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Jeff comments on loss of "unmanaged" corporate traffic/PRASM at JP Morgan conference.

Jeff comments on loss of "unmanaged" corporate traffic/PRASM at JP Morgan conference.

Old Mar 4, 13, 3:47 pm
  #31  
 
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Originally Posted by pinerd View Post
That's probably true. But I've also noticed this year that even though I am a Gold now vs Silver the last few years... my upgrade waiting list status is getting worse and worse. Seems to point to more elites?
...and/or less capacity.
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Old Mar 4, 13, 3:48 pm
  #32  
 
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Originally Posted by pinerd View Post
That's probably true. But I've also noticed this year that even though I am a Gold now vs Silver the last few years... my upgrade waiting list status is getting worse and worse. Seems to point to more elites?
Your list status is worse because they are selling the seats that they used to give away as upgrades.

Not more elites.
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Old Mar 4, 13, 4:16 pm
  #33  
 
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Large "managed" corporate accounts have all the majors as perferred carriers - with negotiated discount contracts. UA/AA/DL/US. So a business traveler can fly any one of these carriers and meet corporate guidelines. Each of these also match the others FF program with corporate status matches.

So when a business traveler who used to get frequent upgrades, stops getting them, they get a corporate status match and try someone else. When they start seeing upgrades with that new carrier - then they start flying them and stop flying the other.

Is DL and AA losing "managed" corporate travelers?
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Old Mar 4, 13, 4:20 pm
  #34  
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Originally Posted by cova View Post
Is DL and AA losing "managed" corporate travelers?
Nope, DL has proudly said they're gaining them (believe on their Q4/EOY earnings call)...sure someone can post the link to it. Believe AA has revealed the same thing.
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Old Mar 4, 13, 4:29 pm
  #35  
 
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Originally Posted by cova View Post
Large "managed" corporate accounts have all the majors as perferred carriers - with negotiated discount contracts. UA/AA/DL/US. So a business traveler can fly any one of these carriers and meet corporate guidelines. Each of these also match the others FF program with corporate status matches.
How do you know this?

Every company I have worked for has been locked into one of the major legacy carriers, and flying on anything but the approved carrier has required an escalation and special approval. These are all large organizations - Fortune 500.
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Old Mar 4, 13, 4:30 pm
  #36  
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Originally Posted by wpr8e View Post
All airlines service standards are pretty much the same IMH.
Seriously? I take it you've never flown a quality Asian, European or Middle Eastern airline??
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Old Mar 4, 13, 4:38 pm
  #37  
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Originally Posted by mitchmu View Post
Your list status is worse because they are selling the seats that they used to give away as upgrades.
Not more elites.
+1
I am a no status kettle to UA. Was offered and accept a round trip upgrade on this past weekend's DEN-SFO-DEN trip.
Cost a total of $616 for RT First. Only 3 (of 16) and 4 (of 24) elites were upgraded on my flights.
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Old Mar 4, 13, 4:48 pm
  #38  
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Originally Posted by SFO777 View Post
+1
I am a no status kettle to UA. Was offered and accept a round trip upgrade on this past weekend's DEN-SFO-DEN trip.
Cost a total of $616 for RT First. Only 3 (of 16) and 4 (of 24) elites were upgraded on my flights.
(shaking head)

Is this the inevitable wave of the future?
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Old Mar 4, 13, 4:50 pm
  #39  
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Originally Posted by MatthewLAX View Post
(shaking head)

Is this the inevitable wave of the future?
Of course it is - you should be happy you cleared as many TCON UGs as you did last year via CPU! Most of us aren't that lucky and need miles/RPUs to have a shot.
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Old Mar 4, 13, 4:52 pm
  #40  
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Originally Posted by MatthewLAX View Post
(shaking head)

Is this the inevitable wave of the future?
imagine that. selling your product for additional revenue, rather than giving it away for free.
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Old Mar 4, 13, 4:54 pm
  #41  
 
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"I think many of you, if you fly United, you'll see not only are you not having a problem but actually you're getting an on-time airline and you're getting a continually better customer service. That's what our business traveler looks for."

I'm just a lowly Gold doing regional NE runs...about 60+ per year, just enough to qualify gold, and certainly not the sexy tcon segs many of you here take.

So far this year, I have booked 8 segments. One seg I did not complete due to ATC initiated delay. Three of them were significantly delayed or canceled due to mechancial/irrops, causing re-bookings on-the-fly (pun intended).
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Old Mar 4, 13, 5:01 pm
  #42  
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Originally Posted by mitchmu View Post
How do you know this?

Every company I have worked for has been locked into one of the major legacy carriers, and flying on anything but the approved carrier has required an escalation and special approval. These are all large organizations - Fortune 500.
I'm in a F500 company, my 3rd in a row, and we've always had the discretion to select any carrier based on price and schedule with a somewhat strong-subtle push to preferred carriers - but booking around a preferred carrier was never a problem. It was always about price.

I can book around UA very easily at my day job - the problem is I go out of my way to book ON them - so the question to UA is, do you realize that major corporate accounts can easily book around you and cost you hundreds of millions in revenue for no other reason than these customers are unhappy Elites?

It almost comes down to a game of 'who is it gonna be'? - Kettles paying $15 to stand in the elite security line or a 1K who spends 10-20k a year on travel?
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Old Mar 4, 13, 5:06 pm
  #43  
 
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Originally Posted by mitchmu View Post
How do you know this?

Every company I have worked for has been locked into one of the major legacy carriers, and flying on anything but the approved carrier has required an escalation and special approval. These are all large organizations - Fortune 500.
no comment
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Old Mar 4, 13, 5:15 pm
  #44  
 
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Originally Posted by bocastephen View Post
I'm in a F500 company, my 3rd in a row, and we've always had the discretion to select any carrier based on price and schedule with a somewhat strong-subtle push to preferred carriers - but booking around a preferred carrier was never a problem. It was always about price.

I can book around UA very easily at my day job - the problem is I go out of my way to book ON them - so the question to UA is, do you realize that major corporate accounts can easily book around you and cost you hundreds of millions in revenue for no other reason than these customers are unhappy Elites?

It almost comes down to a game of 'who is it gonna be'? - Kettles paying $15 to stand in the elite security line or a 1K who spends 10-20k a year on travel?
My experience has been different. I've been told to stick with contract carrier because the organization gets a big discount that's not shown in the published fare, and, because they need volume to meet commitments and get to lower tiers.

Perhaps this isn't the norm, but it is what I've experienced.
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Old Mar 4, 13, 5:25 pm
  #45  
 
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Originally Posted by rankourabu View Post
imagine that. selling your product for additional revenue, rather than giving it away for free.
Imagine that. The 1K who normally flies last minute on business to the tune of tens of thousands of dollars a year decides to stop flying your airline altogether (basically what Smisek admitted here). And why? Because you decided it was worth more to get a extra $150 out of the guy who never flies instead of "give away" the upgrade for "free" because the 1K happened to buy a cheap ticket for the weekend to visit his son in college. After all, apparently the 1Ks only care about on-time performance and a smile from the front-line employees. Oops.
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