Jan 12, 2014, 3:56 pm
Last edit by: WineCountryUA
This thread is for posting about how the PQDs for particular flown segments post to the United website. How many PQDs posted for a particular segment, the timing of the posting, and similar issues belong here.
For a more general discussion and Q&A about PQDs, use this thread: http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/unite...ad-2014-a.html
How many PQDs will post for each segment?
We're still trying to figure that out! In general, though, here's how it's supposed to work: For each fare* in your itinerary, the PQDs (airfare + YQ) for that fare will be distributed across the segments associated with that fare using an "industry standard" method that is opaque.
*Airline tickets are generally priced all the way from your origin to your destination as a single one-way or half-round-trip fare. For example, if you fly LAX-SFO-EWR-LHR-FRA//FRA-IAD-DEN-LAX, there will usually be a single half-rount-trip fare associated with the entire outbound trip, and a single half-round-trip fare associated with the entire return trip. In general, you do not pay a specific price for each segment of your trip. Understanding this simple idea is fundamental to understanding how airfare is priced. Sometimes, though, your trip will be made up of several fares all tacked together. For example, it could be that the return trip in the above example is constructed as FRA-IAD-DEN//DEN-LAX. In this case, the fare is said to "break" at DEN. It is essential to know where fare breaks occur in your itinerary in order to predict/explain PQD earnings for each segment. (You should probably learn how this stuff works anyway, because it can help you understand why some tickets cost more than others, where you can put in a free stopover, etc.)
What is the most helpful way for me to report the PQD breakdown for a trip I took?
If you want to contribute the most information possible, post the PQDs associated with each segment of your trip, and post the full fare construction of your trip.
To see the fare construction, go to the Saudi Airlines website, click on "Manage Bookings," click "eTicket," and enter your ticket number (beginning with 016). There's also a browser extension/script available to ease the Saudia link/searching: http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/unite...-analysis.html.
A few notes on how contract fares can be negotiated per daniellam:
For a more general discussion and Q&A about PQDs, use this thread: http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/unite...ad-2014-a.html
How many PQDs will post for each segment?
We're still trying to figure that out! In general, though, here's how it's supposed to work: For each fare* in your itinerary, the PQDs (airfare + YQ) for that fare will be distributed across the segments associated with that fare using an "industry standard" method that is opaque.
*Airline tickets are generally priced all the way from your origin to your destination as a single one-way or half-round-trip fare. For example, if you fly LAX-SFO-EWR-LHR-FRA//FRA-IAD-DEN-LAX, there will usually be a single half-rount-trip fare associated with the entire outbound trip, and a single half-round-trip fare associated with the entire return trip. In general, you do not pay a specific price for each segment of your trip. Understanding this simple idea is fundamental to understanding how airfare is priced. Sometimes, though, your trip will be made up of several fares all tacked together. For example, it could be that the return trip in the above example is constructed as FRA-IAD-DEN//DEN-LAX. In this case, the fare is said to "break" at DEN. It is essential to know where fare breaks occur in your itinerary in order to predict/explain PQD earnings for each segment. (You should probably learn how this stuff works anyway, because it can help you understand why some tickets cost more than others, where you can put in a free stopover, etc.)
What is the most helpful way for me to report the PQD breakdown for a trip I took?
If you want to contribute the most information possible, post the PQDs associated with each segment of your trip, and post the full fare construction of your trip.
To see the fare construction, go to the Saudi Airlines website, click on "Manage Bookings," click "eTicket," and enter your ticket number (beginning with 016). There's also a browser extension/script available to ease the Saudia link/searching: http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/unite...-analysis.html.
A few notes on how contract fares can be negotiated per daniellam:
Having used bulk and corporate negotiated fare tickets in the past and being familiar with the the various ticketing methods used by travel agencies, the following are three methods which I have observed and each have their own implications in terms of accounting/reimbursement by the travel agency and their corporate client ("employer") as well as the earning of PQDs.
In each of these scenarios, we will assume the following (ignoring taxes and other fees the corporate travel agency may add on top):
- The regular published fare before corporate discount is $1,000
- Negotiated corporate fare contract allows the fare to be sold for $750 (travel agent keeps $50) with the net fare being $700.
