El-Al NYC to TLV in Coach
Dec 20, 2002, 6:47 pm
#1
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Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: USA
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Posts: 779
El-Al NYC to TLV in Coach
This trip report has two goals. First and foremost, it is my first trip report or substantial contribution of any kind to the FlyerTalk community and I hope that you all enjoy it. Second, it is an attempt to provide those flying on El-Al with an idea of what to expect as, prior to my flight, I had no expectations. I have been reading trip reports for quite some time both here and on airliners.net and hope to learn from them to make this report enjoyable for you all, however, in doing so I fear it may become long winded. I appologize. On a side note, if anyone wishes to post this trip report on airliners.net, please feel free to do so and give me credit as “gba” at FlyerTalk. Now, on with the show…
July 9, 2002
JFK-TLV
El Al #008
Equipment: 777-200 (4X-ECB)
Scheduled (Actual) Departure Time: 23:50 (23:50)
Scheduled (Actual) Arrival Time: 17:15+1 day (17:07+1)
Total Flight Time: 10:17
I arrived at the airport at about 9:00pm, leaving the recommended three hours for international flights. JFK’s terminal 4 is fabulous, especially when compared to the other terminals that I have been in at that airport (UA, DL, AA). T-4, formarly the IAB, is the only one doesn’t feel cramped or outdated. The wonderful, high class ceilings had a mythic feel to them.
The environment around the El-Al check-in was very tense because of the LAX shooting five days earlier, yet everything proceeded smoothly. At one point, however, a passer-by knocked over one of the line barriers that surrounded the check-in area and a half dozen or so security guards were after him immediately.
Security was appropriately thorough. I was asked to show my ticket and passport before even getting in line to check-in and then again when I reached one of three interview podiums. Rather than just ask the three, now eliminated, security questions, El-Al conducts complete interviews with its passengers and looks for any unusual responses. Fortunately, my interview was brief. I then proceeded to the bag x-ray/bomb-detection machine where they placed fluorescent orange stickers, whose purpose I do not know, on my checked and then x-rayed them. Finally, I approached the ticket counter, checked my bags, and was given seat 53A. In case you are counting, I was asked to show my ticket four times, before even passing thorough what we think of as “security” to go to the gate.
I killed time with friends around the terminal until about 11:00 at which point boarding had well begun for my flight. I went through security, which seemed much like security on any US domestic flight (but probably wasn’t), althoug it was perhaps a little heavier staffed, and got the now common explosives check on my bags and a hand-search by the screeners. From there I went on to the gate and descended a long jet way to the awaiting 777: 4X-ECB entitled Negev by El-Al.
The aircraft was virtually empty in Coach (I did not see the Platinum or First Class cabins). The seating arrangement was 3-3-3 and I had the window seat on the left side of the aircraft and the middle seat next to me, like virtually every middle seat, was vacant. Pillows, blankets, headsets and the magazine Atmosphere. We pushed back on time and had a charming cartoon safety demo play on our PTV. It provided a nice change from the expected bland video with cookie-cutter pilots, FA’s, etc.
There was a bit of a taxi delay (perhaps for security reasons, if they want to vary take-off times or maybe just because of traffic, I don’t know) and we did not take off until 12:23am. Runway 31L was used and the 777 roared into the night sky and made a turn (for noise abatement I think) immediately after lift-off.
Once a safe altitude was reached the religious men on board treaded to the back of the plane for the evening prayers and the flight-attendants came around with drinks and a cracker-snack. This would be the only full-drink service for the flight but, one could get up and go get a mini (150ml was all they had)-beverage at anytime.
The FA’s then delivered the special meals before the general dinner service. This was a choice of spaghetti and meatballs or Teriyaki Chicken. I had the Chicken and the entrée was served with rice. Both meal options came with tuna salad, a few roasted vegetables, a brownie and a freshly warmed challa (braided bread) roll. The food was not great, but the FA’s were surprisingly friendly and even came around and offered additional rolls to anyone who wanted. Later in the flight they offered coffee, tea, and bottled water intermittantly.
As mentioned, there were PTV’s and IFE consisted of several movies, which were not on demand and cycled every two and a half hours or so. The remote controls were configured to be used as a telephone and for playing video games although games (I do not know about the phone service) were not available. Personally, I watched the Airshow for the entire flight.
After dinner I dozed off and awoke about three and a half hours from TLV. We had initially cruised at FL350 with a 600 mph ground speed. We hit Europe just south of the middle of France at 1:30pm Israeli time and climbed to FL39. We then flew straight down Italy passing over Florence and Pescara.
