2013 Westbound TATL 757 "Short Stops"
#1
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2013 Westbound TATL 757 "Short Stops"
There seemed to be a rash of 57 "short stops" coming back from Europe last winter. I don't remember seeing any commentary on this forum about these stops since Jan. 1 this year. So it's not a problem so far this winter?
#2
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the BCN-EWR flight short stopped in Goose Bay a couple days ago, then diverted to BOS for pressurization problem. that is the only one I heard about recently.
#3
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There are probably close to a hundred posts in the thread last year from meteorologists and other interested observers commenting on the highly unusual transatlantic wind and weather patterns last year - it was considered a once-per-decade or even less frequent event. As a result there were some longer than usual segments that resulted in a higher than normal rate of fuel stops, mainly because it wasn't forecasted early enough to be able to manage passenger and cargo loads accordingly.
The other factor was the introduction of some unfamiliar segments (flights to IAD) which, in addition to being slightly longer were relatively immature in terms of UA's ability to forecast loads and exact aircraft performance.
Neither of those factors seem to exist to any meaningful degree this winter, so the planned fuel stop rate seems to be much closer to what it was 2+ years ago - i.e. effectively a non-issue.
The other factor was the introduction of some unfamiliar segments (flights to IAD) which, in addition to being slightly longer were relatively immature in terms of UA's ability to forecast loads and exact aircraft performance.
Neither of those factors seem to exist to any meaningful degree this winter, so the planned fuel stop rate seems to be much closer to what it was 2+ years ago - i.e. effectively a non-issue.
#5
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The other factor was the introduction of some unfamiliar segments (flights to IAD) which, in addition to being slightly longer were relatively immature in terms of UA's ability to forecast loads and exact aircraft performance.
Neither of those factors seem to exist to any meaningful degree this winter, so the planned fuel stop rate seems to be much closer to what it was 2+ years ago - i.e. effectively a non-issue.
#6
Join Date: Oct 2012
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Part of the problem is that the 757-300 was never meant to be a TATL bird. It's range is shorter than that of the 707-320B (3400 nautical miles vs 3800). For reference point, EWR-CDG is 3200 nautical miles. Piece of cake for the 707 but tough for the 753, especially westwards. The 727-200 Advanced that was occasionally and not successfully used in TATL routes had a 3500 nautical mile range.
If there is enough market, and it seems to be, someone should develop a single aisle TATL bird with range well in the 4000s.
*The range of the 752 is close to 4000 btw and the potential 753 replacements 737 Max 9 and A321neo have only 3600 nm range.
If there is enough market, and it seems to be, someone should develop a single aisle TATL bird with range well in the 4000s.
*The range of the 752 is close to 4000 btw and the potential 753 replacements 737 Max 9 and A321neo have only 3600 nm range.
#8
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 2,324
There are probably close to a hundred posts in the thread last year from meteorologists and other interested observers commenting on the highly unusual transatlantic wind and weather patterns last year - it was considered a once-per-decade or even less frequent event. As a result there were some longer than usual segments that resulted in a higher than normal rate of fuel stops, mainly because it wasn't forecasted early enough to be able to manage passenger and cargo loads accordingly.
The other factor was the introduction of some unfamiliar segments (flights to IAD) which, in addition to being slightly longer were relatively immature in terms of UA's ability to forecast loads and exact aircraft performance.
Neither of those factors seem to exist to any meaningful degree this winter, so the planned fuel stop rate seems to be much closer to what it was 2+ years ago - i.e. effectively a non-issue.
The other factor was the introduction of some unfamiliar segments (flights to IAD) which, in addition to being slightly longer were relatively immature in terms of UA's ability to forecast loads and exact aircraft performance.
Neither of those factors seem to exist to any meaningful degree this winter, so the planned fuel stop rate seems to be much closer to what it was 2+ years ago - i.e. effectively a non-issue.
When that turned out to be the complete disaster we all said it would be, and in light of an expose in the WSJ, the company quickly moved to replace that incompatible equipment with a proper wide body aircraft.
The winter winds being at "10 year highs" is spin from the company itself and nobody else. No surprise then that you state it as fact.
#9
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UAL97 ended up in Gander the other day: http://flightaware.com/live/flight/U...845Z/EDDT/KEWR
#10
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UAL97 ended up in Gander the other day: http://flightaware.com/live/flight/U...845Z/EDDT/KEWR
#12
Join Date: Oct 2007
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Part of the problem is that the 757-300 was never meant to be a TATL bird. It's range is shorter than that of the 707-320B (3400 nautical miles vs 3800). For reference point, EWR-CDG is 3200 nautical miles. Piece of cake for the 707 but tough for the 753, especially westwards. The 727-200 Advanced that was occasionally and not successfully used in TATL routes had a 3500 nautical mile range.
If there is enough market, and it seems to be, someone should develop a single aisle TATL bird with range well in the 4000s.
*The range of the 752 is close to 4000 btw and the potential 753 replacements 737 Max 9 and A321neo have only 3600 nm range.
If there is enough market, and it seems to be, someone should develop a single aisle TATL bird with range well in the 4000s.
*The range of the 752 is close to 4000 btw and the potential 753 replacements 737 Max 9 and A321neo have only 3600 nm range.
That should work for most East Coast USA <--> Europe flights just fine.
#13
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But wouldn't you want a minimum 150 pax capacity TATL for these second tier European cities--even in winter?
Last edited by scosprey; Jan 19, 2013 at 7:49 pm Reason: Forgot to add "European"
#14
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Maybe they will develop an ER version of the MAX 9.
#15
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Maybe they will develop an ER version of the MAX 9.