pdx1M

I'm not sure why but the idea that there are rational value based choices that a person may make based on a company's approach to customer relationship management and that likewise there are rational customer relationship management choices that a company may make to attract and retain valuable customers seems to not be part of some folks view of these questions. The constant use of "emotional" terminology like love (or for that matter hate by some of the more rabid trashers of UA) seems to want to always drag these discussions into a space where rational choices aren't in play.

UA has made some cost/benefit choices in how they manage their customer base that has resulted in certain approaches to service. I can only assume that UA thinks these choices are effective ones, though as I have stated before, choices that seem to alienate profitable customers are not ones *I* understand. Likewise, those of us impacted by UA's choices to reduce the service value we see from our purchases make similarly rational cost/value choices to move business elsewhere when that makes sense.

All I know is that under the pmUA business model I was sufficiently pleased with the services I received from pmUA that I gave them enough business to maintain GS status from the start of that program through the merger. Now I find that the service level I see from UA (for purchasing premium cabin tickets even - we're not talking miles or upgrades here) is sufficiently bad that I don't think it is worth the purchase if a viable alternative exists on the route I need. There isn't an love or hate here - just an evaluation of what I get for my money. Am I sad that my acceptable options for travel no longer include UA - of course. I'd always like more options. Am I some strange jilted lover - not at all.

FiveMileFinal

I guess where it gets emotional for me is watching people recount bad experience after bad experience and yet still shrug their shoulders and reason their way into giving this airline more money because they feel powerless or complacent or whatever. I know United feels like its sole customer is Wall Street and the investment firms that bankroll it, but they will only hang around for so long, and the people who fly them are the ones who will provide the revenue in the end.

You should never feel like you have no choice when traveling. When an airline treats you badly, you just don't give them your business. If you continue to do so, you implicitly condone their bad behavior.

I know there are plenty who have not yet had a bad experience, and my message is not for those people. They should continue to fly the "friendly" skies. But if you have been treated badly by them, your only real choice is to leave. You deserve better as a customer and paying client. Just get out. Anything else is an excuse. Period.

kettle1

Agree 100%.

I understand why some with lifetime status stick with UA. That is why I did not put all my eggs in one basket. But some come on FT and defend every poor decision UA continues to make. If you love the new UA stick with them.

For those that do not have lifetime status, it is crazy to stick with the new UA, unless you like sub-par service, meals, seats, entertainment, lounges and overall flying experience Domestic. International UA just "plane" sucks compared to other carriers. For those that live in SFO, DEN, etc. I also understand sticking with UA. But almost any other city - no excuse.

The new UA has turned into Laker Airways or People Express of the 1980's, oh yes! People Express is part of the New UA. Or Texas International for that matter.

If no lifetime status - move on.
If lifetime status - stick with UA, and enjoy your flt.

DCBob

So many FlyerTalkers are joined at the hip with one or maybe two airlines and keep moving to others based on one or two very bad experiences. The grass is always greener on another airline.

What matters to me is which airline can get me from Point A to Point B in a reasonably timely manner (barring bad weather) and with fairly decent service. I'm not looking for Unobtainium Airlines, just a fairly good airline. Forget about loyalty and frequent flyer programs - look at where you are traveling to and from - that's all that really matters. Yes, I'm Premier Plat and a Million Miler with United and Diamond Medallion with Delta. I've traveled a LOT on both airlines - less on American and USAirways, but a decent number of trips on those airlines, too.

The bottom line is that if you blindfolded me and took me on a two-hour trip on any of those four airlines (without the airline being mentioned by FAs or the safety video), I wouldn't have the faintest idea of which airline I was on. Period. Sometimes when I've boarded and sat in my seat I even momentarily forget which airline I'm flying. YMMV.

kettle1

Disagree - Are you saying service is the same on domestic flts? Close your eyes and see if you get drink service on WN LAX-LAS in Y or UA. WN wins.

On a two hour trip, perhaps - but when the Pilot or FA announces "thank you" fly flying CO. What airline are you flying?

UA, CO, Eastern, Frontier (the former), People Express, New York Air?

Face it - the new UA is not the UA of the past. CO is not the CO of the past either, before Lorenzo and crew destroyed the airline Robert F. Six built and ran from LAX not Texas.