Lights came up when we were exactly two and a half hours from TLV and were followed immediately by hot towel service (my first ever). This was followed by breakfast and I had eggs and potatoes and a warmed bagel served with lox, yogurt, and a fig newton. Again, the food was mediocre.
We flew over Milos, Greece and then began our descent from FL390 about 27 minutes before landing TLV, approximately 165 miles. In air-spoilers were used to slow us as we approached from the west over the spectacular, sunny Tel Aviv beaches to a straight in landing. We deplaned, bussed (there are no gates at TLV) to the terminal and I easily cleared customs and immigration.
August 14, 2002
TLV-JFK
El Al #001
Equipment: 747-400 (4X-ELD)
Scheduled (Actual) Departure Time: 1:00a (1:00)
Scheduled (Actual) Arrival Time: 5:30a (5:19)
Total Flight Time: 11:22:25
I arrived at the airport in Tel Aviv about 9:30pm and it is quite crowded this time of night because most of the long-haul flights to North America leave around the same time. Security in Tel-Aviv follows the same general procedures as El-Al security does in the United States, however, in my opinion, they do more profiling and thus, I had little problem (I am very white). In fact, my checked baggage was not x-rayed and I was not “wanded” (like at JFK) nor were my belongings checked for explosives. Check-in again proceeded smoothly and my bags were checked thorough onto my connecting AA flight from JFK.
From the check-in area, you go up an escalator to passport control and, after clearing security, are in a large duty free shopping mall. I spent the last of my shekels and hung around until boarding was called for my flight. Since there are no gates, it is very difficult to see any aircraft from the terminal, especially at night, and I was unable to do the usual plane-spotting that I do when waiting for my flight. The upside of this is that I got to board the aircraft from steps and this gave me a better idea of how mammoth the 747 really is.
On the inside, our 747-400 had a 3-4-3 seating arrangement in coach and a 2-2 layout in Platinum on the upper deck (I did not see the other Platinum or First Class cabins). Unlike my outbound flight, this plane was completely full and I had a middle aisle (the aisle of the “4”) seat, instead of my usual window. Oh well, the flight would be completely at night.
Push back was on time and the same safety video was shown. We took off to the west at 2:22am with a speed of about 200 mph at lift-off. Our initial cruising altitude was FL300 and a ground speed of about 550 mph. Upon flying over Milos (South of Athens) about 1.5 hrs into the flight we climbed to FL320. Of course, I got this information from the Airshow. Our 747 had the same IFE as the 777 that brought me to Israel (except for the controllers which had not been uselessly configured for video games).
Drinks and crackers (again only one full-drink service, although this time I knew to take advantage of the availability of beverages at the galleys) were served followed by dinner which was a choice of cold sandwiches. I had a pastrami sandwich (it was dry) which was served with vegetables and chocolate cake. The 1000 Island dressing served with the vegetables saved the day as I could put it on my sandwich to moisten it a bit.
I dozed off to sleep and we flew over Milan, North of Paris, and very near, if not directly over London and Ireland. Our ground speed varied between 500 and 550 mph. I assume this was due to varying winds. We climbed to FL360 nearing the western exit of the North Atlantic area at 2:45 Eastern Time and when we were 90 minutes from JFK descended to FL350, probably to accommodate US airspace requirements.
Lights came on just over 3 hrs from JFK and this was followed by hot towel service. Breakfast was a choice of crepes or eggs. I again had the eggs and they came with potatoes, a warmed bagel, assorted cheeses, fruit, and way-too-plain yogurt. El Al food is nothing extraordinary, but it is Kosher for those who desire that (not me).
We crossed over Boston 35 minutes from JFK and then began our descent 10 minutes later (about 100 miles from the air port). We flew three quarters of a circle around the airport and then landed from the southwest at 5:19am.
I hope those of you who are still reading at this point enjoyed my report and I welcome any comments or questions that you may have.
Happy Travels,
gba
Edited for grammer.
July 9, 2002
JFK-TLV
El Al #008
Equipment: 777-200 (4X-ECB)
Scheduled (Actual) Departure Time: 23:50 (23:50)
Scheduled (Actual) Arrival Time: 17:15+1 day (17:07+1)
Total Flight Time: 10:17
I arrived at the airport at about 9:00pm, leaving the recommended three hours for international flights. JFK’s terminal 4 is fabulous, especially when compared to the other terminals that I have been in at that airport (UA, DL, AA). T-4, formarly the IAB, is the only one doesn’t feel cramped or outdated. The wonderful, high class ceilings had a mythic feel to them.
