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United CFO Rainey Implies Certain Elites were "Over Entitled".

United CFO Rainey Implies Certain Elites were "Over Entitled".

Old Mar 22, 2013, 11:11 am
  #1621  
 
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Originally Posted by bocastephen

Now to be honest, I don't mind selling certain table scraps to Kettles - E+ seats, priority access, priority boarding (which should be in G3, not G1 or 2), but upselling segment fee upgrades to F ahead of elite customers is a crime I just cannot forgive.
Yep, exactly!
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Old Mar 22, 2013, 11:58 am
  #1622  
 
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Originally Posted by JNelson113
For example, under UA 1Ks always had their own boarding class. Now everyone and his dog is "Group One", including people who just paid $19 for the privilege.
Huh?

United boarding process

Group 1 is First class or Platinum and above
Group 2 is general premier access, meaning credit card holders and so forth

Originally Posted by bocastephen
Now to be honest, I don't mind selling certain table scraps to Kettles - E+ seats, priority access, priority boarding (which should be in G3, not G1 or 2), but upselling segment fee upgrades to F ahead of elite customers is a crime I just cannot forgive.
Let's be clear, there has always been a way for Kettles or anyone to jump the upgrade list for a fee - called buying a first class ticket. The degree of any crime is not about the selling, it's about the amount.

For example, my normal midcon will offer $1200 discount first class (P). My usual fare might be a W around $500. If I get one way buy-up offer at $300, I am not calling crime when the ticket total is $100 short of a bonafide first class ticket. Similarly, if someone bought an E fare for $1000, I can't call a crime giving them the seat for $50 one way, even though people can come here screaming, "Kettle got a $50 upgrade!!!".

When the price point is determined, if it's offered to all equally, I can't complain. At least this year, I have been reliably getting buy-up offers that look fairly priced. I am not seeing evidence currently my CPUs are being brutally poached. I do have to be 1K on a very high fare to get CPU for popular high elite traveler time for ones like IAH-SFO or IAD-SFO and even getting those are dicey. But that's been the case for many years back in pmUA.
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Old Mar 22, 2013, 12:30 pm
  #1623  
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Originally Posted by RedHeadFlyer
Huh?

United boarding process

Group 1 is First class or Platinum and above
Group 2 is general premier access, meaning credit card holders and so forth
There's also been reports of Golds/Silvers boarding in group 1 (and thus I'm guessing non-elites too), even if they're in Y that day, as long as they have an F segment elsewhere in their itinerary. Good technology and all.

Originally Posted by RedHeadFlyer
For example, my normal midcon will offer $1200 discount first class (P). My usual fare might be a W around $500. If I get one way buy-up offer at $300, I am not calling crime when the ticket total is $100 short of a bonafide first class ticket. Similarly, if someone bought an E fare for $1000, I can't call a crime giving them the seat for $50 one way, even though people can come here screaming, "Kettle got a $50 upgrade!!!".

When the price point is determined, if it's offered to all equally, I can't complain. At least this year, I have been reliably getting buy-up offers that look fairly priced. I am not seeing evidence currently my CPUs are being brutally poached. I do have to be 1K on a very high fare to get CPU for popular high elite traveler time for ones like IAH-SFO or IAD-SFO and even getting those are dicey. But that's been the case for many years back in pmUA.
You do realize that the TODs tend to come inside T-24, right? That's when we get the infamous "errors on the pricing side" (one of my favorite official quotes). Things are legit up until that point.

Plenty of documentation of 1Ks/other elites here who travel with GMs on separate PNRs, and the GMs often get better offers, even with dozens on the WL.

Last edited by UA-NYC; Mar 22, 2013 at 12:36 pm
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Old Mar 22, 2013, 12:44 pm
  #1624  
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Originally Posted by RedHeadFlyer;20464621...
For example, my normal midcon will offer $1200 discount first class (P). My usual fare might be a W around $500. If I get one way buy-up offer at $300, I am not calling crime when the ticket total is $100 short of a bonafide first class ticket. Similarly, if someone bought an E fare for $1000, I can't call a crime giving them the seat for $50 one way, even though people can come here screaming, "Kettle got a $50 upgrade!!!".

