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United Airlines' First Boeing 787 Dreamliner Begins Assembly

United Airlines' First Boeing 787 Dreamliner Begins Assembly

Old Aug 18, 11, 9:16 am
  #61  
 
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Originally Posted by sbm12 View Post
I had some spare time tonight and I put together this mock-up of the seat map:



I wonder how close to correct I am.

ETA: This is based on a decent amount of previous analysis of the aircraft size and some statements from CO (now UA) employees, both publicly and privately.
The brochure, which may be outdated, suggests there's more curvature towards the back, meaning the last one or two rows may have only 7 (2+3+2) seats.
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Old Aug 18, 11, 9:22 am
  #62  
 
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Originally Posted by LAX View Post
I can't understand why some people call others inconsiderate when others don't do something to their liking while they don't think about themselves being inconsiderate when asking others to do what they prefer?!

LAX
+1

Sometimes I get a twang of motion sickness, which I cure by staring out the window for a while.

Get one of those eye covers if the light bothers you that much.
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Old Aug 18, 11, 9:42 am
  #63  
 
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Originally Posted by sxf24 View Post
No seats have been designated for crew rest as of yet.



I've heard you can still see through the windows when fully tinted, though obviously the view wouldn't be that great.
What I am curious about is whether they have a backup method if:

- the tinting breaks on long intercontinental flights
- the window is stuck tinted for countries that require shades up during takeoff and landing - probably less of the problem if you can still see through

Thanks.
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Old Aug 18, 11, 9:49 am
  #64  
 
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Originally Posted by username View Post
What I am curious about is whether they have a backup method if:

- the tinting breaks on long intercontinental flights
- the window is stuck tinted for countries that require shades up during takeoff and landing - probably less of the problem if you can still see through

Thanks.
A good follow up question is to see what are the costs required to replace and fix such a window.
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Old Aug 18, 11, 9:51 am
  #65  
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Originally Posted by username View Post
- the window is stuck tinted for countries that require shades up during takeoff and landing - probably less of the problem if you can still see through
Some countries require shades up during takeoff and landing? Which ones and why?
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Old Aug 18, 11, 10:00 am
  #66  
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Originally Posted by joshwex90 View Post
Some countries require shades up during takeoff and landing? Which ones and why?
No idea, but I think it's pretty silly to want your shade to be closed for takeoff and landing. Why wouldn't you want to look outside to see how close you are to the ground?
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Old Aug 18, 11, 10:02 am
  #67  
 
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Originally Posted by UnitedSkies View Post
No idea, but I think it's pretty silly to want your shade to be closed for takeoff and landing. Why wouldn't you want to look outside to see how close you are to the ground?
http://brokensecrets.com/2010/12/10/...f-and-landing/

You may not have heard of this, but itís law in some countries and itís growing in popularity around the world. The reason is similar to why the airlines dim the interior lights during takeoffs and landings at night.
In short, itís for safety in the event of an accident. With the window shades up, passengers and crew can spot dangers outside the planes before they open an emergency exit. Dangers like fire, water and running airplane engines can be hazardous if someone opens an emergency exit right into them.
During bright daylight, it also allows your eyes to adjust to the brightness outside, which could be critical during an accident.
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Old Aug 18, 11, 10:30 am
  #68  
 
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Originally Posted by tuolumne View Post
Could we possibly see a different configuration on the 25 UA birds? I presume the 787/a350s were going to be 3-Cabin on UA, or being so far out, perhaps that decision wasn't made.

Also, I find it interesting they released a PR statement calling the C cabin "BusinessFirst", instead of just "United Business". If they are in fact keeping BF, the only logic I could think of is that it may possibly "cushions the blow" per say of not having an F cabin to upgrade into, so "hey, you get a BusinessFirst hybrid (PMCO CO 2-cabin), which has more storage space than 3-cabin (PMUA) C". This would imply that they then intend to differentiate between the two different B/E Aerospace models they both use for C, both possibly being dissimilar enough to name and sell differently.

That would mean, of course, that the two would be different products, and 3-cabin C would be "that one with more seats thrown in and has less privacy and storage of 'BusinessFirst'". So then what, do you price the two differently? Are service levels identical between both? These points ultimately has me leaning on the side of both products simply being named and sold as "United Business" - Having the C cabin being named (and possibly sold) differently depending on whether it's 2-cabin or 3-cabin (PMUA or PMCO) C seems to create more noise and other issues than it's ultimately worth.
99% of people think it's business class no matter what you brand it.

The BizFirst distinction basically means a business class with no middle seats and upgraded meal svc. That may be the attempted name distinction.

They've never tried to extract a premium price for it, and frankly the only place it really matters is the 777. No legacy CO 747s and the 767s/787s too narrow for middle seats.

