Feb 10, 2024, 10:52 pm
Last edit by: WineCountryUA
This is an archive thread, the active thread is Fare Class has Inventory - Not Able to Book into?
Common issue
Expert Mode shows ..... T9, L9, K9, G9, N9 but you not able to get united.com or other sites to provide a fare for N or G or .... WHY?
There are three requirements to be able to book a fare class
1) there needs to be a fare rule for that fare class for your O/D.
2) you need to meet all the requirements for the fare rule -- advance purchase, days of the week, min stay, qualified flight numbers, qualified routing (including a possible RT requirement), .....
3) there needs to be inventory in the fare class
So if the cheapest fare rule filed is K, you will not be able to book N or G
Even if a fare rule is filed and there is inventory then you still need to meet the fare rule requirements.
As for searching, if multiple fares qualify, the cheapest will be displayed unless you specifically force a fare class. While the fare hierarchy will generally match the cost, occasionally a high fare class will be cheaper than a lower fare class due to differences in fare flexibility such as refundable, changeability, ....
So there are multiple reasons for why a specific fare class is and not is offered. Confusion on this is one reason UA has been reluctant to make fare class inventory easily available and the reason UA requires one to accept the following terms before providing access to Expert Mode:
How can you see the fare rules?
While booking (on the first "Review trip itin" page) and after booking (on the online view of the reservation) , UA will makes them available -- but this is only if UA will display that particular fare.
Before booking or if unable to get access on UA, there are paid services -- KVS, Expert Flyer. ... can provide access to all published fare rules.
Related threads
Decoding the alphabet soup - New fare buckets for UA
How to get a P class fare to Europe?
Understanding Airline Inventory (non FT blog posting)
Desired Fare Class is available but has insufficient space, what can be done?
Common issue
Expert Mode shows ..... T9, L9, K9, G9, N9 but you not able to get united.com or other sites to provide a fare for N or G or .... WHY?
There are three requirements to be able to book a fare class
1) there needs to be a fare rule for that fare class for your O/D.
2) you need to meet all the requirements for the fare rule -- advance purchase, days of the week, min stay, qualified flight numbers, qualified routing (including a possible RT requirement), .....
3) there needs to be inventory in the fare class
So if the cheapest fare rule filed is K, you will not be able to book N or G
Even if a fare rule is filed and there is inventory then you still need to meet the fare rule requirements.
As for searching, if multiple fares qualify, the cheapest will be displayed unless you specifically force a fare class. While the fare hierarchy will generally match the cost, occasionally a high fare class will be cheaper than a lower fare class due to differences in fare flexibility such as refundable, changeability, ....
So there are multiple reasons for why a specific fare class is and not is offered. Confusion on this is one reason UA has been reluctant to make fare class inventory easily available and the reason UA requires one to accept the following terms before providing access to Expert Mode:
This is not a forecasting tool. Availability levels in certain fare classes should not be interpreted as indicating that we will make other fare classes available.
The presence of a particular fare class does not mean that there is a fare associated with it. For example, we may offer availability in a discounted fare class, but that does not necessarily mean we have published a fare that corresponds to it.
The presence of a particular fare class does not mean that there is a fare associated with it. For example, we may offer availability in a discounted fare class, but that does not necessarily mean we have published a fare that corresponds to it.
While booking (on the first "Review trip itin" page) and after booking (on the online view of the reservation) , UA will makes them available -- but this is only if UA will display that particular fare.
Before booking or if unable to get access on UA, there are paid services -- KVS, Expert Flyer. ... can provide access to all published fare rules.
Related threads
Decoding the alphabet soup - New fare buckets for UA
How to get a P class fare to Europe?
Understanding Airline Inventory (non FT blog posting)
Desired Fare Class is available but has insufficient space, what can be done?
Fare Class has Inventory - Not Able to Book into? {Archive]
May 29, 2019, 1:58 pm
#331
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: TX
Programs: UA 1K
Posts: 729
Not sure if this is the right place for this but couldn't find another similar thread.
I am not understanding how a published fare is used to calculate the eventual amount paid. Example is this:
IAH > LHR RT on July 4-7. Flights are Z9 P9. Expert flyer shows a P fare is effective on those dates of $2056, but it is a minimum of two tickets. When you go through to purchase UA is asking for 3607.83 per person. 351.83 of that is taxes & fees with the fare component 3256 - $1200 more than the published fare.
