United CFO Rainey Implies Certain Elites were "Over Entitled".
#1456
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Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: LGA/JFK/EWR
Programs: UA 1K1.75MM, Hyatt Globalist, abandoned Marriott LTT (RIP SPG), Hertz PC
Posts: 21,167
She popped up yesterday in a thread when someone mentioned complaining to the DOT. It was that thread about different amounts being charged for miles. So, my guess is she reads these posts all day long but no longer gets involved since she can't win. If she try's to help us, the co steps on her. If she does not try, we step on her
#1457
Suspended
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: SEA
Posts: 12,485
While I'm not surprised, I think it's pretty clear that you misunderstood my post. The FTer to whom I replied had reported lots of fine experiences with UA. GOOD FOR THEM!
However, as you seem perpetually unwilling or unable to appreciate, ONE of the likely reasons for these feelings is that said poster is flying CO routes, with pmCO GS pax.
In order to help he/she understand why there are others who've had different experiences, I simply pointed this out. If that makes you feel that I'm expressing "pmUA knows best", then so be it. It's NOT.
However, as you seem perpetually unwilling or unable to appreciate, ONE of the likely reasons for these feelings is that said poster is flying CO routes, with pmCO GS pax.
In order to help he/she understand why there are others who've had different experiences, I simply pointed this out. If that makes you feel that I'm expressing "pmUA knows best", then so be it. It's NOT.
#1458
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: SEA/YVR/BLI
Programs: UA "Lifetime" Gold, AS MVPG100K, OW Emerald, HH Lifetime Diamond, IC Plat, Marriott Gold, Hertz Gold
Posts: 9,489
She popped up yesterday in a thread when someone mentioned complaining to the DOT. It was that thread about different amounts being charged for miles. So, my guess is she reads these posts all day long but no longer gets involved since she can't win. If she try's to help us, the co steps on her. If she does not try, we step on her
This forum is so negative right now (and I've contributed my share) with much back-and-forth unpleasantness and sniping. I can only hope that eventually UA and we can move past this into a more positive situation.
A lot of that is up to UA. I can stop posting here but I can't pretend that things are better than or even "almost as good as" what existed before the merger.
#1459
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Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: SPI
Programs: AA Gold, UA LT Plat, Mar LTT
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Look, I dont really care if others like, tolerate, or LOVE the new CO. I just don't want anyone to misunderstand that it's not the UA on which I flew all those years. pmCO pax have gained a lot in this takeover - GOOD FOR THEM!!
I think there's a saying: to the victor go the spoils.
Just no need to rub it in, and follow up by telling us we're nuts cos we don't have the same great feelings for the new airline. That oughta be easy enough to follow, no???
Dave
Maybe she's just out of energy???
Dave
Last edited by iluv2fly; Jun 15, 2012 at 12:43 pm Reason: merge
#1460
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: SEA/YVR/BLI
Programs: UA "Lifetime" Gold, AS MVPG100K, OW Emerald, HH Lifetime Diamond, IC Plat, Marriott Gold, Hertz Gold
Posts: 9,489
Look, I dont really care if others like, tolerate, or LOVE the new CO. I just don't want anyone to misunderstand that it's not the UA on which I flew all those years. pmCO pax have gained a lot in this takeover - GOOD FOR THEM!!
I think there's a saying: to the victor go the spoils.
Just no need to rub it in, and follow up by telling us we're nuts cos we don't have the same great feelings for the new airline. That oughta be easy enough to follow, no???
Dave
I think there's a saying: to the victor go the spoils.
Just no need to rub it in, and follow up by telling us we're nuts cos we don't have the same great feelings for the new airline. That oughta be easy enough to follow, no???
Dave
The same type of debate has occurred over the changes to the Million Miles and Beyond program. CO MMs saw their status enhanced from Silver to Gold, and other benefits maintained. UA treated the legacy CO IEs very generously.
Some CO flyers simply could not understand the reasons why many PMUA MMs (not all) were unhappy, nor understand the depth of the dissatisfaction that eventually led a customer to sue over the loss of benefits (copy of amended complaint here).
