Go Back  FlyerTalk Forums > Miles&Points > Airlines and Mileage Programs > United Airlines | MileagePlus
Reload this Page >

MP Accounts Closed by UA Alleging Fraud/Misuse

MP Accounts Closed by UA Alleging Fraud/Misuse

Old Mar 13, 15, 7:25 am
  #241  
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Programs: Marriott PE; Hyatt Diamond; Avis PC; Hertz PC; SPG Gold, MP Gold
Posts: 7
MP Compliance has closed account - need advise

Got an email from Compliance that they have found upgrades being bartered / sold and have permanently closed my MP account and zeroed out the miles and upgrades.
I was not going to have any personal travel this year, so I gave away all my GPUs to friends, I don't understand why they would say its been bartered or sold. At this point my 490K RDMs and 1K status is gone - this is aggravating - do I have any recourse?

I have sent an email to compliance and a voicemail to the corp security asking what leads them to believe there is variance from T&Cs but haven't gotten a response. United is one of the preferred corp airlines and the most convenient one for me - I'd hate to have to fly another airline or keep flying united with no credit.

ALSO - does this mean I need to open a new MP account or does it mean I never get to have an MP account again?

Would appreciate tactical advice.
jay_fter is offline  
Old Mar 13, 15, 7:33 am
  #242  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: BOS/ORH
Programs: AS MVPG
Posts: 18,062
I wouldn't open another account because its against T&C and will likely get you into more trouble. I alerted mods to move this over to United forum for you for better advice. Any chance one of your "friends" was already on a watch list for buying or selling upgrades?

Last edited by CDKing; Mar 13, 15 at 7:41 am
CDKing is offline  
Old Mar 13, 15, 8:41 am
  #243  
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: BOS, BWI, DCA, IAD
Programs: American, Delta, JetBlue, United
Posts: 1,942
Originally Posted by jay_fter View Post
Got an email from Compliance that they have found upgrades being bartered / sold and have permanently closed my MP account and zeroed out the miles and upgrades.
I was not going to have any personal travel this year, so I gave away all my GPUs to friends, I don't understand why they would say its been bartered or sold. At this point my 490K RDMs and 1K status is gone - this is aggravating - do I have any recourse?

I have sent an email to compliance and a voicemail to the corp security asking what leads them to believe there is variance from T&Cs but haven't gotten a response. United is one of the preferred corp airlines and the most convenient one for me - I'd hate to have to fly another airline or keep flying united with no credit.

ALSO - does this mean I need to open a new MP account or does it mean I never get to have an MP account again?

Would appreciate tactical advice.
Welcome to FT!

I doubt very much that UA would allow you to open a new FF account under the circumstances. If you are able to show them that you have not violated the regulations of your current account, they will re-open that account and restore your miles.

It's not clear from your post how many GPU's are in question or how many recipients were involved, but it's quite possible that a large number of GPU's being transferred to apparently unrelated recipients would attract UA's attention. (I am not suggesting that you post this information; I'm just stating that it's hard to comment without knowing the specifics.) But the burden of proof is probably on you to convince UA that your account activity which at least looks suspicious is in fact aboveboard.
JPG3392 is offline  
Old Mar 13, 15, 12:39 pm
  #244  
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Minneapolis: DL DM charter 2.3MM
Programs: A3*Gold, SPG Plat, HyattDiamond, MarriottPP, LHW exAccess, ICI, Raffles Amb, NW PE MM, TWA Gold MM
Posts: 87,637
Take a hard look at the people who were recipients of your GPUs. Do you genuinely trust them? Is there a chance that they sold your upgrade instruments to a broker? Have they bought upgrades from others in the past?

You might need to show UA that these people really are your friends. How do you know them (former roommate, from same home town, went to college together, work together, distant relative, etc.), especially if they seem to be random individuals flying from a variety of locations.
MSPeconomist is offline  
Old Mar 13, 15, 12:43 pm
  #245  
Moderator: American AAdvantage, TAP, Mexico, Technical Support and Feedback, and The Suggestion Box
 
Join Date: May 2000
Location: NorCal - SMF area
Programs: AA LT Plat; HH LT Diamond, Maître-plongeur des Muccis
Posts: 62,295
Our extensive number of reports on ClyerTalk from similar situations suggest:

1) Do NOT attempt to open a duplicate account! At this point, you are banned from doing so, so it would demonstrate prima facie non- compliance and likely would result in confiscation.