- Payment method is credit card in all cases, and the employee buying the ticket is reimbursed for the amount charged to the credit card.
Method 1 - Published Fare with Commission Method (only if contract allows this method to be used)
Fare on e-ticket receipt shows: $1,000 (this can be pulled up on united.com)
"Commission" claimed when ticket issued: $300 (travel agent keeps $50) [A special corporate code is entered onto the e-ticket]
What the e-ticket looks like to the passenger: Looks just just any other e-ticket that was purchased directly from United Airlines, with the exception of a code in the "tour code" field (not normally visible on united.com).
Invoice from travel agency shows: $1,000
Payment flow:
1) Passenger is charged $1,000 on his corporate AMEX (merchant on credit card bill shows up as "United Airilnes") and the employer reimburses him $1,000 once an expense report is completed.
2) Travel Agency receives $300 "commission" from the airline and keeps $50.
3) Travel Agency cuts a check to the employer for $250.
End result: The employer pays $1,000 less $250 for a net of $750. (Note: The employer may bill the client $1,000 for the employee's travel if they can get away with it).
PQD Earned: $1,000
Implications: More accounting work needs to be done by travel agency to determine how much to pay the employer. Employer needs to pay the published fare and wait for the "rebate" from the travel agency.
Method 2 - Published Fare with Corporate Discount (only if contract allows this method to be used)
Fare on e-ticket receipt shows: $750 (this can be pulled up on united.com)
[A "ticket designator" is added to the fare basis (eg. QUP14QPN/CORP) where as an example "CORP" is the ticket designator to denote "corporate fare")]
"Commission" claimed when ticket issued: $50 (travel agent keeps $50) [A special corporate code is entered onto the e-ticket as well]
What the e-ticket looks like to the passenger: Looks just just any other e-ticket that was purchased directly from United Airlines, with the exception of a code in the "tour code" field, "ticket designator" (not normally visible on united.com) and of course a lower fare than what it would have been if purchased on united.com.
Invoice from travel agency shows: $750
Payment flow:
1) Passenger is charged $750 on his corporate AMEX (merchant on credit card bill shows up as "United Airilnes") and the employer reimburses him $750 once an expense report is completed.
2) Travel Agency receives $50 "commission" from the airline and keeps $50.
End result: The employer pays a net fare of $750. (Note: The employer may only be able to bill the client $750 in this case).
PQD Earned: $750
Implications: Less accounting work needs to be done by travel agency. Employer does not need to wait for "rebate", but can only bill the client the fare less corporate discount.
Method 3A - Bulk Ticketing with "credit card" as form of payment (perhaps this method seems to be the easiest to use when automated online booking tools such as Concur are used to automatically quote fares/issue tickets as only the "bulk" fare between specified city pairs need to be loaded into the system instead of having to program a bunch of specialized ticketing instructions into the system for each corporate contract???)
Fare on e-ticket receipt shows: "BULK" or "BT" or "IT" (this can be pulled up on united.com)
[Note: When the travel agent issues the ticket, $750 is entered as the fare with a "BULK"/"BT"/"IT" flag added so that the fare dosen't show up on the ticket. This results in the fare amount being transmitted only the the revenue accounting department of the airline, while other staff at the airline don't see the price]
"Commission" claimed when ticket issued: $50 (travel agent keeps $50) [A special corporate code is entered onto the e-ticket as well]
What the e-ticket looks like to the passenger: "BULK" / "BT" / "IT" in fare box, as well as a fare basis that may either be that of a published fare or an obscure one such as "YBULK".
Invoice from travel agency shows: $750
Payment flow:
1) Passenger is charged $750 on his corporate AMEX (merchant on credit card bill shows up as "United Airilnes") and the employer reimburses him $750 once an expense report is completed.
2) Travel Agency receives $50 "commission" from the airline and keeps $50.
End result: The employer pays a net fare of $750. (Note: The employer may only be able to bill the client $750).
PQD Earned: $0 [Because United dosen't know how much was actually paid without referring to their revenue accounting department]
Implications: Minimal accounting work needs to be done by travel agency. Employer does not need to wait for rebate. Employee does not get PQD.
