Turkish hosed me
Jun 20, 2019, 1:37 am
#32
Moderator, Turkish Airlines Miles&Smiles & Accor ALL
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: BRU
Programs: TK*G, Accor ALL Platinum
Posts: 7,581
Maybe we can focus on the issue at hand and not wander of on the merry road of history?
I think PiperAtGatesofDawn has summed up the situation very clearly and correctly. This is not a problem of TK's making. Having flown on that route (IST-MLE-CMB) it is very clear pax are only allowed to leave at MLE but not board. Even if they wanted to there are no check in or gate staff on this routing. AV fraudulently sold something, it is up to them to sort it out.
I think PiperAtGatesofDawn has summed up the situation very clearly and correctly. This is not a problem of TK's making. Having flown on that route (IST-MLE-CMB) it is very clear pax are only allowed to leave at MLE but not board. Even if they wanted to there are no check in or gate staff on this routing. AV fraudulently sold something, it is up to them to sort it out.
Jun 20, 2019, 3:31 am
#34
FlyerTalk Evangelist
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As much as I enjoy taking a rhetorical scalpel to wildly incorrect statements and those who double down on them instead of accepting reason, it's not getting us or the OP anywhere.
Jun 20, 2019, 10:23 am
#35
Join Date: Sep 2017
Programs: TK E+, RJ S, AZ E
Posts: 1,869
Let me not focus on who to blame but on how such a situation should have been resolved.
A TK agent (on behalf of AV or not) would approach OP after landing and inform that there’s a problem with the ticket and they would no be able to board the TK flight as no pax is allowed to due to regulation.
The TK agent would then inform that they have already been put on the next available flight to CMB and hand vouchers for food.
I had a different situation with some similarities in the past. I was scheduled on a EY codeshare flight on MH metal. The ticket on EY stock. At the airport, the flight was cancelled and MH put me on a different flight and provided vouchers for food and hotel.
This is what I expect from a high quality customer support.
A TK agent (on behalf of AV or not) would approach OP after landing and inform that there’s a problem with the ticket and they would no be able to board the TK flight as no pax is allowed to due to regulation.
The TK agent would then inform that they have already been put on the next available flight to CMB and hand vouchers for food.
I had a different situation with some similarities in the past. I was scheduled on a EY codeshare flight on MH metal. The ticket on EY stock. At the airport, the flight was cancelled and MH put me on a different flight and provided vouchers for food and hotel.
This is what I expect from a high quality customer support.
Jun 20, 2019, 12:26 pm
#36
Original Poster
Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 304
Let me not focus on who to blame but on how such a situation should have been resolved.
A TK agent (on behalf of AV or not) would approach OP after landing and inform that there’s a problem with the ticket and they would no be able to board the TK flight as no pax is allowed to due to regulation.
The TK agent would then inform that they have already been put on the next available flight to CMB and hand vouchers for food.
I had a different situation with some similarities in the past. I was scheduled on a EY codeshare flight on MH metal. The ticket on EY stock. At the airport, the flight was cancelled and MH put me on a different flight and provided vouchers for food and hotel.
This is what I expect from a high quality customer support.
A TK agent (on behalf of AV or not) would approach OP after landing and inform that there’s a problem with the ticket and they would no be able to board the TK flight as no pax is allowed to due to regulation.
The TK agent would then inform that they have already been put on the next available flight to CMB and hand vouchers for food.
I had a different situation with some similarities in the past. I was scheduled on a EY codeshare flight on MH metal. The ticket on EY stock. At the airport, the flight was cancelled and MH put me on a different flight and provided vouchers for food and hotel.
This is what I expect from a high quality customer support.
Jun 20, 2019, 3:45 pm
#37
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Oct 2000
Posts: 14,352
Two days after 9/11 I missed my KL JNB-AMS flight, because my incoming SA domestic flight (separate ticket) was delayed by severe weather.
Upon disembarkation I was met by an SA agent. Even though this was not their problem, he first escorted me to the KL office. By then the KL flight had already departed, and as we reached the office the staff were just heading out the door. When I explained that I had just missed their flight to AMS, I received a very succinct response "try again tomorrow".
The SA agent next escorted my to their own ticket desk, where another agent did his utmost to find me a seat on any of their flights to Europe. No joy, all fully booked.
By now it was mid evening, and there was only one flight to Europe left that was not yet boarding: Swiss. The SA agent took me to the Swiss ticket office, which was being besieged by panicky Americans looking for a safe counry to flee to. When my turn came, I frankly told the agent she was my last hope. She took a look at my paper KL ticket, which clearly stated NON-ENDORSABLE, said "I'll take a chance on this", and issued a new ticket JNB-ZRH-AMS at no charge.
Back in Europe the following morning, I gave KL a call to tell them that I had made it to my destination. The customer service agent had good news for me: they had rebooked me on the flight to AMS that evening at no extra charge, even though they had no obligation to do so. I had to repeat several times that I was already in AMS, courtesy of Swiss. The agent just couldn't understand how that was even possible.
Guess the bottom line is that some airlines and their representatives are willing to go the extra mile, whereas many (probably most) are not. In this instance both SA and Swiss did what they could to help me, while the airline I had paid to transport me did not.
Johan
Upon disembarkation I was met by an SA agent. Even though this was not their problem, he first escorted me to the KL office. By then the KL flight had already departed, and as we reached the office the staff were just heading out the door. When I explained that I had just missed their flight to AMS, I received a very succinct response "try again tomorrow".
The SA agent next escorted my to their own ticket desk, where another agent did his utmost to find me a seat on any of their flights to Europe. No joy, all fully booked.