2) Contact their revenue protection unit / Compliance and have a dialogue in hopes you can get account, etc. restoration.

3) Be entirely forthcoming - these folks invariably know more than the account holder thinks they do. If you sold or bartered - engaged in any quid pro quo for - any GPUs to others, disclose.

4) Even if you had sold to a broker, they might release your account - with penalties - if you cooperate fully and fully disclose. They'd generally rather get the broker.

The UAMP Firum probably has threads relating similar issues with recommendations and guidance from UAMP members.
JDiver is offline  
Old Mar 13, 15, 1:16 pm
  #246  
Moderator, Alaska Airlines & FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: SGF
Programs: AS, AA, UA, AGR (ex-75K, GLD, 1K, and S+), Choice Diamond, HZ PC, Costco Exec, NPS Passport
Posts: 22,925
Originally Posted by jay_fter View Post
Got an email from Compliance that they have found upgrades being bartered / sold and have permanently closed my MP account and zeroed out the miles and upgrades.
I was not going to have any personal travel this year, so I gave away all my GPUs to friends, I don't understand why they would say its been bartered or sold. At this point my 490K RDMs and 1K status is gone - this is aggravating - do I have any recourse?

I have sent an email to compliance and a voicemail to the corp security asking what leads them to believe there is variance from T&Cs but haven't gotten a response. United is one of the preferred corp airlines and the most convenient one for me - I'd hate to have to fly another airline or keep flying united with no credit.

ALSO - does this mean I need to open a new MP account or does it mean I never get to have an MP account again?

Would appreciate tactical advice.
As several others have suggested, I will go ahead and move this over to the United Airlines forum, where the experts will surely be able to guide you further.

jackal
Moderator, Information Desk
jackal is offline  
Old Mar 13, 15, 1:26 pm
  #247  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 10,027
UA doesn't take the issue of closing an account lightly. They're gonna have some pretty good evidence of conduct or use of benefits flagrantly in violation of the T&Cs to make that drastic step. Pleading ignorance is not going to get you anywhere. You need to find out what the violations were and address them.
IAH-OIL-TRASH is offline  
Old Mar 13, 15, 1:39 pm
  #248  
Suspended
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: FIND ME ON TWITTER FOR THE LATEST
Posts: 27,733
Originally Posted by jay_fter View Post
...so I gave away all my GPUs to friends, I don't understand why they would say its been bartered or sold.
Think very carefully if this claim will hold up to close scrutiny before sticking with it.
JonNYC is offline  
Old Mar 13, 15, 2:10 pm
  #249  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Benicia CA
Programs: Alaska MVP Gold 75K, AA 3.8MM, UA 1.1MM, enjoying the retired life
Posts: 31,439
Originally Posted by MSPeconomist View Post
Is there a chance that they sold your upgrade instruments to a broker?
Is that even possible at UA? When I was a 1K I sponsored 7 different systemwide upgrades my last year, all requiring me to input the request via my account on the web site. How does the sponsored party go about selling the upgrade to someone else?

Tom in Belfast
tom911 is offline  
Old Mar 13, 15, 5:52 pm
  #250  
Moderator, Alaska Airlines & FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: SGF
Programs: AS, AA, UA, AGR (ex-75K, GLD, 1K, and S+), Choice Diamond, HZ PC, Costco Exec, NPS Passport
Posts: 22,925
Originally Posted by tom911 View Post
Is that even possible at UA? When I was a 1K I sponsored 7 different systemwide upgrades my last year, all requiring me to input the request via my account on the web site. How does the sponsored party go about selling the upgrade to someone else?

Tom in Belfast
That thought did occur to me, too. Any time I've donated a GPU to a (legitimate) friend and they've had to make a change, I've had to be involved in the transaction and provide my MP account's PIN to the agent to do anything with the upgrade instrument.
jackal is offline  
Old Mar 13, 15, 7:21 pm
  #251  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: BOS/EAP
Programs: UA 1K, MR LTT, HH Gold, Amex Plat
Posts: 25,047
Originally Posted by Kacee View Post
I've never had a problem with legitimately gifted instruments, giving or receiving.