Method 3B - Bulk Ticketing with "Cash" or "Invoice" as form of payment (even though payment is by credit card)
Fare on e-ticket receipt shows: "BULK" or "BT" or "IT" (this can be pulled up on united.com)
[Note: When the travel agent issues the ticket, $700 is entered as the fare with a "BULK"/"BT"/"IT" flag added so that the fare dosen't show up on the ticket. This results in the fare amount being transmitted only the the revenue accounting department of the airline, while other staff at the airline don't see the price]
"Commission" claimed when ticket issued: $0
What the e-ticket looks like to the passenger: "BULK" / "BT" / "IT" in fare box, as well as a fare basis that may either be that of a published fare or an obscure one such as "YBULK".
Invoice from travel agency shows: $750 (note the agent is basically selling that $700 ticket for $750)
Payment flow:
1) Passenger is charged $750 on his corporate AMEX (merchant on credit card bill shows up as "AMERICAN EXPRESS TRAVEL" instead of "United Airlines") and the employer reimburses him $750 once an expense report is completed.
End result: The employer pays a net fare of $750. (Note: The employer may only be able to bill the client $750).
PQD Earned: $0 [Because United dosen't know how much was actually paid without referring to their revenue accounting department]
Implications: Minimal accounting work needs to be done by travel agency. Employer does not need to wait for rebate. Employee does not get PQD.
Voucher impact on PQDs is covered in Vouchers in the PQD era In each of these scenarios, we will assume the following (ignoring taxes and other fees the corporate travel agency may add on top):
- The regular published fare before corporate discount is $1,000
- Negotiated corporate fare contract allows the fare to be sold for $750 (travel agent keeps $50) with the net fare being $700.
- Payment method is credit card in all cases, and the employee buying the ticket is reimbursed for the amount charged to the credit card.
Method 1 - Published Fare with Commission Method (only if contract allows this method to be used)
Fare on e-ticket receipt shows: $1,000 (this can be pulled up on united.com)
"Commission" claimed when ticket issued: $300 (travel agent keeps $50) [A special corporate code is entered onto the e-ticket]
What the e-ticket looks like to the passenger: Looks just just any other e-ticket that was purchased directly from United Airlines, with the exception of a code in the "tour code" field (not normally visible on united.com).
Invoice from travel agency shows: $1,000
Payment flow:
1) Passenger is charged $1,000 on his corporate AMEX (merchant on credit card bill shows up as "United Airilnes") and the employer reimburses him $1,000 once an expense report is completed.
2) Travel Agency receives $300 "commission" from the airline and keeps $50.
3) Travel Agency cuts a check to the employer for $250.
End result: The employer pays $1,000 less $250 for a net of $750. (Note: The employer may bill the client $1,000 for the employee's travel if they can get away with it).
PQD Earned: $1,000
Implications: More accounting work needs to be done by travel agency to determine how much to pay the employer. Employer needs to pay the published fare and wait for the "rebate" from the travel agency.
Method 2 - Published Fare with Corporate Discount (only if contract allows this method to be used)
Fare on e-ticket receipt shows: $750 (this can be pulled up on united.com)
[A "ticket designator" is added to the fare basis (eg. QUP14QPN/CORP) where as an example "CORP" is the ticket designator to denote "corporate fare")]
"Commission" claimed when ticket issued: $50 (travel agent keeps $50) [A special corporate code is entered onto the e-ticket as well]
What the e-ticket looks like to the passenger: Looks just just any other e-ticket that was purchased directly from United Airlines, with the exception of a code in the "tour code" field, "ticket designator" (not normally visible on united.com) and of course a lower fare than what it would have been if purchased on united.com.
Invoice from travel agency shows: $750
Payment flow:
1) Passenger is charged $750 on his corporate AMEX (merchant on credit card bill shows up as "United Airilnes") and the employer reimburses him $750 once an expense report is completed.
2) Travel Agency receives $50 "commission" from the airline and keeps $50.
End result: The employer pays a net fare of $750. (Note: The employer may only be able to bill the client $750 in this case).
PQD Earned: $750
Implications: Less accounting work needs to be done by travel agency. Employer does not need to wait for "rebate", but can only bill the client the fare less corporate discount.