By now it was mid evening, and there was only one flight to Europe left that was not yet boarding: Swiss. The SA agent took me to the Swiss ticket office, which was being besieged by panicky Americans looking for a safe counry to flee to. When my turn came, I frankly told the agent she was my last hope. She took a look at my paper KL ticket, which clearly stated NON-ENDORSABLE, said "I'll take a chance on this", and issued a new ticket JNB-ZRH-AMS at no charge.
Back in Europe the following morning, I gave KL a call to tell them that I had made it to my destination. The customer service agent had good news for me: they had rebooked me on the flight to AMS that evening at no extra charge, even though they had no obligation to do so. I had to repeat several times that I was already in AMS, courtesy of Swiss. The agent just couldn't understand how that was even possible.
Guess the bottom line is that some airlines and their representatives are willing to go the extra mile, whereas many (probably most) are not. In this instance both SA and Swiss did what they could to help me, while the airline I had paid to transport me did not.
Johan
Jun 20, 2019, 7:27 pm
#38
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: OSL/IAH/ZRH (time, not preference)
Programs: UA1K, LH GM, AA EXP->GM
Posts: 38,259
So what? TK has strong exposure to the EU and will respect a European verdict. Life Miles ... not so much.
Jun 20, 2019, 7:45 pm
#39
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: OSL/IAH/ZRH (time, not preference)
Programs: UA1K, LH GM, AA EXP->GM
Posts: 38,259
Of course it is. TK had ample opportunity to warn the OP or to assist the OP. They failed that duty, even though unlike in the other examples upthread, TK got paid to transport the OP.
Life Miles may have made a mistake. That's between them and TK.
I.e. the airlines can do no wrong, it's always the passenger's fault. Nothing to see here.
Why does FlyerTalk exist
?
Life Miles may have made a mistake. That's between them and TK.
Why does FlyerTalk exist
?
Jun 20, 2019, 9:19 pm
#40
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: SEA/ORD/ADB
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As with all standard interline agreements, TK only gets paid after the flight is flown and the coupon is lifted. They did not lift any coupons, so they did not get paid by AV for flying the OP, and they had to let an extra seat go empty instead of selling it.
Jun 21, 2019, 12:43 am
#41
Join Date: Sep 2017
Programs: TK E+, RJ S, AZ E
Posts: 1,869
Jun 21, 2019, 1:05 pm
#42
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: OTP
Programs: AF/KL platinum, Turkish gold, QR gold
Posts: 1,570
The OP's flight did not touch EU territory and TK is not an EU carrier, so EU laws simply do not apply. Nor has exposure anything to do with it. Why on earth would they respect an "European verdict" if no such verdict exists in the first place? And will never happen?
Any other similar cases and jurisprudence is also of zero influence on TK. There is no such thing as "exposure". TK as an airline - and Turkey as a country - clearly mind their own business and could not be the least bothered with what we all here have to write about it or what any foreign consumer's organisation or court has to say about it.
Not a single EU body, nor even a non-Turkish lawyer would likely touch this. Sure, one could perhaps fight it under Turkish consumer laws or in court or start a complaint with Turkish regulatory authorities, although chances of succeeding will be close to naught. I am sympathetic to the situation of the OP - but the source of the problem is Life Miles what it clearly seems. At best, TK can only be blamed for not having noticed the unlawful ticket earlier and a lack of communication if it might have been flagged in their systems earlier (although I even doubt they could be blamed for that given the unusual circumstances).
Jun 21, 2019, 1:49 pm
#43
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: OSL/IAH/ZRH (time, not preference)
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Again, if the OP lives in Europe, they can seek remedies via European courts. Like in the US, the smallest exposure is sufficient, i.e. if taxes and fees were paid in Europe or via a European credit card.
Not a single EU body, nor even a non-Turkish lawyer would likely touch this.
If you don't want to use a consumer friendly system that protects passengers, you are free to forfeit your rights. But don't tell the OP that TK is not liable here.
...I even doubt they could be blamed for that given the unusual circumstances).
So who should make the OP whole in your opinion?
Jun 21, 2019, 2:00 pm
#44
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: OSL/IAH/ZRH (time, not preference)
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Posts: 38,259
You may well be right but that is highly immaterial. When you buy a ticket on short notice and Mastercard hasn't paid TK yet, TK still owes you a ride.
Jun 22, 2019, 10:45 am
#45
Join Date: Oct 2005
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Maybe we can focus on the issue at hand and not wander of on the merry road of history?
I think PiperAtGatesofDawn has summed up the situation very clearly and correctly. This is not a problem of TK's making. Having flown on that route (IST-MLE-CMB) it is very clear pax are only allowed to leave at MLE but not board. Even if they wanted to there are no check in or gate staff on this routing. AV fraudulently sold something, it is up to them to sort it out.
I think PiperAtGatesofDawn has summed up the situation very clearly and correctly. This is not a problem of TK's making. Having flown on that route (IST-MLE-CMB) it is very clear pax are only allowed to leave at MLE but not board. Even if they wanted to there are no check in or gate staff on this routing. AV fraudulently sold something, it is up to them to sort it out.
Calling it fraud on the part of AV seems harsh. OP requested the routing, they saw that it was available from Turkish, and they issued it. Hard to totally fault them (I am not defending their apparently horrible "remedies" after the fact of course).
One remedy consistent with its obligations, had TK cared, would have been to transport the OP MLE-IST-CMB. Obviously out of the way and costly, but at least it would have gotten him from A to B on their metal as they allowed to be ticketed.