When the price point is determined, if it's offered to all equally, I can't complain. At least this year, I have been reliably getting buy-up offers that look fairly priced. I am not seeing evidence currently my CPUs are being brutally poached. I do have to be 1K on a very high fare to get CPU for popular high elite traveler time for ones like IAH-SFO or IAD-SFO and even getting those are dicey. But that's been the case for many years back in pmUA.
That's not the way it's suppose to work, nor is it the method that has been communicated to the community on numerous occasions. Anyone can do a buy-up for a fare difference and this has nothing to do with upgrades as it's the bona fide purchase of a F seat without a change fee (assuming no pricing shenanigans inside 24h).

The issue most of us are having with these upgrades is UA is now offering 'segment fee' upgrades to Kettles while Elites remain on the upgrade list and that is not suppose to be happening. This means a Kettle on a $129 G fare can buy an upgrade for $109 and take a F seat out from under a 1K on a $400 E fare.
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Old Mar 22, 2013, 1:31 pm
  #1625  
 
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Originally Posted by bocastephen
That's not the way it's suppose to work, nor is it the method that has been communicated to the community on numerous occasions. Anyone can do a buy-up for a fare difference and this has nothing to do with upgrades as it's the bona fide purchase of a F seat without a change fee (assuming no pricing shenanigans inside 24h).

The issue most of us are having with these upgrades is UA is now offering 'segment fee' upgrades to Kettles while Elites remain on the upgrade list and that is not suppose to be happening. This means a Kettle on a $129 G fare can buy an upgrade for $109 and take a F seat out from under a 1K on a $400 E fare.
Unfortunately there have not been many specific details posted here recently about this case, and I can't think of anyone who has even posted vague details that has been willing to work with me when I offered to help get it looked into. Very disappointing.

I can vouch for this from one personal case where I was flying with a GM and I was 1K, and she got a < $200 UG offer while my UG offer was $1,400 on the same flight. But, that's too long ago to be useful now.
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Old Mar 22, 2013, 6:32 pm
  #1626  
 
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Originally Posted by bocastephen
The issue most of us are having with these upgrades is UA is now offering 'segment fee' upgrades to Kettles while Elites remain on the upgrade list and that is not suppose to be happening. This means a Kettle on a $129 G fare can buy an upgrade for $109 and take a F seat out from under a 1K on a $400 E fare.
On the contrary, I think it is supposed to be happening, all day every day and twice on Sunday. Smisek was asked about this directly at the DO and just gave a Crocodile smile and a vague comment that United has to make money (and by implication will do anything, including that, to make said money).
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Old Mar 22, 2013, 9:32 pm
  #1627  
 
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Here's an interesting perspective on being over-entitled.

Today, I just got my first ever CPU since 3/3. All prior flights were as a 1K. This flight, I'm a PP. And, now, I get a CPU?

As insane as it sounds to type this, it seems like now Rainey is happy that he smashed down this over-entitled 1K, and since I stopped spending money, lost some status, I'm no longer over-entitled, and hence, entitled to a CPU.

Incredible.
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Old Apr 21, 2013, 6:53 am
  #1628  
 
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Originally Posted by mitchmu
Here's an interesting perspective on being over-entitled.

Today, I just got my first ever CPU since 3/3. All prior flights were as a 1K. This flight, I'm a PP. And, now, I get a CPU?

As insane as it sounds to type this, it seems like now Rainey is happy that he smashed down this over-entitled 1K, and since I stopped spending money, lost some status, I'm no longer over-entitled, and hence, entitled to a CPU.

Incredible.
Just luck, that's all. It won't happen again.
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Old Apr 21, 2013, 6:58 am
  #1629  
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Originally Posted by mitchmu
Here's an interesting perspective on being over-entitled.

Today, I just got my first ever CPU since 3/3. All prior flights were as a 1K. This flight, I'm a PP. And, now, I get a CPU?