Similarly if you try to book just one ticket it forces into Z (as expected), but the final price has a fare component of 4867 - which again is $1200 more than the published 3667 Z fare. Where is the extra $1200 coming from?
Thanks in advance. Just trying to understand more on how fare basis works.
PQA76SNC UA P Round-Trip 2056.00(USD)
ZHX86ERC UA Z Round-Trip 3667.00(USD)
I am not understanding how a published fare is used to calculate the eventual amount paid. Example is this:
IAH > LHR RT on July 4-7. Flights are Z9 P9. Expert flyer shows a P fare is effective on those dates of $2056, but it is a minimum of two tickets. When you go through to purchase UA is asking for 3607.83 per person. 351.83 of that is taxes & fees with the fare component 3256 - $1200 more than the published fare.
Similarly if you try to book just one ticket it forces into Z (as expected), but the final price has a fare component of 4867 - which again is $1200 more than the published 3667 Z fare. Where is the extra $1200 coming from?
Thanks in advance. Just trying to understand more on how fare basis works.
PQA76SNC UA P Round-Trip 2056.00(USD)
ZHX86ERC UA Z Round-Trip 3667.00(USD)
May 29, 2019, 2:03 pm
#332
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: SF Bay Area
Programs: UA 1K, Hyatt Globalist, Virtuoso Travel Agent, Commercial Pilot
Posts: 2,117
In case you're curious, here is the full pricing breakdown for two P-fares (you can see the 1200.00 YQ there).
Code:
04JUL DEPARTURE DATE-----LAST DAY TO PURCHASE 01JUN/1301
BASE FARE TAXES/FEES/CHARGES TOTAL
2- USD2056.00 1541.73XT USD3597.73ADT
XT 1200.00YQ 37.20US 5.77YC 7.00XY
3.96XA 5.60AY 218.50GB 59.20UB
4.50XF
4112.00 3083.46 7195.46TTL
ADT-02 PQA76SNC
HOU UA LON1028.00UA HOU1028.00NUC2056.00END ROE1.00 XFIAH4.5
Last edited by Sykes; May 30, 2019 at 11:16 am
Jun 22, 2019, 6:15 pm
#333
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Programs: UA 1K 1MMer & LT UC (when flying UA); Hyatt Credit Cardist; HHonors Diamond; Marriott Gold via UA 1K
Posts: 6,956
I’m trying to book a GPU-able flight from LAX-IAH-EZE departing December 5, and returning on December 20. When I plugged in “Upgrade type/GPU,” the return options gave me a price differential of over $1,000 to take a decent connection ($2,744 vs. $1,668, as explained below).
For the outbound, the flight options through IAH show “W” as the fare class. (I used the 12PM LAX-IAH in my search.) So far, so good! However, the options for the return flights show the earlier connections out of IAH (with UA 1956 at 9:40AM being my preferred connections) as booking into B class at the $2,744 fare, even though both legs are showing E6 as the lowest fare bucket. I tried to search for fare class E, but I got the dreaded “Requested fare class: Not Available,” with the default to L class – or an astronomically high business class fare. No, thanks.
I could go with the earliest connection that will get me a reasonable (U) fare at $1,668, but it would entail a 7:25 hour layover at IAH. This is tolerable if my GPU clears and I can shower and relax in the Polaris lounge, but will be intolerable if it doesn’t. I do not want to rely on a SDC for two reasons: 1) I will be returning from a cruise to Antarctica, and will probably be in transit on my flight back to EZE at the 24-hour witching hour. 2) December 20. Need I say more?
Thoughts on why I cannot get the E fare to price on the shorter connections?
For the outbound, the flight options through IAH show “W” as the fare class. (I used the 12PM LAX-IAH in my search.) So far, so good! However, the options for the return flights show the earlier connections out of IAH (with UA 1956 at 9:40AM being my preferred connections) as booking into B class at the $2,744 fare, even though both legs are showing E6 as the lowest fare bucket. I tried to search for fare class E, but I got the dreaded “Requested fare class: Not Available,” with the default to L class – or an astronomically high business class fare. No, thanks.
I could go with the earliest connection that will get me a reasonable (U) fare at $1,668, but it would entail a 7:25 hour layover at IAH. This is tolerable if my GPU clears and I can shower and relax in the Polaris lounge, but will be intolerable if it doesn’t. I do not want to rely on a SDC for two reasons: 1) I will be returning from a cruise to Antarctica, and will probably be in transit on my flight back to EZE at the 24-hour witching hour. 2) December 20. Need I say more?
Thoughts on why I cannot get the E fare to price on the shorter connections?
Last edited by WineCountryUA; Jun 22, 2019 at 6:24 pm Reason: Moved to consodidated thread
Jun 22, 2019, 6:29 pm
#334
Moderator: United Airlines
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: SFO
Programs: UA Plat 1.995MM, Hyatt Discoverist, Marriott Plat/LT Gold, Hilton Silver, IHG Plat
Posts: 66,827
It could be a number of things - the day of the week, min stay, routing, ....
Jun 22, 2019, 8:38 pm
#335
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 23,040
I'm seeing seasonality restrictions on the fares and Dec 20th is not valid.
TO UNITED STATES -
PERMITTED 17JAN THROUGH 02JUL OR 18JUL THROUGH 19DEC
OR ON 24DEC OR ON 31DEC FOR EACH ON THE FIRST
INTERNATIONAL SECTOR.
TO UNITED STATES -
PERMITTED 17JAN THROUGH 02JUL OR 18JUL THROUGH 19DEC
OR ON 24DEC OR ON 31DEC FOR EACH ON THE FIRST
INTERNATIONAL SECTOR.
Jun 23, 2019, 2:08 pm
#336
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Programs: UA 1K 1MMer & LT UC (when flying UA); Hyatt Credit Cardist; HHonors Diamond; Marriott Gold via UA 1K
Posts: 6,956
I guess I’ll go with the long layover and hope the upgrade clears.
Nov 7, 2019, 3:22 pm
#337
Join Date: Dec 2017
Posts: 50
Alright, cleared up the misunderstanding with the moderator, here's a link to the post I was mentioning before, if anyone wants to geek out: Fun with Fare Classes
Dec 4, 2019, 5:48 pm
#338
Join Date: Dec 2019
Location: Chicago
Programs: UA: 1K. Hilton: Diamond. Marriot: Gold. AA: Gold
Posts: 51
Relatively new to this forum. Trying to fully understand expert mode search on UA. I think I do not understand the number that comes after the fare class. I thought the number after the fare class is supposed to indicate the number of seats/tickets available in that fare class? Then why for example on UA flight with the cheapest economy fare for purchase only in V class, does it show K9 T9 S9 etc? On the next flight that same day, once again V class available at the same price, but this time showing W2 (meaning W fare available) and K0 T0 etc? Thanks.
Dec 4, 2019, 6:10 pm
#339
Moderator: United Airlines
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: SFO
Programs: UA Plat 1.995MM, Hyatt Discoverist, Marriott Plat/LT Gold, Hilton Silver, IHG Plat
Posts: 66,827
There are multiple issues to understand in looking at this data.
1) for a fare to be offered there needs to be
a) a filed fare
b) fare class inventory is available
c) the desired purchase meets all the fare rules: advance purchase, routing, day of the week, ....
So fare class inventory is not enough by itself to allow a fare to be purchased.
say it is 3-days to travel and the cheap fares are 7-day advance purchase. They will not be purchasable but a 3-day AP or zero-day AP fare in a higher fare class will be purchasable
2) Fare class on multi-segment route are based on the min inventory of any segment
Say you want to go from AAA-BBB-CCC
AAA-BBB has W9 S0 ...
BBB-CCC has W6 S6 ...
AAA-BBB-CCC will be W6 S0
3) Fare inventory is capped at 9 for display purpose but there may be more than 9.
but Y9 B9 M9 .... does not mean there are 27 seats... all you can say is there are at least 9 seats. Could be if one seat is sold, it might go to Y8 B8 M8 or stay Y9 B9 M9
1) for a fare to be offered there needs to be
a) a filed fare
b) fare class inventory is available
c) the desired purchase meets all the fare rules: advance purchase, routing, day of the week, ....
So fare class inventory is not enough by itself to allow a fare to be purchased.
say it is 3-days to travel and the cheap fares are 7-day advance purchase. They will not be purchasable but a 3-day AP or zero-day AP fare in a higher fare class will be purchasable
2) Fare class on multi-segment route are based on the min inventory of any segment
Say you want to go from AAA-BBB-CCC
AAA-BBB has W9 S0 ...