It's all a matter of perspective and understanding where the other person is coming from. @:-)
#1461
Join Date: Feb 2008
Programs: 6 year GS, now 2MM Jeff-ugee, *wood LTPlt, SkyPeso PLT
Posts: 6,526
They are really in a no win situation. The systems take time to fix, improving service levels or sweetening the MP program costs money, and wall street is watching (with a miopic focus on cost cutting). Better to stick with the stratagy, and hope that external factors (fuel costs coming down, etc) give them some time to adjust in a way where it does not look like a 180. None of this is good for the stockholders long term, but it certainly protects the executives who are (theoretically) responsible.
#1462
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Sandpoint,Idaho- previously- Colorado, NYC, New England, SC
Programs: United Millionmiler 1/Star Alliance Gold, National Emerald Executive for Life, Best Western Platinum
Posts: 176
It's definitely a no-win situation and I feel for UA Insider, who must feel like the jam in the sandwich.
This forum is so negative right now (and I've contributed my share) with much back-and-forth unpleasantness and sniping. I can only hope that eventually UA and we can move past this into a more positive situation.
A lot of that is up to UA. I can stop posting here but I can't pretend that things are better than or even "almost as good as" what existed before the merger.
This forum is so negative right now (and I've contributed my share) with much back-and-forth unpleasantness and sniping. I can only hope that eventually UA and we can move past this into a more positive situation.
A lot of that is up to UA. I can stop posting here but I can't pretend that things are better than or even "almost as good as" what existed before the merger.
#1463
Suspended
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: SEA
Posts: 12,485
If you don't like UA, by all means, fly another carrier.
#1464
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In a very limited sense, then, PMUA know better about what they've lost. That seems like a logical, natural perspective. But that's not to suggest that they know better in any absolute sense of overall knowledge or superiority, and I don't think bseller was saying that.
#1465
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Dave
#1466
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Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Sunny SYDNEY!
Programs: UA Million Miler. (1.9M) Virgin Platinum. HH Diamond + SPG Gold
Posts: 32,330
I do think that COdbaUA sees the reality, the PRASM and DOT numbers don't lie. But there is a difference between the middle level (and customer focused folks) who see that it is not working out, and the CEO/CFO who came up with the stratagy, will be blaimed for it if it does not work out, and also see very real the costs of trying to fix it.
They are really in a no win situation. The systems take time to fix, improving service levels or sweetening the MP program costs money, and wall street is watching (with a miopic focus on cost cutting).
Better to stick with the strategy, and hope that external factors (fuel costs coming down, etc) give them some time to adjust in a way where it does not look like a 180. None of this is good for the stockholders long term, but it certainly protects the executives who are (theoretically) responsible.
But if I had both I'd have used my brains, and left the Elite program totally unchanged UNTIL the cr*pola ancient CO computer system had been given a chance to integrate from CO's far smaller base, to UA far vaster needs, and global network.
IF all that integrated and bedded down, after a while take the next steps and tinker with the FF plan and top Elites. Logical and wise management policy.
The fact there were endless hassles with the ancient system was totally predicable by anyone with any knowledge of IT.
That alone was going to p!ss off many regular flyers - all tech changes do - HOWEVER we all put up with such things, as they are understandable, AND if there are no other irritating changes.
And in the end with all savvy companies, all get fixed, one way or the other.
But to come out both Texan six-guns guns blazing - foist us with a cruddy old system that clearly cannot cope AND change the FF plan in a negative way, was just plain stupidity.
Those rushed changes alienated a TON of their very best flyers forever. Decades of loyalty down the toilet in a few months. EVERY Million Miler lost something - how dumb is it to mess with those folks?
Disclaimer again - I do not have an MBA, and am not paid $13 million a year to run this circus.
I also have not spent a cent with UA for 7 months.
.
Last edited by ozstamps; Jun 15, 2012 at 11:48 pm
#1467
Join Date: Feb 2008
Programs: 6 year GS, now 2MM Jeff-ugee, *wood LTPlt, SkyPeso PLT
Posts: 6,526
I do not have an MBA and am not paid $13 million a year to run this circus.
But if I had both I'd have used my brains, and left the Elite program totally unchanged UNTIL the cr*pola ancient CO computer system had been given a change to integrate from CO's far smaller base, to UA far vaster needs and global network.