The environment around the El-Al check-in was very tense because of the LAX shooting five days earlier, yet everything proceeded smoothly. At one point, however, a passer-by knocked over one of the line barriers that surrounded the check-in area and a half dozen or so security guards were after him immediately.
Security was appropriately thorough. I was asked to show my ticket and passport before even getting in line to check-in and then again when I reached one of three interview podiums. Rather than just ask the three, now eliminated, security questions, El-Al conducts complete interviews with its passengers and looks for any unusual responses. Fortunately, my interview was brief. I then proceeded to the bag x-ray/bomb-detection machine where they placed fluorescent orange stickers, whose purpose I do not know, on my checked and then x-rayed them. Finally, I approached the ticket counter, checked my bags, and was given seat 53A. In case you are counting, I was asked to show my ticket four times, before even passing thorough what we think of as “security” to go to the gate.
I killed time with friends around the terminal until about 11:00 at which point boarding had well begun for my flight. I went through security, which seemed much like security on any US domestic flight (but probably wasn’t), althoug it was perhaps a little heavier staffed, and got the now common explosives check on my bags and a hand-search by the screeners. From there I went on to the gate and descended a long jet way to the awaiting 777: 4X-ECB entitled Negev by El-Al.
The aircraft was virtually empty in Coach (I did not see the Platinum or First Class cabins). The seating arrangement was 3-3-3 and I had the window seat on the left side of the aircraft and the middle seat next to me, like virtually every middle seat, was vacant. Pillows, blankets, headsets and the magazine Atmosphere. We pushed back on time and had a charming cartoon safety demo play on our PTV. It provided a nice change from the expected bland video with cookie-cutter pilots, FA’s, etc.
There was a bit of a taxi delay (perhaps for security reasons, if they want to vary take-off times or maybe just because of traffic, I don’t know) and we did not take off until 12:23am. Runway 31L was used and the 777 roared into the night sky and made a turn (for noise abatement I think) immediately after lift-off.
Once a safe altitude was reached the religious men on board treaded to the back of the plane for the evening prayers and the flight-attendants came around with drinks and a cracker-snack. This would be the only full-drink service for the flight but, one could get up and go get a mini (150ml was all they had)-beverage at anytime.
The FA’s then delivered the special meals before the general dinner service. This was a choice of spaghetti and meatballs or Teriyaki Chicken. I had the Chicken and the entrée was served with rice. Both meal options came with tuna salad, a few roasted vegetables, a brownie and a freshly warmed challa (braided bread) roll. The food was not great, but the FA’s were surprisingly friendly and even came around and offered additional rolls to anyone who wanted. Later in the flight they offered coffee, tea, and bottled water intermittantly.
As mentioned, there were PTV’s and IFE consisted of several movies, which were not on demand and cycled every two and a half hours or so. The remote controls were configured to be used as a telephone and for playing video games although games (I do not know about the phone service) were not available. Personally, I watched the Airshow for the entire flight.
After dinner I dozed off and awoke about three and a half hours from TLV. We had initially cruised at FL350 with a 600 mph ground speed. We hit Europe just south of the middle of France at 1:30pm Israeli time and climbed to FL39. We then flew straight down Italy passing over Florence and Pescara.
Lights came up when we were exactly two and a half hours from TLV and were followed immediately by hot towel service (my first ever). This was followed by breakfast and I had eggs and potatoes and a warmed bagel served with lox, yogurt, and a fig newton. Again, the food was mediocre.
We flew over Milos, Greece and then began our descent from FL390 about 27 minutes before landing TLV, approximately 165 miles. In air-spoilers were used to slow us as we approached from the west over the spectacular, sunny Tel Aviv beaches to a straight in landing. We deplaned, bussed (there are no gates at TLV) to the terminal and I easily cleared customs and immigration.
August 14, 2002
TLV-JFK
El Al #001
Equipment: 747-400 (4X-ELD)
Scheduled (Actual) Departure Time: 1:00a (1:00)
Scheduled (Actual) Arrival Time: 5:30a (5:19)
Total Flight Time: 11:22:25
I arrived at the airport in Tel Aviv about 9:30pm and it is quite crowded this time of night because most of the long-haul flights to North America leave around the same time. Security in Tel-Aviv follows the same general procedures as El-Al security does in the United States, however, in my opinion, they do more profiling and thus, I had little problem (I am very white). In fact, my checked baggage was not x-rayed and I was not “wanded” (like at JFK) nor were my belongings checked for explosives. Check-in again proceeded smoothly and my bags were checked thorough onto my connecting AA flight from JFK.
