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Dear United: Welcome to competition (DL's new hub at LGA)

Dear United: Welcome to competition (DL's new hub at LGA)

Old Dec 16, 11, 12:06 pm
  #1  
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Dear United: Welcome to competition (DL's new hub at LGA)

Delta officially announced their plans for their new LGA hub today and it looks like there will be some competition coming in more than one way for United.

On the route map there will be direct competition on LGA-IAH (4x daily) and LGA-CLE (5x daily) for the first time in recent memory, if ever. Those routes start in July 2012. LGA-DEN and LGA-IAD will also be added in July, though those routes also see competition today to some extent. It will be quite interesting to see what the company does in response to real competition on these routes.

There will also be competition for operation of the best hublette facility, with a whole bunch of these flights operated on RJs, similar to the CLE operation.

Last edited by FlyinHawaiian; Dec 16, 11 at 12:10 pm Reason: minor edit to thread title
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Old Dec 16, 11, 12:09 pm
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Originally Posted by sbm12 View Post
It will be quite interesting to see what the company does in response to real competition on these routes.
Agreed. I think this is good news for NYC-based travellers.
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Old Dec 16, 11, 12:16 pm
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With the DL announcement, was going to post this ---
is DL the new / main domestic competition to UA ?
Maybe with the exception of ORD is AA not longer the prime competitor?
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Old Dec 16, 11, 12:19 pm
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Competition is usually good news Let's hope that some of the crazy prices on flights to/from LGA go down..
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Old Dec 16, 11, 12:22 pm
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Originally Posted by WineCountryUA View Post
With the DL announcement, was going to post this ---
is DL the new / main domestic competition to UA ?
Maybe with the exception of ORD is AA not longer the prime competitor?
Even without the announcement they were IMO. The shift into LGA makes them even more capable/strong as a competitor, but they already were the main competition of UA.
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Old Dec 16, 11, 12:25 pm
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If only DL would add some nonstops out of the Bay Area....
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Old Dec 16, 11, 12:38 pm
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They are adding LGA-DFW/MIA as well. As someone pointed out in another board these may come across as attacks on AA/UA but in reality if DL wants to really gain a foothold in the NYC market outside of JFK international destinations they really need to add these cities.
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Old Dec 16, 11, 12:41 pm
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Still find it shocking that US gave up all those slots at LGA and are voluntarily moving over to a smaller, much less desirable terminal. Yes, I know it allows them to beef up DCA, but still...
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Old Dec 16, 11, 12:42 pm
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Originally Posted by nova08 View Post
They are adding LGA-DFW/MIA as well. As someone pointed out in another board these may come across as attacks on AA/UA but in reality if DL wants to really gain a foothold in the NYC market outside of JFK international destinations they really need to add these cities.
I don't think these moves are a direct attack on UA or any other carrier, but the net effect is the same - competition where there previously was none.

The "attacks" can be seen as:
  • MIA, DFW - AA
  • IAD, CLE, DEN, IAH - UA
  • CLT, PHL - US
  • SYR, BUF, ROC, BTV, PWM - B6
  • YUL, YHZ, YOW - AC

Or just Delta adding/expanding into a dozen or more major business markets which they are not serving (or not as much) today.
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Old Dec 16, 11, 12:47 pm
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I find this a completely funny conversation. So many people on this board (probably not those already posting) claim that LGA\JFK and EWR are not the same market (ie the same passenger does not view them as interchangable). If that is the case then this move by DL is not attacking UA but rather attacking B6 & AA.

I live in central NJ and frankly whatever DL does at LGA has no impact on me on the decision I make in flight decisions. I will fly UA from EWR.
The only impact that it could have is on pricing in the NYC to XYZ market, which I would welcome, but I hold out little hope.
I look at common markets like EWR-MSP and EWR-ATL that both DL and UA compete on today at EWR. Those are very expensive flights and they have competition today.
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Old Dec 16, 11, 12:51 pm
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Originally Posted by Sprezzatura View Post
If only DL would add some nonstops out of the Bay Area....
You mean like ATL, DTW, MSP, CVG, SLC, LAX, JFK, NRT, HNL

I would think Delta would continue to concentrate on LAX before any potential expansion in the Bay Area.
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Old Dec 16, 11, 1:08 pm
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Originally Posted by koc1723 View Post
I find this a completely funny conversation. So many people on this board (probably not those already posting) claim that LGA\JFK and EWR are not the same market (ie the same passenger does not view them as interchangable). If that is the case then this move by DL is not attacking UA but rather attacking B6 & AA.
Well, LGA-IAH and LGA-CLE could be attacking the IAH and CLE hubs.
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Old Dec 16, 11, 1:13 pm
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DL already spanks UA on product and quality. DL's RJs have tons of first class, glassware and mugs in F. An FA on Republic told me they serve hot meals on the delta ERJ-170s?

In any case, DL's aircraft are far superior choices while CO is stuffing people into turbo-props, Single Class RJs for 1,200 miles and 737s in the Pacific. UA is losing to DL already and as UA races to the bottom with bad coffee, gauze blankets and surly octogenarians tossing slop at you, UA will retreat even futher.
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Old Dec 16, 11, 1:22 pm
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Originally Posted by mccullo3 View Post
You mean like ATL, DTW, MSP, CVG, SLC, LAX, JFK, NRT, HNL

I would think Delta would continue to concentrate on LAX before any potential expansion in the Bay Area.
Then again LGA-LAX/SFO/PDX/SEA would be forbidden anyways (unless on Saturdays).
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Old Dec 16, 11, 1:23 pm
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Originally Posted by UA-NYC View Post
Still find it shocking that US gave up all those slots at LGA
Then you haven't been paying attention to:
  • How US has been utilizing these slots
  • How US has "evolved" their business model and how that doesn't really fit with NYC

They are giving up a lot, but they are doing it to reduce costs and give PHL a little more breathing room. As much as I think US' executive management has a collective IQ of 20/20, this makes sense.

LGA has always been an afterthought to CO and UA with just hub feeder flights. I doubt you'll see too much price pressure unless DL operates at a loss in an attempt to poach CO/UA hub - hub traffic, which is a tough thing to do. NYC is large enough that several airlines run hub (or hub like) operations at the regions three main airports and the prices are still some of the highest in the country.
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