United CFO Rainey Implies Certain Elites were "Over Entitled".
May 19, 2012, 1:53 pm
#136
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Las Vegas
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I'm not defending UA's actions, but to say they won't have an airline left because you decided to fly on F9 is overstating the matter. Even if many elites follow suit.
WN has only the most basic elite program and they have been the most profitable airline in the United States for three decades.
As I wrote earlier, UA would just as soon sell those seats to a casual traveler who expects no perks in return for his/her business.
TWA Fan, I'm not trying to be disrespectful here but if you have to preface everything with "I'm not defending them but..." then even you know what you're doing.
Your attempts to understand management are insightful, but I think showing "concern" in this case is inappropriate. They insulted their customers point blank. They're out of excuses
Originally Posted by TWA Fan 1
WN has only the most basic elite program and they have been the most profitable airline in the United States for three decades.
As I wrote earlier, UA would just as soon sell those seats to a casual traveler who expects no perks in return for his/her business.
Your attempts to understand management are insightful, but I think showing "concern" in this case is inappropriate. They insulted their customers point blank. They're out of excuses
May 19, 2012, 1:54 pm
#137
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: San Francisco/Tel Aviv/YYZ
Programs: CO 1K-MM
Posts: 10,762
WN has only the most basic elite program and they have been the most profitable airline in the United States for three decades.
May 19, 2012, 2:04 pm
#138
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Brooklyn, NY, USA
Programs: DL SM Plat, B6 TrueBlue, UA MP, AAdvantage
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TWA Fan, I'm not trying to be disrespectful here but if you have to preface everything with "I'm not defending them but..." then even you know what you're doing.
Your attempts to understand management are insightful, but I think showing "concern" in this case is inappropriate. They insulted their customers point blank. They're out of excuses
TWA Fan, I'm not trying to be disrespectful here but if you have to preface everything with "I'm not defending them but..." then even you know what you're doing.
Your attempts to understand management are insightful, but I think showing "concern" in this case is inappropriate. They insulted their customers point blank. They're out of excuses
I am not a CO fan, nor do I like the way they do things.
None of what I am saying is intended in any way to defend, justify, condone anything they're doing.
I know you feel insulted, so do I, and I have felt before, too.
What I'm trying to say, though, is more of a warning than anything else. This wasn't a slip of the tongue, or a misstatement of their business philosophy.
This is it.
They're a hard, cynical bunch and this is really only the beginning.
They don't care about you, and for all of you trying to make a point by skipping to another airline you are basically making their point, essentially falling in their "trap," because they want you to go away, too.
I can assure you they couldn't care less if you feel insulted. All they care about is taking as much of your money as possible.
And every time you get a free upgrade, or you don't pay for a checked bag, or you get free SDC, that's a little bit less of your money to got to take away.
They're not at all happy about that...
May 19, 2012, 2:05 pm
#139
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: NYC and London
Programs: UA 1K; Avis Preferred; PriorityClub Gold; nada anywhere else
Posts: 243
It's shocking. I'm actually shocked.
May 19, 2012, 2:06 pm
#140
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Los Angeles
Programs: AA EVP, United 1K and 2MM, Starwood Lifetime Platinum, Delta
Posts: 219
I sent an email to AA with a link for the conference call and commended them for offering the status match. It's easy to complain about bad business but I felt I had to commend them on what I believe is a good business decision. I told AA that they should forward it to their marketing dept. Can you imagine what wonders a commercial would do for AA's business including that quote?? FT is small compared to the vast reach of television and all those MP members (who are more numerous that French citizens!!!!!!) (not for long) will start flocking to AA. Good for them
And to help him prep for next quarters conference call- its not overcapacity in China that will be behind UA's disappointing revenues next quarter, it will be flyers voting with their wallets....
May 19, 2012, 2:12 pm
#141
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Hoboken, NJ; Pembroke Pines, FL
Programs: CO Gold, SPG Gold
Posts: 2,939
What markets do you fly? I just had to pay $1200 for a same-day booking EWR-BOS-EWR - 35 minutes in the air, 1:20 block time.
May 19, 2012, 2:14 pm
#142
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 187
It's not all United customers who are over-entitled, just its elites.
May 19, 2012, 2:15 pm
#143
Original Poster
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Westchester NY
Programs: UA GS 4+ MM
Posts: 373
Anyone know how to post this over entitled CFO quote on the United Hub? 5000 views in 4 hours should get an honorable mention on the Company website.
May 19, 2012, 2:18 pm
#144
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: iad/dca
Programs: UA Million Mile Gold, Club, AA, Delta, Marriott, Hertz G, A/Club
Posts: 1,106
64,000,000 elites?
Why did they sign them up if they are such a burden?
May 19, 2012, 2:23 pm
#145
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Las Vegas
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+1. Why not just eliminate the CPU system all together then? They are the ones who pushed Real United to end the e500s
Originally Posted by iquitos
Why did they sign them up if they are such a burden?
May 19, 2012, 2:26 pm
#146
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: PDX
Posts: 2,284
The problem isn't filling seats with another casual flyer when someone decides to fly Frontier instead of United for their DEN-PDX flight, it becomes a problem when the seats allocated to fly people from DEN-SFO to catch the SFO-NRT flight never fill up because those passengers decided to fly DEN-LAX-NRT on American instead.
Hubs such as DEN have become less important to airlines like United, because purely domestic itineraries are less important than international itineraries.
Treating international passengers—likely to become 1Ks and GS' faster, and spend more dollars—like a domestic passenger, is a fast way to send an airline to rack and ruin in this day and age. Even the much heralded Southwest is finding it difficult to make money nowadays catering to a purely domestic network.
May 19, 2012, 2:27 pm
#147
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Colorado
Programs: United MM (formerly 1K), Marriott Lifetime Gold
Posts: 551
I'm not defending UA's actions, but to say they won't have an airline left because you decided to fly on F9 is overstating the matter. Even if many elites follow suit.
WN has only the most basic elite program and they have been the most profitable airline in the United States for three decades.
As I wrote earlier, UA would just as soon sell those seats to a casual traveler who expects no perks in return for his/her business.
WN has only the most basic elite program and they have been the most profitable airline in the United States for three decades.
As I wrote earlier, UA would just as soon sell those seats to a casual traveler who expects no perks in return for his/her business.
Given my recent travel experience , I believe the load factor is down and that their assumption is wrong. There is not an endless supply of demand at their prices. The perks made it easy for some elites to justify the higher prices united is charging. That is now clearly going away.
We will find out at the end of the quarter who is right.
May 19, 2012, 2:29 pm
#148
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Carmel Valley(was Hawaii)
Programs: United 1K 2.7 MM
Posts: 1,174
Some people will justify anything. If the new United should throw out E+ and upgrade benefits completely, I am sure you will be there to justify it.
The 1k that achieves his/her status solely on those $300 roundtrip transcons (if you can find them) is probably an Urban myth or, at the very least, a negligibly small minority.
I am not a really big spender, but from this day on my $10,000 to $15,000 in air-travel spending per year is going to AA. Glad I did the status match.
UA does not want my business. Fine, it is going away.
The 1k that achieves his/her status solely on those $300 roundtrip transcons (if you can find them) is probably an Urban myth or, at the very least, a negligibly small minority.
I am not a really big spender, but from this day on my $10,000 to $15,000 in air-travel spending per year is going to AA. Glad I did the status match.
UA does not want my business. Fine, it is going away.
Sorry to be OT.
Last edited by mmack; May 19, 2012 at 2:30 pm Reason: add mea culpa
May 19, 2012, 2:33 pm
#149
Suspended
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: DCA
Programs: UA US CO AA DL FL
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The assumption that UA is using is: (1) that they can sell the seats that elites aren't booking and (2) they will sell those seats at the same price.
Given my recent travel experience , I believe the load factor is down and that their assumption is wrong. There is not an endless supply of demand at their prices. The perks made it easy for some elites to justify the higher prices united is charging. That is now clearly going away.
We will find out at the end of the quarter who is right.
Given my recent travel experience , I believe the load factor is down and that their assumption is wrong. There is not an endless supply of demand at their prices. The perks made it easy for some elites to justify the higher prices united is charging. That is now clearly going away.
We will find out at the end of the quarter who is right.
The new UG system does just that. Rewards the Y/B (and M for 1K) ticket buyers so long as they've got some elite status over those who've made low-spend status.
UA is moving toward a spend-based system, make no mistake about it. But, then again, you can expect that DL and US, after the AA acquisition, will do the same.
Last edited by Often1; May 19, 2012 at 2:48 pm
May 19, 2012, 2:34 pm
#150
Join Date: Apr 2008
Programs: UA1k 3mm, HH-LifeDiamond, Mar-LifePlatElite
Posts: 351
What fare bucket??? - Never said my fares were "cheap" cost wise, just cheap fare buckets.
as for routes, it varies dramatically depending on where my work sends me. Coast to coast domestically, HGK, NRT for TPAC, and LHR and FRA mostly for TATL. Home bases are CMH and MSP, but fares are to from everywhere.