From the check-in area, you go up an escalator to passport control and, after clearing security, are in a large duty free shopping mall. I spent the last of my shekels and hung around until boarding was called for my flight. Since there are no gates, it is very difficult to see any aircraft from the terminal, especially at night, and I was unable to do the usual plane-spotting that I do when waiting for my flight. The upside of this is that I got to board the aircraft from steps and this gave me a better idea of how mammoth the 747 really is.
On the inside, our 747-400 had a 3-4-3 seating arrangement in coach and a 2-2 layout in Platinum on the upper deck (I did not see the other Platinum or First Class cabins). Unlike my outbound flight, this plane was completely full and I had a middle aisle (the aisle of the “4”) seat, instead of my usual window. Oh well, the flight would be completely at night.
Push back was on time and the same safety video was shown. We took off to the west at 2:22am with a speed of about 200 mph at lift-off. Our initial cruising altitude was FL300 and a ground speed of about 550 mph. Upon flying over Milos (South of Athens) about 1.5 hrs into the flight we climbed to FL320. Of course, I got this information from the Airshow. Our 747 had the same IFE as the 777 that brought me to Israel (except for the controllers which had not been uselessly configured for video games).
Drinks and crackers (again only one full-drink service, although this time I knew to take advantage of the availability of beverages at the galleys) were served followed by dinner which was a choice of cold sandwiches. I had a pastrami sandwich (it was dry) which was served with vegetables and chocolate cake. The 1000 Island dressing served with the vegetables saved the day as I could put it on my sandwich to moisten it a bit.
I dozed off to sleep and we flew over Milan, North of Paris, and very near, if not directly over London and Ireland. Our ground speed varied between 500 and 550 mph. I assume this was due to varying winds. We climbed to FL360 nearing the western exit of the North Atlantic area at 2:45 Eastern Time and when we were 90 minutes from JFK descended to FL350, probably to accommodate US airspace requirements.
Lights came on just over 3 hrs from JFK and this was followed by hot towel service. Breakfast was a choice of crepes or eggs. I again had the eggs and they came with potatoes, a warmed bagel, assorted cheeses, fruit, and way-too-plain yogurt. El Al food is nothing extraordinary, but it is Kosher for those who desire that (not me).
We crossed over Boston 35 minutes from JFK and then began our descent 10 minutes later (about 100 miles from the air port). We flew three quarters of a circle around the airport and then landed from the southwest at 5:19am.
I hope those of you who are still reading at this point enjoyed my report and I welcome any comments or questions that you may have.
Happy Travels,
gba
Edited for grammer.
Last edited by gba; Apr 18, 2004 at 8:41 pm
Dec 20, 2002, 8:51 pm
#5
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: WAS, FLL
Programs: AA, B6, CO, DL, FL, UA, US Gold (only took 10k miles), WN, Amtrak
Posts: 1,299
AHHHHHH EL AL security; whenever I fly LY I always wonder why I have to bother to clear regular American airport security, what will they find that EL AL missed??
Dec 21, 2002, 10:10 am
#7
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Arizona, USA
Posts: 2,403
Thanks for the trip report!
I'm glad to hear that El Al's cabin crew were friendly. I heard stories of the crew smoking in the aisles and shouting "slicha" while shoving beverage trolleys into passengers' feet.
It sounds like El Al security isn't too oppressive. Perhaps it's like flying a US carrier from overseas.
I'll try to get to Israel one of these days myself... if the political situation doesn't escalate too much.
Mats.
I'm glad to hear that El Al's cabin crew were friendly. I heard stories of the crew smoking in the aisles and shouting "slicha" while shoving beverage trolleys into passengers' feet.
It sounds like El Al security isn't too oppressive. Perhaps it's like flying a US carrier from overseas.
I'll try to get to Israel one of these days myself... if the political situation doesn't escalate too much.
Mats.
Dec 21, 2002, 11:01 am
#8
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: East Ester, Alaska
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Posts: 12,145
Far from being "long winded", this was an interesting and detailed Trip Report.
Welcome to Flyertalk! I look forward to your next report!
Welcome to Flyertalk! I look forward to your next report!
Dec 21, 2002, 1:47 pm
#9
Original Poster
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: USA
Programs: Alaska MVP, Marriott Lifetime Titanium (United Silver), Hilton Gold
Posts: 779
Thanks y'all, I really appreciate your comments, especially Seat 2A, you are, in my opinion, the writer of the greatest trip reports.