As insane as it sounds to type this, it seems like now Rainey is happy that he smashed down this over-entitled 1K, and since I stopped spending money, lost some status, I'm no longer over-entitled, and hence, entitled to a CPU.

Incredible.

Or there are fewer Elites in 1/31/2013, as many may have toughed out UA in 2012 and left at the beginning of 2013.
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Old Apr 21, 2013, 7:00 am
  #1630  
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Originally Posted by channa
Or there are fewer Elites in 1/31/2013, as many may have toughed out UA in 2012 and left at the beginning of 2013.
Here here
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Old Apr 21, 2013, 7:10 am
  #1631  
 
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Originally Posted by channa
Or there are fewer Elites in 1/31/2013, as many may have toughed out UA in 2012 and left at the beginning of 2013.
FWIW-I've noticed that several of my formerly elite-heavy routes (e.g., DCA/IAH) are now elite-lite. I don't know whether this is because USG travel budgets have been cut back or many elites have left. Or whether it is simply early in the elite season and people are still qualifying. But my upgrades as a 1K have been 100% on the DCA routes (but still tough on the IAD/SFO routes).
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Old Apr 21, 2013, 9:06 am
  #1632  
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Originally Posted by JetAway
FWIW-I've noticed that several of my formerly elite-heavy routes (e.g., DCA/IAH) are now elite-lite. I don't know whether this is because USG travel budgets have been cut back or many elites have left. Or whether it is simply early in the elite season and people are still qualifying. But my upgrades as a 1K have been 100% on the DCA routes (but still tough on the IAD/SFO routes).
It's probably a combination of both. We Feds are traveling less, we're also traveling more on the competition. I have an attorney who has to travel to LA twice a month, and the AA nonstop is cheaper than UAs and is easier to upgrade on.
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Old Apr 21, 2013, 11:56 am
  #1633  
 
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Originally Posted by halls120
It's probably a combination of both. We Feds are traveling less, we're also traveling more on the competition. I have an attorney who has to travel to LA twice a month, and the AA nonstop is cheaper than UAs and is easier to upgrade on.
Yup! as a fully Federally employed NGO, we used to put 25-30 employees per week on UA's LAX-IAD-LAX nonstops...all were 1Ks and were upgraded 90% of the time which dropped to 25% after 3/3...now we fly a variety of airlines (UA lost its preferred carrier status with us 18 months ago)...some of our staff are flying B6, DL and even UA...but most of us are now flying AA nonstops to DCA with a nearly 100% upgrade rate!

The decision to switch was liberating and a definite "no-brainer"!
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Old Apr 21, 2013, 12:02 pm
  #1634  
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Originally Posted by UA-NYC
There's also been reports of Golds/Silvers boarding in group 1 (and thus I'm guessing non-elites too), even if they're in Y that day, as long as they have an F segment elsewhere in their itinerary. Good technology and all.
Believe those in F on at least one leg are entitled to group 1 throughout that direction of travel (i.e. all segments on the outbound if 1 leg is in F). Once you're in F on one leg, you are entitled to priority services the whole way. So for example, say going SFO-DEN-SJC and getting upgraded before check in on just the DEN-SJC leg. You still get priority tags, F bag allowance, etc. In the case of a connection to Canada/Mex/other int'l destination and you're in F in that segment, you'd also get UC access. However, if not upgraded on the return, you wouldn't have any of it going home.

Its certainly possible that i've missed it, but can't recall any reports of say, upgraded one leg to F on the outbound, but being in group 1 on the return wihtout being upgraded on any of those legs (unless status dictates group 1 already). Now, there have been reports of elites/companions being in group 5, which really shouldn't be happening.
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Old Jun 2, 2013, 11:47 pm
  #1635  
 
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United CFO Rainey Implies Certain Elites were &quot;Over Entitled&quot;.

Had a phone agent openly use the word "entitled" when I called to make a (legal) change to an award reservation that he refused since SHARES wouldn't auto price. Sad this is apparently now permeating the culture at all levels.
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