+1, but not only are UA services lousy the prices are also sometimes much higher than better. To wit, the last trip to Seoul that my husband took, SQ was $3,500 in C and UA cost over $6,000. :confused:

The eticket number on the cert does not count as unique? :confused:

The cynic in me reads this as:If UA and LH truly cared about making the process more transparent there should be a 100% online process to request and generate the upgrade certs (and just think of all that postage you'll save!).

After all I seem to recall UA publicly stating how advanced, flexible, and customizable their IT system is so I have no doubt in my mind it would be quick fix to add such functionality to an already robust system.

But call a spade a spade: UA's seeing their premium customers defecting and when they queried LH, LH was not able to produce the exact data. And rather than doing some hard soul searching for how to make UA work, the powers that be decided to track down whatever scapegoat happened to be within range, in this case the LH upgrade process.

:td:

The cynic in me was thinking that this was actually an attempt by UA to deflect blame on big bad LH (which has been making changes as well), in a misguided effort to direct our business back to UA metal. I see that some of you had the same thought.

However, in my case at least, I won't be flying UA metal instead of LH metal. UA doesn't serve the routes where I tend to use my GPUs on LH.

As to tracking, a few weeks ago as the GA was ready to escort me on board, I offered her my upgrade cert. She said 'oh, yes, we'll need that!' but zero effort had been made to obtain it or request it from me. I've read here in past others have not had their cert collected. And this wasn't some remote outstation; it was at FRA and I had been in the boarding area for over an hour due to a delay.

In regards to the discretion to make a decision, I doubt that this will ever happen. I suspect that LH will add information re the certs to their system, and train their staff on the 'new' certs, and that will be that. Many of us know 'the rules are the rules' when it comes to certain carriers, and there is little to no deviation from those rules.

Based on the number of irate posters, it certainly appears that there's a good amount of users of the certificates.

Sorry. But i am unable to ascertain from your post as to where your husband's loyalty with UA starts?

I reckon the true reason for these changes are to reduce the payment UA has to make to LH for all the C and F class upgrades. A very good example being your husband, who you state never steps on United metal except for the 4 segments but uses all the 6 SWUs to upgrade C to F on LH.

For me, the choice of AA is starting to look better and better.

Exactly. At the same time, United is devaluing the quality of its premium products, identifying them as an area for cost cuts. Instead of investing in the soft products to make them more desirable (hard products are adequate at present, IMO) they are cutting back service from an internationa F product that is already virtually indistinguishable from international J and creating artificial boundaries to keep frequent flyers off partner metal.

There won't be an online partner upgrade redemption mechanism, the next stop from here is outright elimination of the benefit. If I'm proven wrong (fingers crossed) I'll be beyond shocked, but it just doesn't make sense for UA.

But we're getting the 787 and that's a game changer! ;)

If you consider the significant devaluation in PQM earning rates on partners that has taken place, it's very clear they want to reduce incentive to fly partner metal.

When I assessed this situation last year, I came to the conclusion that for me, out of SFO, the best strategy was to stay with UA but to fly all international on *A and only UA for domestic or where it was fastest and cheapest. We know that UA has had margin challenges and suffered loss of HVF and corporate accounts. Now, I wonder how many others have come to the same conclusion and been pursuing the same strategy. Perhaps COdbaUA has seen a shift from UA metal to partner metal as its flyers seek to avoid it, and has responded by making partner metal increasingly less rewarding.

Wait, wait...

Route Network & Them trying to win back Business Customers...

Oh yeah, ;) This is one of those examples of trying to win Business Customers back, I suppose :confused:

-jeremy

Not sure how AA would be better, since the option of using SWU on BA does not even exist. Granted, the ability to use it on any fare is a big plus, but you're limited to where AA flies.

And therein lies the problem (and don't think UA doesn't know that SFO fliers are a "captive audience"). My husband has flown BA and really didn't like the airline or LHR. We brainstormed last night and the only one-stop option from SFO to Europe that he liked is Swiss, and that's where he'll focus his TATL going forward.

I wonder how Air France Business class is.

Quite. For the record LH's hubs are in FRA and MUC. Anybody who lives on the same contents as these hubs will now have to wait two weeks to receive certificates and three weeks for them to be redeposited. US-based travellers, in spite of being reachable by domestic mail, have the option of FedEx, and option closed to us who would really need it. Honestly, UA, I know you're working with a reservation system from the 1990s, but these paper certificates takes us back another decade or two!

Quite. As you are now, after making the use of the certificates on LH impractical beyond a theoretical value, limited to where UA flies. Neither AA nor UA flies East from Europe.

Did you mean an "F product that is already virtually indistinguishable from international J"?

You know, in re-reading that post a minute ago it just occurred to me that I transposed the two. Thanks for the catch... updated.

This is probably spot-on. One of the benefits of allowing broad partner mileage-earning is that it yields a great deal of insight on the overall travel/spending habits of your existing customer base, and I suspect UA noted a rise in partner earning along with some correlative decline in own-metal premium cabin revenues. Of course, I have no objection to UA 'incentivizing' (hate that word) travel on its own metal, but instead of earning the business with superior service, quality and schedules, they punish travelers who choose non-JV premium cabin flights and credit back to UA. It's just a cheaper way to address the problem.

I don't doubt onboard service standards from a personnel perspective will improve after a joint contract, merged seniority list, new uniforms and UA's upcoming Disney training this year are all carried out. Delta is a testament to the fact that an airline can emphasize and train real improvements in customer service within a short period of time. Setting personnel aside, United will still offer a comparatively lacking soft product. The question is, will that be enough to win customers back?

Yea, falling from the sky like rock, because of some technical issues... Way to go.

No seriously... this is the biggest ........ I have read in a long time. If an upgrade instrument is only available on a stand-by basis how should you be able to use it if you have to provide the flight details ahead of time. This is complete nonsense.

I completely agree with exbayern and the points he made. Being a former 1K living in Germany I will get my 2 remaining GPUs printed asap and that will be it. 4 flight on UA minimum rule can suck if you live outside the US, but it's bearable. However, this stupid rule having to send GPUs back and forth apparently if the upgrade gets denied or if your travel plans change is absolutely ridiculous. Are we still stuck in the 80s or 90s without the internet? Back to the stone age!!!

Gimme a break - another change I will like, yea, sure... as much as everybody likes root canal treatments. I am speechless.