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CO/UA Million Mile (and Beyond) Flyer Benefits, Effective Spring 2012

CO/UA Million Mile (and Beyond) Flyer Benefits, Effective Spring 2012

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Old Nov 22, 11, 10:57 am
  #1231  
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Originally Posted by dgcpaphd View Post
In most instances the "story-telling" is verbal. The airline oersonnel can blame the contradiction on a misunderstanding. However, in this case of the million-mile program, we have it in writing which confirms that the new United management appears to care little, if anything at all, about credibility.
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You can find plentiful examples of reversals on written promised with all the airlines. That's why they keep a huge army of lawyers on staff. Even Southwest and Jet Blue.
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Old Nov 22, 11, 11:24 am
  #1232  
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We are forgetting one thing. All United has to say is:

"This is a merger of 2 airlines. The old United will not exist anymore. The old Continental will not exist anymore. We are being generous by giving you some of what the old airline gave you. We could have scrapped the whole program as we are a new airline. We have just chosen to maintain a legacy name but this is not your fathers United (sorry, had to steal from Oldsmobile)".

But yes, fight for what you want. You never know, they may cave on some things.
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Old Nov 22, 11, 11:28 am
  #1233  
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Originally Posted by GoingAway View Post
That is actually scary as to the number of GSs who will be occasional flyers.

Thanks for the correction
Well, it says MileagePlus, and GS is not an MP level, so that's why the question if the spouse would be 1K or GS.
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Old Nov 22, 11, 12:02 pm
  #1234  
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Originally Posted by Baze View Post
We are forgetting one thing. All United has to say is:

"This is a merger of 2 airlines. The old United will not exist anymore. The old Continental will not exist anymore. We are being generous by giving you some of what the old airline gave you. We could have scrapped the whole program as we are a new airline. We have just chosen to maintain a legacy name but this is not your fathers United (sorry, had to steal from Oldsmobile)".

But yes, fight for what you want. You never know, they may cave on some things.
Please take a look at the balance sheet of the new company (United-Continental Holdings, Inc). There you will find an enormous liability for outstanding miles of the two formerly independent airlines. There are approximately 80 million registered participants in the combined frequent flyer programs.

In view of the above, it would not have been legal to merge the two entities (going concerns) and abandon a major asset and liability (frequent flyer programs) without great financial consequences. The merger would not have been approved if the programs were to be abandoned.
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Old Nov 22, 11, 12:54 pm
  #1235  
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Originally Posted by dgcpaphd View Post
.... The merger would not have been approved if the programs were to be abandoned.
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Since abandoning the programs is not on the table, this is a bit of a red herring. (Abandoning is a far cry from reducing some past promised benefits.)
But the program members had no say in the merger. PMUA & PMCO were majority owned by institutions. Any change in the FF programs would have been viewed by the institutional owners as a business decision in light of the potential impact of future business.
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Old Nov 22, 11, 12:55 pm
  #1236  
 
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More to the point, UA didn't terminate its mileage rewards program, even though it may have had the right to do so. Instead, UA and CO continued their respective rewards programs in a combined program, and gave explicit written assurances to their members that their original benefits would continue, without interruption. Those statements were either false when made, or became such following a change of mind by UACO. IMO, neither offers a defense to breaking a promise in a commercial context once the promisee has acted in reliance on the written assurances of the promisor.


Dave

Last edited by DGellman; Nov 22, 11 at 1:03 pm Reason: typo
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Old Nov 22, 11, 1:28 pm
  #1237  
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Originally Posted by Pat89339 View Post
He pointed out such gems as this: I will receive 2 regional upgrades after flying 75K and another 2 at 100K. When I went to school, 2+2=4. I felt obliged to respond to this pointing out that with the current program I receive 10 regional upgrades per year for the loyalty and business I give UA and asked him to explain how 4 regional upgrades is anything but a downgrade from 10. Is this the new math?
I wonder how - or even if - he will respond to this?
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Old Nov 22, 11, 2:06 pm
  #1238  
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Originally Posted by Pat89339 View Post
..... He pointed out such gems as this: I will receive 2 regional upgrades after flying 75K and another 2 at 100K. When I went to school, 2+2=4. I felt obliged to respond to this pointing out that with the current program I receive 10 regional upgrades per year for the loyalty and business I give UA and asked him to explain how 4 regional upgrades is anything but a downgrade from 10. Is this the new math?
also a bit disingenuous to talk about 10.
The original program was 2 per quarter -- max 8. The new program is 2 for every 25K EQM starting at 75K -- with no limit on earning. In 2011 grandfather 1Ks that just make 100K EQMs can earn as many as 12 -- but that is just for the transition year . And the change was announced in early 2011.