Method 3A - Bulk Ticketing with "credit card" as form of payment (perhaps this method seems to be the easiest to use when automated online booking tools such as Concur are used to automatically quote fares/issue tickets as only the "bulk" fare between specified city pairs need to be loaded into the system instead of having to program a bunch of specialized ticketing instructions into the system for each corporate contract???)
Fare on e-ticket receipt shows: "BULK" or "BT" or "IT" (this can be pulled up on united.com)
[Note: When the travel agent issues the ticket, $750 is entered as the fare with a "BULK"/"BT"/"IT" flag added so that the fare dosen't show up on the ticket. This results in the fare amount being transmitted only the the revenue accounting department of the airline, while other staff at the airline don't see the price]
"Commission" claimed when ticket issued: $50 (travel agent keeps $50) [A special corporate code is entered onto the e-ticket as well]
What the e-ticket looks like to the passenger: "BULK" / "BT" / "IT" in fare box, as well as a fare basis that may either be that of a published fare or an obscure one such as "YBULK".
Invoice from travel agency shows: $750
Payment flow:
1) Passenger is charged $750 on his corporate AMEX (merchant on credit card bill shows up as "United Airilnes") and the employer reimburses him $750 once an expense report is completed.
2) Travel Agency receives $50 "commission" from the airline and keeps $50.
End result: The employer pays a net fare of $750. (Note: The employer may only be able to bill the client $750).
PQD Earned: $0 [Because United dosen't know how much was actually paid without referring to their revenue accounting department]
Implications: Minimal accounting work needs to be done by travel agency. Employer does not need to wait for rebate. Employee does not get PQD.
Method 3B - Bulk Ticketing with "Cash" or "Invoice" as form of payment (even though payment is by credit card)
Fare on e-ticket receipt shows: "BULK" or "BT" or "IT" (this can be pulled up on united.com)
[Note: When the travel agent issues the ticket, $700 is entered as the fare with a "BULK"/"BT"/"IT" flag added so that the fare dosen't show up on the ticket. This results in the fare amount being transmitted only the the revenue accounting department of the airline, while other staff at the airline don't see the price]
"Commission" claimed when ticket issued: $0
What the e-ticket looks like to the passenger: "BULK" / "BT" / "IT" in fare box, as well as a fare basis that may either be that of a published fare or an obscure one such as "YBULK".
Invoice from travel agency shows: $750 (note the agent is basically selling that $700 ticket for $750)
Payment flow:
1) Passenger is charged $750 on his corporate AMEX (merchant on credit card bill shows up as "AMERICAN EXPRESS TRAVEL" instead of "United Airlines") and the employer reimburses him $750 once an expense report is completed.
End result: The employer pays a net fare of $750. (Note: The employer may only be able to bill the client $750).
PQD Earned: $0 [Because United dosen't know how much was actually paid without referring to their revenue accounting department]
Implications: Minimal accounting work needs to be done by travel agency. Employer does not need to wait for rebate. Employee does not get PQD.
It Begins: PQDs Posting on United.com
Feb 26, 2014, 3:58 pm
#556
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: PBI / FLL / YUL
Programs: UA 1K, Delta Plat, AA Plat, Marriott Titanium, Hilton Diamond, Hyatt Courtesy Card
Posts: 1,983
I've had this happen several times this year, and there was a pretty substantial lag on my last two flights in particular.
Feb 26, 2014, 4:06 pm
#557
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: NYC or SEA depending on the week
Programs: UA 1k, Hyatt Diamond (no I will not use the new name), Marriott/ SPG lt Plat, JPM Reserve, Amex Plat
Posts: 303
How long did it take for yours to change from processing to the number?
Feb 26, 2014, 4:25 pm
#558
Join Date: Jan 2011
Programs: UA S, Marriott P
Posts: 1,154
you guys are living in a bliss if this is news to you - all my flights have been posting PQD exactly 14 days after the flight "as advertised".
been like that all february.
been like that all february.
Feb 28, 2014, 8:44 am
#559
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Los Angeles
Programs: UA Plat 2MM. DL Plat, AS MVP
Posts: 12,751
RTW calculation oddity
As part of my CRTW on LH stock, I flew LAX-LIH and HNL-LAX. For the longer LAX-LIH segment, I earned 666 PQDs, and for HNL-LAX I earned 803. Go figure!