But when UA sees an ad on e-bay or craigslist, that's probably an indication there's a violation
I have given mine away many times. Miles, GPU, RPU ... never an issue. It sounds like UA takes a hard look at those cases where they are near certain someone 'sold' them for money.
cfischer is online now  
Old Mar 13, 15, 7:29 pm
  #252  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Bangkok or San Francisco
Programs: United 1k, Marriott Lifetime PE, Former DL Gold, Former SQ Solitaire, HH Gold
Posts: 11,881
Originally Posted by IAH-OIL-TRASH View Post
UA doesn't take the issue of closing an account lightly. They're gonna have some pretty good evidence of conduct or use of benefits flagrantly in violation of the T&Cs to make that drastic step. Pleading ignorance is not going to get you anywhere. You need to find out what the violations were and address them.
Pop on over to E-Bay and search on United Upgrades. You can almost always find one or two offerings. What they do is to say they are selling "advice" on how to get upgrades. The advice costs $0.01. Of course, part of the "advice" you're going to get is that for $400 the seller will arrange an upgrade for you.

They used to offer them openly for $400 but that was clearly a violation, so they come up with this new "trick".

E-Bay goes after them somewhat aggressively as they are now cheating E-Bay out of their commissions.

Whenever I see them, I report them to E-Bay.

All United has to do is ask E-Bay and they will probably cooperate. Or invest the one cent to get the seller to reveal who he really is.
Tchiowa is offline  
Old Mar 14, 15, 10:20 am
  #253  
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Programs: UA 1K, Hilton ♦ , Hyatt Carbonado, Wyndham ♦, Marriott PE, "Stinking Bum" elsewhere.
Posts: 3,439
Originally Posted by Tchiowa View Post
Pop on over to E-Bay and search on United Upgrades. You can almost always find one or two offerings……….

All United has to do is ask E-Bay and they will probably cooperate. Or invest the one cent to get the seller to reveal who he really is.
Many years ago, I was a witness in a bankruptcy case where a businessman was suspected of liquidating business assets on Ebay. I found out at that time that there is a service you can pay for that allows access to all Ebay transactions back to the beginning of Ebay, and that it is quite easy to get the name, address, bank account, and paypal info of a seller for a legitimate reason.

Last edited by zombietooth; Mar 14, 15 at 10:29 am
zombietooth is offline  
Old Mar 26, 15, 6:28 pm
  #254  
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Programs: Marriott PE; Hyatt Diamond; Avis PC; Hertz PC; SPG Gold, MP Gold
Posts: 7
Originally Posted by JonNYC View Post
Think very carefully if this claim will hold up to close scrutiny before sticking with it.
Yes it would,If I had to prove it - I could probably go by emails, social media to prove ties with the friends - discussions about travel and that I promised them an upgrade - maybe even have them sign something writing & get it notarized.

Not sure how much it matters though and if I have the patience or energy to deal with recourse. I will keep flying for work - United makes the most sense given my locations - I bit the bullet, called up Corp Sec - they wouldn't disclose the evidence, but said I was a high revenue 1-K and they'd make an exception for me and let me open a new account again to start afresh. I guess its something they typically don't let others do.

Got the account, figured it would suck to not get Econ+, so got an upgrade to MP Silver based on my Marriott Plat, have enough travel planned this year to get back to 1-K.
jay_fter is offline  
Old Mar 27, 15, 9:57 am
  #255  
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Denver & Phoenix
Programs: UA 2MM, Life UC, Global Entry (UK citizen)
Posts: 129
Originally Posted by jay_fter View Post
Got an email from Compliance that they have found upgrades being bartered / sold and have permanently closed my MP account and zeroed out the miles and upgrades.
I was not going to have any personal travel this year, so I gave away all my GPUs to friends, I don't understand why they would say its been bartered or sold. At this point my 490K RDMs and 1K status is gone - this is aggravating ...
Would appreciate tactical advice.
Speaking for myself, If I gave away (to anybody) all my GPU's and United closed my account, I would sue them for damages and legal costs. THEY would be the ones committing fraud and/or theft and/or defamation of character.

However, having said all that, if you "gave" your GPUs away but "sold advice" at the same time, I'm afraid you've bartered your GPUs and you're out of luck.

Originally Posted by jay_fter View Post
...I was not going to have any personal travel this year, so I gave away all my GPUs to friends...
Originally Posted by jay_fter View Post
...Got the account...have enough travel planned this year to get back to 1-K.
(Always upgraded to Business/First by your company?) Glad you now have a lot of travel planned.

Hey, net-net, I feel bad for you but am glad you got your account back.

Last edited by FlyinHawaiian; Mar 27, 15 at 10:32 am Reason: Merge
EMan is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Search Engine: