Apr 23, 2013, 6:22 pm
Last edit by: WineCountryUA
Presented as Q&A format (Originally posted by Alex_B)
Q: What is a stopover?
A: A stopover on an international itinerary is any break in your air travel for more than 24 hours except at the destination.
Q: What is an open-jaw?
A: An open-jaw is where you travel by your own means (either land, sea or a separate air ticket) between two points in a journey.
Q: How many stopovers am I allowed on a roundtrip award?
A: One stopover, in addition to the destination, is permitted (an unlimited number of stops less than 24hours is allowable).
Q: How many open-jaws are allowed on a roundtrip award?
A: Two open-jaws are permitted. These must be at the stopover, destination or origin.
Q: Can I have a stopover or open-jaw on a one-way award?
A: No
Q: Can I have a open-jaw at both the stopover and destination?
A: Yes, plenty of posters have reported success in booking this
Q: Can I transit my destination multiple times (e.g. fly to JNB, fly to CPT and then return home via JNB)?
A: Yes, plenty of posters have reported success in booking this. You can only stop in your destination for > 24 hours once though.
Q: Can I cross both oceans?
A: Yes. The rule that prohibited crossing both oceans appears to have been removed from both MP and *A award rules. There are many many successful examples of people booking these itineraries.
Q: Is EWR-PVG transatlantic or transpacific?
A: US-East Asia/South East Asia is always transpacific no matter what geography might suggest.
Q: Do I pay more for a stopover or open-jaw?
A: Typically no additional mileage is required but additional taxes or fees are often payable (especially in UK with high Air Passenger Duty). Extra mileage will often be required if an open-jaw or stopover adds a higher cost region into the itinerary. Also awards wholly within CONUS, Canada and Alaska (formerly known as Series 0 awards) require additional mileage (10K miles) for a stopover of >4 hrs.
Q: What's this about a free one-way I can get on awards?
A: The concept of free one-ways is a misnomer and often confuses people, it is better to consider it a stopover in the city of origin. If you have a simple roundtrip award without a stopover, you can often create a stopover and open-jaw at your origin on the return leg to add an addition flight. E.g. I wish to book EWR-LHR (destination)-EWR which is a roundtrip US-Europe award. I could also book this as EWR-LHR (destination)-EWR (stopover)-SFO for the same mileage (and a few dollars of extra tax). The EWR segment would need to be within 330 days of booking and would be subject to the usual change fees.
Other notes:
Seeing your fare construction on an already booked award ticket:
In order to see your award fare construction to see where your stopovers and destination are, follow these steps.
Go to http://www.saudiairlines.com/
Then hit "Manage My Bookings" and select "E-Ticket"
Enter your UA ticket number (hint: 016 will go in the first box, and then everything else in the second box). Then your last name and hit "Retrieve My Booking". On the next page you'll see a line like this under "Fare Calculation":
CHI LH X/FRA LH ROM0.00CSM/YB52 /- FLR LH X/FRA LH X/DUS LH CHI UA SEA
This example is:
ORD-FRA-FCO
Open Jaw at Destination
FLR-FRA-DUS-ORD
Stopover at origin
ORD-SEA
Q: What is a stopover?
A: A stopover on an international itinerary is any break in your air travel for more than 24 hours except at the destination.
Q: What is an open-jaw?
A: An open-jaw is where you travel by your own means (either land, sea or a separate air ticket) between two points in a journey.
Q: How many stopovers am I allowed on a roundtrip award?
A: One stopover, in addition to the destination, is permitted (an unlimited number of stops less than 24hours is allowable).
Q: How many open-jaws are allowed on a roundtrip award?
A: Two open-jaws are permitted. These must be at the stopover, destination or origin.
Q: Can I have a stopover or open-jaw on a one-way award?
A: No
Q: Can I have a open-jaw at both the stopover and destination?
A: Yes, plenty of posters have reported success in booking this
Q: Can I transit my destination multiple times (e.g. fly to JNB, fly to CPT and then return home via JNB)?
A: Yes, plenty of posters have reported success in booking this. You can only stop in your destination for > 24 hours once though.
Q: Can I cross both oceans?
A: Yes. The rule that prohibited crossing both oceans appears to have been removed from both MP and *A award rules. There are many many successful examples of people booking these itineraries.
Q: Is EWR-PVG transatlantic or transpacific?
A: US-East Asia/South East Asia is always transpacific no matter what geography might suggest.
Q: Do I pay more for a stopover or open-jaw?
A: Typically no additional mileage is required but additional taxes or fees are often payable (especially in UK with high Air Passenger Duty). Extra mileage will often be required if an open-jaw or stopover adds a higher cost region into the itinerary. Also awards wholly within CONUS, Canada and Alaska (formerly known as Series 0 awards) require additional mileage (10K miles) for a stopover of >4 hrs.
Q: What's this about a free one-way I can get on awards?
A: The concept of free one-ways is a misnomer and often confuses people, it is better to consider it a stopover in the city of origin. If you have a simple roundtrip award without a stopover, you can often create a stopover and open-jaw at your origin on the return leg to add an addition flight. E.g. I wish to book EWR-LHR (destination)-EWR which is a roundtrip US-Europe award. I could also book this as EWR-LHR (destination)-EWR (stopover)-SFO for the same mileage (and a few dollars of extra tax). The EWR segment would need to be within 330 days of booking and would be subject to the usual change fees.
Other notes:
- The open-jaw portion must be smaller (in miles) than any other leg. -While technically true for revenue fare construction this is not strictly enforced on awards.
- For awards between CONUS/Canada/Alaska and South Asia award regions the maximum number of segments is 5 segments each way on a round-trip and 4 segments on a one-way. (Note that many FTers report recently being read a memo that imposes an eight segment maximum on a roundtrip (4 each way). It is unclear whether this eight-segment maximum is limited to South Asia routings through Europe or North Asia, or has broader application.)
- Stopovers and open-jaws are NOT additive. You do not get extra stops included in your itinerary simply by making an open-jaw out of it.
Seeing your fare construction on an already booked award ticket:
In order to see your award fare construction to see where your stopovers and destination are, follow these steps.
Go to http://www.saudiairlines.com/
Then hit "Manage My Bookings" and select "E-Ticket"
Enter your UA ticket number (hint: 016 will go in the first box, and then everything else in the second box). Then your last name and hit "Retrieve My Booking". On the next page you'll see a line like this under "Fare Calculation":
CHI LH X/FRA LH ROM0.00CSM/YB52 /- FLR LH X/FRA LH X/DUS LH CHI UA SEA
This example is:
ORD-FRA-FCO
Open Jaw at Destination
FLR-FRA-DUS-ORD
Stopover at origin
ORD-SEA
Rules for Open Jaw & Stopover Award Flights (Consolidated)
Jun 24, 2012, 3:37 pm
#151
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: World
Programs: Alaska, AA, UA, DL, SPG, AMEX
Posts: 278
Open jaws are ALWAYS at destination or origin/return. And you can actually have 2 open jaws and a stopover.
Your original itinerary had four distinct legs:
SFO-BOM, BOM-SIN, SIN-IAH, IAH-SFO
There's no way to do that with a RT award. One of those legs requires an additional ticket.
joe
Your original itinerary had four distinct legs:
SFO-BOM, BOM-SIN, SIN-IAH, IAH-SFO
There's no way to do that with a RT award. One of those legs requires an additional ticket.
joe
Jun 24, 2012, 3:39 pm
#152
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: On the road in North America....
Programs: UA 1MM, *G, Global Entry
Posts: 579
Edit: OK, I'm not sure that the open jaw has to be at the origin or destination. Maybe it can be at the stopover. But the open jaws don't give you an extra stop. Three legs max. You have four.
joe
Jun 24, 2012, 4:01 pm
#153
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: World
Programs: Alaska, AA, UA, DL, SPG, AMEX
Posts: 278
Because the open jaw has to be at the destination or the origin. You have two stopovers, one of which is ALSO an open jaw.
Edit: OK, I'm not sure that the open jaw has to be at the origin or destination. Maybe it can be at the stopover. But the open jaws don't give you an extra stop. Three legs max. You have four.
joe
Edit: OK, I'm not sure that the open jaw has to be at the origin or destination. Maybe it can be at the stopover. But the open jaws don't give you an extra stop. Three legs max. You have four.
joe
Jun 24, 2012, 4:11 pm
#154
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: On the road in North America....
Programs: UA 1MM, *G, Global Entry
Posts: 579
The relevant ones are:
Two open jaws are permitted per roundtrip award. For example, you can fly from Newark to London and return from Paris to Washington Dulles.
A stopover is permitted on roundtrip award travel only. One stopover is permitted, unless otherwise noted. Additional mileage may be required for Saver Awards within the mainland U.S., Alaska and Canada.
It doesn't specifically say three segments, but that follows from the two rules. You get two legs for a RT award. You can split one of those legs with a stopover. So you get three legs max. You don't get another stopover by calling it an open jaw.
joe
Jun 24, 2012, 4:48 pm
#155
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: World
Programs: Alaska, AA, UA, DL, SPG, AMEX
Posts: 278
Thanks. Appreciate the info^
Jun 24, 2012, 7:06 pm
#156
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: PSM
Posts: 69,232
It doesn't have to be at the origin or destination but the issue of too many stops in the itinerary proposed still remains.
Jun 25, 2012, 1:09 am
#157
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 30
United Award ticket-stopover in Asia
Hello Flyertalk community.
I'm a complete newbie at booking award tickets, but just from doing a bit of research, I'm pretty sure it's possible to book an award ticket from the US to Asia with a stopover in Europe. I know United allows 1 stopover and 1 open jaw, but I'm not sure about all the restrictions they put on it.
My plan is: NYC-FRA-BKK-DEN
From what I understand, booking a saver coach class ticket on this route would cost me 65,000 miles. Can anyone verify this?
I'm a complete newbie at booking award tickets, but just from doing a bit of research, I'm pretty sure it's possible to book an award ticket from the US to Asia with a stopover in Europe. I know United allows 1 stopover and 1 open jaw, but I'm not sure about all the restrictions they put on it.
My plan is: NYC-FRA-BKK-DEN
From what I understand, booking a saver coach class ticket on this route would cost me 65,000 miles. Can anyone verify this?
Jun 25, 2012, 1:37 am
#158
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: SFO, BDL
Programs: UA 1K, AA Plat, CX GR, Hilton Diamond, Global Entry
Posts: 963
Welcome to FT, gellison47
I am not an expert on award travel routing rules...but I was able to do a dummy booking that yielded NYC-FRA(stop)-BKK(destination)-DEN for 65k miles plus fees for a saver economy ticket.
I am not an expert on award travel routing rules...but I was able to do a dummy booking that yielded NYC-FRA(stop)-BKK(destination)-DEN for 65k miles plus fees for a saver economy ticket.
Jun 25, 2012, 4:00 am
#159
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: body: A stone's throw from SFO, mind: SE Asia
Programs: Some of this 'n some of that
Posts: 17,263
SFO-(FRA/MUC etc)- BOM (stopover) - SIN (desitnation) -(FRA/MUC etc) - IAH//AUS-SFO.
In this way you won't be backtracking on that last leg which might make it acceptable. My bet is still on the need to purchase a separate ticket AUS-SFO, btu it's worth a try.
You also might save some miles if traveling in Y with SIN as your destination rather than BOM.
Last edited by dsquared37; Jun 25, 2012 at 4:04 am Reason: i thought it was the wrong thread but it wasn't.
Jun 25, 2012, 6:33 am
#160
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: PSM
Posts: 69,232
If you travel via Europe you can work it slightly different:
SFO-(FRA/MUC etc)- BOM (stopover) - SIN (desitnation) -(FRA/MUC etc) - IAH//AUS-SFO.
In this way you won't be backtracking on that last leg which might make it acceptable. My bet is still on the need to purchase a separate ticket AUS-SFO, btu it's worth a try.
SFO-(FRA/MUC etc)- BOM (stopover) - SIN (desitnation) -(FRA/MUC etc) - IAH//AUS-SFO.
In this way you won't be backtracking on that last leg which might make it acceptable. My bet is still on the need to purchase a separate ticket AUS-SFO, btu it's worth a try.
Jun 25, 2012, 6:46 am
#161
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 30
I was able to do the same thing on the United website but I wasn't sure if this was a fluke or not. It just seems like this routing is too good to be true to only cost 65,000 miles. Almost like they are giving away a free trip to Europe...
Jun 25, 2012, 6:55 am
#162
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: body: A stone's throw from SFO, mind: SE Asia
Programs: Some of this 'n some of that
Posts: 17,263
I agree that this is unlikely to ticket due to the IAH/AUS plan. The one benefit of routing through Europe with SIN as the destination is awards in Y are cheaper to SIN than to BOM. IIRC awards in C/F are the same cost from N America.
Jun 25, 2012, 6:56 am
#163
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: PSM
Posts: 69,232
You also can probably fly in to FRA and then get yourself to somewhere else in Europe and fly from there to BKK if you want to before returning to DEN. You're actually allowed two open-jaws, not one.
Jun 25, 2012, 7:46 am
#164
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 30
I thought this was the case as well, but for some reason when I try to book NYC-AMS and then FRA-BKK-DEN it gives me an error message. Not sure what I'm doing wrong.
Jun 25, 2012, 7:59 am
#165
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: PSM
Posts: 69,232