Curious to see how the short LAX-SFO calculates.
Curious to see how the short LAX-SFO calculates.
Feb 28, 2014, 9:15 am
#560
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Colorado
Programs: UA Gold (.85 MM), HH Diamond, SPG Platinum (LT Gold), Hertz PC, National EE
Posts: 5,648
Guess I will wait another week to see if a segment finally goes from processing to whatever dollar amount. Seems odd that 5 out 6 segments of that trip posted PQD's within a couple of days, but this one is taking a while. Only thing I can think of is that my original segment canceled and was replaced by a new flight created by UA and not a normally scheduled one.
Mar 1, 2014, 6:18 am
#561
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Chicago
Programs: SPG Plat (life gold);UA 1K; IC Plat Amb
Posts: 55
LH PQDs and PQS
Heard from a MP Rep today that the reason that posting is going so poorly is that LH is sending over the data without the "0" in the "016" and the UA system can't resolve the difference.
So for the time being, this will continue to be a pain.
So for the time being, this will continue to be a pain.
Mar 1, 2014, 4:28 pm
#562
Used to be 'thiti'
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Denver, CO
Programs: UA-PP 1MM, Hyatt-Globalist, Bonvoy-LT Titanium, Hertz-Pres Cir
Posts: 189
Mar 1, 2014, 5:28 pm
#563
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: CAK/CLE
Programs: UA Plat/AA,DL Dirt/HH Diamond,Hyatt Something-ist/Hz Prez,Avis Pres Club
Posts: 674
PQD for CLE-IAH-PHX on Friday posted today.
$175 posted; seems correct given fare breakdown from ticket. Of course, this an extremely simple data point.
Seems predictable that PQD for return will be about $325; will see after flying IF things go as scheduled--getting in to CLE as scheduled is not a slam dunk given the weather tomorrow....
$175 posted; seems correct given fare breakdown from ticket. Of course, this an extremely simple data point.
CLE UA X/HOU UA PHX173.95UA X/HOU UA CLE324.65USD 498.60END ZPCLEIAHPHXIAH XFCLE4.5 IAH3PHX4.5IAH3
Mar 1, 2014, 6:26 pm
#564
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: SMF, SAN
Programs: UA 1K
Posts: 39
That was the same explanation that MP gave to me, but it seems inconsistent even for the same trip. My return was credited correctly for all PQM/PQD, but my outbound was not credited at all. Upon submitting the 016 ticket number, the mileage was credited for the LH flights, but not the PQD. I called and MP recognized the problem, but took another 30 minutes on the phone to manually correct the PQD with an adjustment. Fortunately, I don't have plans for another LH flight until summer so hopefully they'll have it worked out by then.
Mar 1, 2014, 7:54 pm
#565
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Everywhere else
Programs: Miles and frowns, IHG aluminum
Posts: 346
LAX-CLE-MCI in discount economy (K), cash price $159, PQD $125. Seems correct.
Mar 2, 2014, 5:05 am
#566
Join Date: Feb 2003
Programs: UA1K, *G & Wife of UA1K MM
Posts: 3,431
All this talk of PQDs makes me wonder what else besides annual status do they count for? For instance, are they used to determine GS candidates?
Mar 2, 2014, 5:44 am
#567
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: IAD-DCA
Programs: Won Kay
Posts: 1,324
BTW, my mileage posted within the usual range, it was the PQD that never posted.
Mar 2, 2014, 6:19 am
#568
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 330
Leave it to the new UA team to implement yet another poorly thought out program!
Mar 2, 2014, 12:44 pm
#569
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 498
The speculative reasons certainly include this, but generally more as a (PQ)CPM number than just raw PQD. i.e. if if someone only flies 5 TPACs a year, but pays full F every time, their CPM could be higher than someone who has 30K PQD because they fly 4 times a week.
Mar 2, 2014, 1:12 pm
#570
Join Date: Feb 2003
Programs: UA1K, *G & Wife of UA1K MM
Posts: 3,431
But for someone who already blew past their $10,000 PQDs in February, it is probably wise to monitor the rest of the year that the PQDs continue to post correctly.
We too have been caught with LH PQDs not posting correctly.