correction 1KMMs in the old program could get 10 CR1s -- including the annual MM s CR1s -- my error

Last edited by WineCountryUA; Nov 22, 11 at 4:01 pm Reason: correction
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Old Nov 22, 11, 3:54 pm
  #1239  
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Originally Posted by WineCountryUA View Post
also a bit disingenuous to talk about 10.
The original program was 2 per quarter -- max 8. The new program is 2 for every 25K EQM starting at 75K -- with no limit on earning. In 2011 grandfather 1Ks that just make 100K EQMs can earn as many as 12 -- but that is just for the transition year . And the change was announced in early 2011.
How exactly is is disingenuous to talk about 10? This thread is here to discuss the MM Flyer Benefits. I have received 10 every year as a 1KMM flyer (2 per quarter with required miles flown, plus 2 for my MM status; 2x4+2=10). There are countless others here similarly situated.
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Old Nov 22, 11, 3:59 pm
  #1240  
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Originally Posted by Pat89339 View Post
How exactly is is disingenuous to talk about 10? This thread is here to discuss the MM Flyer Benefits. I have received 10 every year as a 1KMM flyer (2 per quarter with required miles flown, plus 2 for my MM status; 2x4+2=10). There are countless others here similarly situated.
you are correct for 1KMM -- I lost focus this is the MM thread. I assumed it was related to the transition period.
my apologies
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Old Nov 22, 11, 6:34 pm
  #1241  
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I originally was caught up in the spin - 2 months later I conclude the policies are a downgrade from what United originally had. As are the changes to MP generally.
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Old Nov 23, 11, 8:17 pm
  #1242  
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Originally Posted by Pat89339 View Post
How exactly is is disingenuous to talk about 10?
Because you get 2, not 10, for your MM status.

Originally Posted by Pat89339 View Post
I have received 10 every year as a 1KMM flyer (2 per quarter with required miles flown, plus 2 for my MM status; 2x4+2=10).
Except the 8 earned CR1s have nothing to do with being MM-- those are for being 1K and meeting the quarterly requirement. Non-MM 1K members get them and non-1K MM members don't. If this discussion is truly about breaking promises with respect to million-mile benefits, then the only numbers that are relevant are 2 and 0; UA promised 2 per year, not "up tp 10" when they sent out that letter thanking you for being a MM.
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Old Nov 23, 11, 10:09 pm
  #1243  
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Originally Posted by Ari View Post
Because you get 2, not 10, for your MM status.



Except the 8 earned CR1s have nothing to do with being MM-- those are for being 1K and meeting the quarterly requirement. Non-MM 1K members get them and non-1K MM members don't. If this discussion is truly about breaking promises with respect to million-mile benefits, then the only numbers that are relevant are 2 and 0; UA promised 2 per year, not "up tp 10" when they sent out that letter thanking you for being a MM.
His response to me included the fact that I would receive 2 at 75K and 2 for every 25K after that. Taking your hard tack on the thread title then, exactly what does that have to do with a reduction in MM benefits other than the now common smoke and mirrors response? Foland was the one who brought this up in his response to the reduction in benefits.

I guess the divide and conquer tactic is popular.
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Old Nov 24, 11, 12:07 am
  #1244  
 
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Originally Posted by uastarflyer View Post
I originally was caught up in the spin - 2 months later I conclude the policies are a downgrade from what United originally had. As are the changes to MP generally.
As a 2MM, I think the only downgrade of any major consequence (apart from having to sit in crappy aircraft and having no free entertainment) is the reduction in bonus miles to 75%.

It's probably a deal breaker for me though.
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Old Nov 24, 11, 12:27 am
  #1245  
 
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Still concerned. Still writing to Mr. Foland. Still watching here.

Anyone else who hasn't written here in a while doing similar?
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