Programs: UA 1K/1.5 million miler, SU Gold, JL Sapphire
Posts: 529
Completely understand your pain. This longhaul route has been really cursed for UA. Dunno how it was under CO. The problem with UA staff in Mumbai is that they are not really UA staff (as only one flight coming and one going). They are all contract people who dont know half of the procedures most of the time. You just have to cross your fingers and pray to god that no holes are found in engines and nothing goes wrong. Glad that you were able to get out. Personally - having family there is helpful
And there is one more query I had.
Look. If I take my Hyundai on a trip, say from BOS->ORD, and then I have a mechanical problem on the road. I can pull over for repairs, right? The local car shop is unlikely to tell me "well, sir, we need the parts from your dealership".
So, why isn't GE, Rolls Royce and other companies not maintaining a set of parts in strategic places in the world? Mumbai isn't exactly New York, but it is not Novossibirsk either. There are how many 777 taking off from there?
To my understanding (and, once again, the communication issue with that crew), the parts needs to be flown from the US. The plane flying to that location on that Friday would have left already. So, providing the parts go there via normal operations, the earliest it gets to Mumbai is 9:00 PM on Saturday. That plane is grounded until Sunday.
Maybe there is something I am missing but that sounds ridiculous to me.
As for the Mumbai guys not being United's, in my mind it is United problem nonetheless. They damage the United brand anyway. If they cannot deal with IRROPS, then United should find people able to do the job. Mumbai is a big city, I assume this is doable.
#57
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: New Jersey
Programs: UA MM 1K, AA MM Gold, Marriott LT Platinum
Posts: 3,235
#58
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Southern California, GVA, SIN, LHR, BRU, CDG
Programs: UA LT GS 4.12MM (4.08MM BIS), AA EXP 1.86MM ,DL DM 1.1MM, HH LT Diamond, SPG Platinum
Posts: 1,182
You bet.
And there is one more query I had.
Look. If I take my Hyundai on a trip, say from BOS->ORD, and then I have a mechanical problem on the road. I can pull over for repairs, right? The local car shop is unlikely to tell me "well, sir, we need the parts from your dealership".
So, why isn't GE, Rolls Royce and other companies not maintaining a set of parts in strategic places in the world? Mumbai isn't exactly New York, but it is not Novossibirsk either. There are how many 777 taking off from there?
To my understanding (and, once again, the communication issue with that crew), the parts needs to be flown from the US. The plane flying to that location on that Friday would have left already. So, providing the parts go there via normal operations, the earliest it gets to Mumbai is 9:00 PM on Saturday. That plane is grounded until Sunday.
Maybe there is something I am missing but that sounds ridiculous to me.
As for the Mumbai guys not being United's, in my mind it is United problem nonetheless. They damage the United brand anyway. If they cannot deal with IRROPS, then United should find people able to do the job. Mumbai is a big city, I assume this is doable.
And there is one more query I had.
Look. If I take my Hyundai on a trip, say from BOS->ORD, and then I have a mechanical problem on the road. I can pull over for repairs, right? The local car shop is unlikely to tell me "well, sir, we need the parts from your dealership".
So, why isn't GE, Rolls Royce and other companies not maintaining a set of parts in strategic places in the world? Mumbai isn't exactly New York, but it is not Novossibirsk either. There are how many 777 taking off from there?
To my understanding (and, once again, the communication issue with that crew), the parts needs to be flown from the US. The plane flying to that location on that Friday would have left already. So, providing the parts go there via normal operations, the earliest it gets to Mumbai is 9:00 PM on Saturday. That plane is grounded until Sunday.
Maybe there is something I am missing but that sounds ridiculous to me.
As for the Mumbai guys not being United's, in my mind it is United problem nonetheless. They damage the United brand anyway. If they cannot deal with IRROPS, then United should find people able to do the job. Mumbai is a big city, I assume this is doable.
#59
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: WAS/ BOM
Programs: UA 1K, Marriott Gold, HHonors Gold
Posts: 1,567
I feel your pain. The reality is that outstations that UA serves are always going to be staffed with non-UA personnel who perform just fine when things are going well...but when you have an IRROP such as yours...well, you see what happened. The sad part of it is that even US based agents tend to fall apart with UA's current system and policies. This type of situation is the prime reason our organization dropped UA as our preferred carrier several years ago...if they can't take care of passengers when they, UA, have a problem...well, "the grass really is greener!" Sad, Sad, Sad!
#60
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: IAH, SGN, BKK
Programs: UA 1K
Posts: 396
About 15 years ago I flew NRT-LAX on a NW 742. When I was back in the terminal after clearing customs I noticed that one engine was surrounded by maintenance people.
There was a huge hold in the cowl. It wasn't there when we departed & there was no bird strike on departure. IIRC speculation was that ice had caused it, but I never read any confirmation. Stuff happens.
There was a huge hold in the cowl. It wasn't there when we departed & there was no bird strike on departure. IIRC speculation was that ice had caused it, but I never read any confirmation. Stuff happens.