Was customer service written out of the latest Union contracts at UA? My last flt was on DL and received 3 pre-flt drinks (and the flt was on-time). I have not seen this on UA in years. Also the meals in FC were much better on DL.

flyingscots

My impression as someone who was going to move over to united is that they were slow to respond and their call centres were very poor compared to my last 14 yrs as an AA EXP. I am so glad I have stayed with AA and having flown 4 times in their new international J class across the pond, in the last 3 weeks, I can absolutely recommend it. The new planes are brilliant, morale seems really high and Cust service with AA rocks. I don't know why people would stay with United, other than hubs/routes. United seem to be stuck in a timewarp. Here's an article re the new domestic J - it seems similar to international

http://www.businessinsider.com/revie...s-a321t-2014-1

meFIRST

1) What did you like most about fkaUA or fkaCO?

-They fly to places I go to. Lots of non stops ex-NYC ( EWR,LGA,JFK)
-Frequency of service to/from NYC
-EWR is close to my office / downtown / west side
-JFK p.s service
-24 hour standby ( this is huge. I was once able to string a flight down for 4 days )

2) What changes have had the greatest negative impact on you?

-Loss of international routes : Example IAD-DME (this in particular). Other examples EWR-EZE, EWR-IST
-Devaluation of mileage plus
-Since merger : Lack of elite special treatment / recognition by United personnel ( pmUA used to do this). I might as well be a General member.
-Cuts to staff at airports ( replaced by Kiosks). My travel tends to be complex, visa check, passport check, flight changes, IRRPOS, interline bags - all of this requires agent assistance. Smisek wants pax to tag bags and to replace most airport agents with Kiosks : not a customer friendly move
-IT systems that fail : Shares


3) What remains about the current UA that makes it hard for you to leave?

-Still has the most non stops ex NYC
-They still fly to most places I go to ( not all, but most)
-Familiarity

4) What airlines are you considering switching to? Or kayaking?

Aeroflot ( partially switched)
American ( for some routes)

5) What benefits / improvements do you expect on your new airline?

Courtesy Kindness Respect
Nicer planes and service ( both AA and SU)
Better mileage program (AA)

6) What aspects of the new airline make it hard for you to switch to them?

American international routes are weak + weak presence in NYC in comparison to UA at EWR
Aeroflot was an easy and very nice switch.

LaserSailor

I agree with your "blindfold test " 100%...it does seem like there gets to be a child-like obsession with the "I've left and you must too" crowd. Maybe this comes down to those who have to be excited about the airline they fly and feel "it's the best" I don't share that need nor understand it, it's a brand of soap, after all. My experience on both DL and UA is excellent but not different in any material way.

RNE

People bemoan and gripe all the time about everything. When they shrug their shoulders it is not a sign of futility but of recantation.

People have their choice of bad airlines. That's some choice.

The only way to avoid a bad airline is to avoid them all.

RNE, it's a Hobson's Choice.

Always Flyin

What I see is a child-like stubbornness to concede that United has become a passenger unfriendly, crappy airline that truly believes it has a captive audience who will fly them no matter what they do. Like a battered spouse who is repeatedly advised that they are being abused and should leave, but who ignores the advice and remains, there are a group of United passengers (and posters here) who will do the same. Some have a good reason for it (e.g., they are based in EWR or IAH and have no viable choices for domestic as most of the remainder of the country does).

Sure, domestic airlines are mostly the same if you are shlepping from Indianapolis to Cleveland on a regional jet. When I fly from LAX to NRT, there are multiple choices and United comes out at the bottom of that list. For the ongoing flight to BKK, they are not even on the list anymore.

Some airlines are worse than others. United is now at the bottom of the heap. You pick the best of the bad on domestic flights.

On international flights, there actually are good airlines. United is not one of them.

RNE

No.

CMK10

A Hobson's Choice is a choice where there really only is one option. It's not a situation where there are many choices, none of which are good, which is what flying in the US is.

I also disagree with you when you say there are no good airlines but that's a matter of opinion.

RNE

There really is only one option. Fly on a bad airline or don't fly at all.

Is it really so hard to see the airlines are in lockstep? Really?

FiveMileFinal

Disagree.

Then the other airlines should tell United to church it up. The wheels have come off the bus.

If Delta, Southwest, American, and USAirways are D airlines, United is a Z airline.

Always Flyin

I'm flying CX in F from HKG to LAX in few days. Compared to United, it is the finest airline in the world.

You need to get out more.

You're being kind to give them a letter at all . . .