No security did not seem overly oppressive, although I must admit I was a bit timid about looking around the aircraft (I wanted to see how Platinum and First Class were arranged)
Yes, I too have heard horror stories about the El Al cabin crew and had quite low expectations. This may be why I gave them such high regards. Also, I am sure like any airline they have their good crews and there less professional ones. The fact that one of the flights that I was on was mostly empty surely eased their nerves a bit.
No security did not seem overly oppressive, although I must admit I was a bit timid about looking around the aircraft (I wanted to see how Platinum and First Class were arranged)
Yes, I too have heard horror stories about the El Al cabin crew and had quite low expectations. This may be why I gave them such high regards. Also, I am sure like any airline they have their good crews and there less professional ones. The fact that one of the flights that I was on was mostly empty surely eased their nerves a bit.
Dec 21, 2002, 3:12 pm
#10
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Ft Worth, Texas
Programs: AA/UA/BA
Posts: 2,850
Nice report gba, welcome to FlyerTalk.
Strange that the dinner on the return flight was only sandwiches. Rather odd for an 11 hour flight, don't you think? Perhaps it was because of the late (or early) departure time.
It must be weird flying westbound across the pond at night too. I only ever do it during daylight from the UK, or in the evening, arriving the same evening in JFK.
Strange that the dinner on the return flight was only sandwiches. Rather odd for an 11 hour flight, don't you think? Perhaps it was because of the late (or early) departure time.
It must be weird flying westbound across the pond at night too. I only ever do it during daylight from the UK, or in the evening, arriving the same evening in JFK.
Dec 21, 2002, 4:09 pm
#11
Original Poster
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: USA
Programs: Alaska MVP, Marriott Lifetime Titanium (United Silver), Hilton Gold
Posts: 779
Yes, 777brit I think the sandwich service was the result of the late departure time. This is only odd because the outbound flight departed at a similarly late time, yet had a full meal service. Personally, I would prefer to eat as soon as possible and then get to sleep, quantity is not important.
True, most flights accross the pond west-bound are not red-eyes, but I think its nice to be able to sleep as much as possible on a flight that long.
True, most flights accross the pond west-bound are not red-eyes, but I think its nice to be able to sleep as much as possible on a flight that long.
Dec 21, 2002, 5:35 pm
#12
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: WAS, FLL
Programs: AA, B6, CO, DL, FL, UA, US Gold (only took 10k miles), WN, Amtrak
Posts: 1,299
<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by 777Brit:
Nice report gba, welcome to FlyerTalk.
Strange that the dinner on the return flight was only sandwiches. Rather odd for an 11 hour flight, don't you think? Perhaps it was because of the late (or early) departure time.
It must be weird flying westbound across the pond at night too. I only ever do it during daylight from the UK, or in the evening, arriving the same evening in JFK. </font>
Nice report gba, welcome to FlyerTalk.
Strange that the dinner on the return flight was only sandwiches. Rather odd for an 11 hour flight, don't you think? Perhaps it was because of the late (or early) departure time.
It must be weird flying westbound across the pond at night too. I only ever do it during daylight from the UK, or in the evening, arriving the same evening in JFK. </font>
Dec 21, 2002, 9:28 pm
#13
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 3,181
In the past 40 years that I have flown EL AL, I never had a bad experience with the crew. They were always polite and helpful.
However only once when I was a kid, my mother had a run in with a hostess who yelled at her to fasten her seat belt for landing. My mother told her to get herself some "manners" and stop yelling.
However only once when I was a kid, my mother had a run in with a hostess who yelled at her to fasten her seat belt for landing. My mother told her to get herself some "manners" and stop yelling.
Dec 21, 2002, 9:33 pm
#14
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 3,181
In regards to the sandwiches being served on flights that leave at midnight it makes sense to me. We used to fly EL AL from New York to London (many years ago)and their flights used to leave at midnight. I was always surprised that they used to serve a full hot meal at 1 a.m which really makes no sense to me. KLM also has replaced hot meals with a cold snack on its 11pm flight from New York to Amsterdam.
Dec 22, 2002, 12:29 pm
#15
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Join Date: Oct 2000
Posts: 14,352
<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by Bretteee:
KLM also has replaced hot meals with a cold snack on its 11pm flight from New York to Amsterdam. </font>
KLM also has replaced hot meals with a cold snack on its 11pm flight from New York to Amsterdam. </font>
johan