IF that integrated and bedded down, after a while take the next steps. Logical and wise management policy.
The fact there were endless hassles with the ancient system was totally predicable by anyone with any knowledge of IT.
That alone was going to p!ss off many regular flyers - all tech changes do - HOWEVER we all put up with such things, as they are understandable.
And in the end with all savvy companies, all get fixed, one way or the other.
But to come out both Texan six-guns guns blazing - foist us with a cruddy old system that clearly cannot cope AND change the FF plan in a negative way, was just plain stupidity.
Those rushed changes alienated a TON of their very best flyers forever. Decades of loyalty down the toilet in a few months. EVERY Million Miler lost something - how dumb is it to mess with those folks?
Disclaimer - I do not have an MBA, and am not paid $13 million a year to run this circus.
I also have not spent a cent with UA for 7 months.
.
But if I had both I'd have used my brains, and left the Elite program totally unchanged UNTIL the cr*pola ancient CO computer system had been given a change to integrate from CO's far smaller base, to UA far vaster needs and global network.
IF that integrated and bedded down, after a while take the next steps. Logical and wise management policy.
The fact there were endless hassles with the ancient system was totally predicable by anyone with any knowledge of IT.
That alone was going to p!ss off many regular flyers - all tech changes do - HOWEVER we all put up with such things, as they are understandable.
And in the end with all savvy companies, all get fixed, one way or the other.
But to come out both Texan six-guns guns blazing - foist us with a cruddy old system that clearly cannot cope AND change the FF plan in a negative way, was just plain stupidity.
Those rushed changes alienated a TON of their very best flyers forever. Decades of loyalty down the toilet in a few months. EVERY Million Miler lost something - how dumb is it to mess with those folks?
Disclaimer - I do not have an MBA, and am not paid $13 million a year to run this circus.
I also have not spent a cent with UA for 7 months.
.
So they actually went out with a texas six shooter in each hand. totally stupid, alas Wall Street has few folks who understand what is really happening in businesses, and more number pushers, and it will take them a while to catch on to how bad things are...
#1468
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: US
Programs: AA/UA/DL
Posts: 2,773
1. If you don't like me, by all means, go to other carriers.
2. If you don't like me, please let me know and I will try to do reasonable improvement to gain your business.
I believe the first one is the worse way to do business.
Last edited by pigx5; Jun 16, 2012 at 12:36 am
#1469
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Boston MA
Programs: UA 1K/1.5 million miler, SU Gold, JL Sapphire
Posts: 529
A few weeks ago, registered for the flight to Mumbai. I used a systemwide (or whatever it is called now) to upgrade. My name was NOT on the list when I went to the airport.
I asked to be put on the list. She said she believed she couldn't do that. "Well, humor me... I have not much confidence in your computer system). That led to a 10-minute speech about how just great the system really is - it is really the CO people trying to operate UA-way that screws up the whole thing.
Matter of perspective indeed.
But she did humor me. And, to her great surprise, SHARES DID let her add my name to the upgrade list.
Then went to EWR. Took a look at united club. "Number four sir, but doesn't look good".
Then, went to the gate, resigned to get my seat in the back. Well, boarding pass doesn't work. "Oh, you are now 2A".
Great!
Even better, somehow, they didn't even charge me for a systemwide. Well, in all likeliness, one of them is going to run out of life anyway, so ultimately it all works out.
So, not only it is a matter of perspective... but the system is really, really broken. It is not only the UA people that can't make heads or tails of SHARES. It is also the CO people that feel that the company is somehow going downhill doing things the UA way.
At least, that upgrade that finally came through kinda reconciled me with the company a bit, because I was starting seriously to consider other options. They still did not send me my card yet. I must be one of these over-entitled SOB that Rainey complained about.
#1470
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: DEN
Programs: Free checked in bag on UA & DL. Free icecream at Marriott checkin.
Posts: 2,862
As far as calling them for anything, yes they do pick up the phone pretty quickly but useless thereafter. They put you on hold while they ask their help desk or colleagues nearby.
Last edited by TravellingMan; Jun 16, 2012 at 5:22 am Reason: add phone quality