AA has done it this way for years...part of fleet 3 class, the 2 class gets upgraded biz meals and it's 767 with no middles. But no name difference.

At the end of the day UA was the only carrier in the world exclusively 3 class intl. Not even CX, NH, or SQ are. It was an anachronism.

But when the PS flights go 2 class I'll bet they trot out the BizFirst moniker and carry on COs anachronism.
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Old Aug 18, 11, 10:38 am
  #69  
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Originally Posted by username View Post
What I am curious about is whether they have a backup method if:

- the tinting breaks on long intercontinental flights
- the window is stuck tinted for countries that require shades up during takeoff and landing - probably less of the problem if you can still see through

Thanks.
Excellent questions that I have no answers to.
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Old Aug 18, 11, 10:41 am
  #70  
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Originally Posted by cerealmarketer View Post
But when the PS flights go 2 class I'll bet they trot out the BizFirst moniker and carry on COs anachronism.
While the remaining UA 777s and CO 767s are waiting to be retrofitted, maybe their C should be designated BusinessCoach to reflect their less desirable non-flatbed nature
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Old Aug 18, 11, 11:23 am
  #71  
 
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Originally Posted by edcho View Post
I can't wait to see it.
If you are in the Everett area, you can:
http://www.futureofflight.org/fof_Boeing.html

I wonder what position it is in (1-4) right now. In the 4th position you can see it pretty well from the observation deck. There is a sign put on every aircraft with the customer and that aircraft number for that customer so you should be able to identify it. I am sure no seats in it yet and you can't see inside
Maybe I will go check it out this weekend.... hmm...

Originally Posted by planemechanic View Post
I wonder how many people who love to keep the window shade up will be furious to learn that all of the window tinting on the 787 can be controlled from the FA station, just like the cabin lighting. So when they want to have the cabin dark they will no longer need to ask, just a flip of the switch and they will be done.
I hope it works like a car. The driver can control all the windows but by default individuals can also control. Another switch can disable local control and keep all us kids off the button
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Old Aug 18, 11, 11:28 am
  #72  
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Originally Posted by tuolumne View Post
Also, I find it interesting they released a PR statement calling the C cabin "BusinessFirst", instead of just "United Business". If they are in fact keeping BF, the only logic I could think of is that it may possibly "cushions the blow" per say of not having an F cabin to upgrade into, so "hey, you get a BusinessFirst hybrid (PMCO CO 2-cabin), which has more storage space than 3-cabin (PMUA) C". This would imply that they then intend to differentiate between the two different B/E Aerospace models they both use for C, both possibly being dissimilar enough to name and sell differently.

That would mean, of course, that the two would be different products, and 3-cabin C would be "that one with more seats thrown in and has less privacy and storage of 'BusinessFirst'". So then what, do you price the two differently? Are service levels identical between both? These points ultimately has me leaning on the side of both products simply being named and sold as "United Business" - Having the C cabin being named (and possibly sold) differently depending on whether it's 2-cabin or 3-cabin (PMUA or PMCO) C seems to create more noise and other issues than it's ultimately worth.
For the purposes of FT discussion, it's more convenient to call it BF instead of "biz on a 2 cabin aircraft" to differentiate from business/"biz on a 3 cabin aircraft".

Originally Posted by sbm12 View Post
I don't think so, though maybe. The space between door 1 and door 2 on the 777 is about 60" more than on the 787. That means you lose a row. And there are only 26 seats in zone 1 on the 777 so that puts you at 20 (or possibly only 18 if they do full rows) to fit in that area.
The 777 can fit 5 rows between door 1 and door 2 - and they do in the center column. The window seat columns on the 777 are constrained by the lav behind 1L instead of in front of it as on the 787, and the closet in front of 2R.
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Old Aug 18, 11, 11:46 am
  #73  
 
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Originally Posted by UA-NYC View Post
While the remaining UA 777s and CO 767s are waiting to be retrofitted, maybe their C should be designated BusinessCoach to reflect their less desirable non-flatbed nature
Hilarious ... I just booked EWR-FRA-FCO to avoid the seat masquerading as a business seat on the CO nonstop EWR-FCO.
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Old Aug 18, 11, 11:48 am
  #74  
 
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Aren't the first routes supposedly IAH-AKL and IAH-LOS ... anyone else surprised that a small F cabin (perhaps one row of 3 seats) couldn't be filled on such long routes?
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Old Aug 18, 11, 11:53 am
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Originally Posted by RJNYC View Post
Hilarious ... I just booked EWR-FRA-FCO to avoid the seat masquerading as a business seat on the CO nonstop EWR-FCO.
But this way you will get an economy seat with middle blocked for FRA-FCO on LH...
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