BBB-CCC has W6 S6 ...
AAA-BBB-CCC will be W6 S0
3) Fare inventory is capped at 9 for display purpose but there may be more than 9.
but Y9 B9 M9 .... does not mean there are 27 seats... all you can say is there are at least 9 seats. Could be if one seat is sold, it might go to Y8 B8 M8 or stay Y9 B9 M9
Dec 4, 2019, 9:58 pm
#340
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 21,386
This isn't necessarily true. In fact, in many cases, UA will file an entirely separate set of inventory for AAA-BBB-CCC. So, in this case, AAA-BBB-CCC could be W6 S0, as you suggested, or W9 S9, or W0 S0, or anything in between. Both are common: UA will sometimes prefer to save inventory for nonstop travelers, and they'll sometimes prefer to save inventory for connecting travelers. It just depends upon what their revenue forecast thinks is most profitable.
Dec 4, 2019, 10:12 pm
#341
Moderator: United Airlines
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: SFO
Programs: UA Plat 1.995MM, Hyatt Discoverist, Marriott Plat/LT Gold, Hilton Silver, IHG Plat
Posts: 66,827
Yes, correct -- was just trying to provide a simple example to address the poster's question, keeping in a digestible response and not covering every possible case (but understand this is FT)
Feb 7, 2020, 9:20 pm
#342
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2017
Programs: AS 75K, DL Silver, UA Platinum, Hilton Gold, Hyatt Discoverist, Marriott Platinum + LT Gold
Posts: 10,494
Looking at a fairly last minute one-way flight from MEX to EWR. UA is displaying Q fare as the lowest purchasable ticket; however, expert mode shows V=2. Why are V fare tickets not available for purchase?
Q=7, by the way; although UA is saying there are 6 tickets left at this price.
Q=7, by the way; although UA is saying there are 6 tickets left at this price.
Last edited by WineCountryUA; Feb 7, 2020 at 10:16 pm Reason: Moved to consodidated thread
Feb 7, 2020, 9:33 pm
#343
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Between AUS, EWR, and YTO In a little twisty maze of airline seats, all alike.. but I wanna go home with the armadillo
Programs: CO, NW, & UA forum moderator emeritus
Posts: 35,406
Looking at a fairly last minute one-way flight from MEX to EWR. UA is displaying Q fare as the lowest purchasable ticket; however, expert mode shows V=2. Why are V fare tickets not available for purchase?
Q=7, by the way; although UA is saying there are 6 tickets left at this price.
Q=7, by the way; although UA is saying there are 6 tickets left at this price.
ur date(s).
Feb 7, 2020, 10:14 pm
#344
Moderator: United Airlines
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: SFO
Programs: UA Plat 1.995MM, Hyatt Discoverist, Marriott Plat/LT Gold, Hilton Silver, IHG Plat
Posts: 66,827
1) There be inventory (there is in this case)
2) There be a fare rule (likely there is)
3) All conditions of the fare rule must be met --such as advance purchase requirements (x days before travel), min stay, max stay, RT/OW availability, day of the week availability, .... likely one of these is not met
Additionally, there may be a fare combinability issue.
This thread's wiki covers this in more detail.
Mar 30, 2020, 3:53 pm
#345
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: MHT
Programs: UA 1k & MM, Accor/LeClub Platinum
Posts: 14
Fare Class Buckets - 2 travelers 1 confirmation # different prices
General question on limitations of Fare Class buckets. I am trying to book RT Business/First between IAD - SJD for December travel for party of 2. Apparently there is one fare in C class and the rest are J. So in this instance when booking for a party of 2 on same itinerary 1 will price in C and the other in J at a 150% of the C fare. Currently the entirety of Business/First is empty. I called the 1K desk to see if both could be priced in the C bucket given same itinerary/same confirmation #. They told me to pound sand after talking to "fare desk". Any suggestions of possible remedy? Alternate route to bring to better resolution (from my point of view clearly). I have not experienced this situation in last 15 years of flying almost exclusively on UA.
I do appreciate any insight fellow FTers can offer.
Kind regards and stay healthy!
I do appreciate any insight fellow FTers can offer.
Kind regards and stay healthy!