hfly

BUT Jouy, they have been more vague in the last few rises. They used to say something like, "this fee will be removed when oil has dropped below xx for 30 days". Now they sort of say, "we'll lower them at some point in the future when prices are lower" As AF has ben pretty good at raising their fees at approximately TWICE the increase in oil prices, in addition with plain old fare increases, they have been one of the airlines that has gained the most from these increases.

JOUY31

Unless I am mistaken, their fuel surcharges are not the highest on the market. They are higher than LH's, but lower than BA's (EUR 135 for ultra long-haul on AF in all cabins, GBP 109 on BA in coach and a whopping GBP 133 in First) or KL's (EUR 147 for ultra long-haul).

I also wish that AF fuel surcharges could go down more quickly, but the environment is harsher today than when the first AF fuel surcharges were introduced.

B747-437B

Due to the vagaries of Jet A-1 pricing, airlines are actually paying MORE for spot fuel right now than ever before. This will change from either August 15 or September 1 (depending on the market) and a drop of around 12-15%. Airlines on monthly volume contracts (virtually everyone for some portion of their consumption) will only see the savings kick in at that time.

skylady

I think you are now seeing what the employees have been seeing for a few years. The company says we will take from you now, but never quite finishes the sentence. We all assume they meant to say, you will be greatly rewarded for your efforts, but are really saying, WE will be greatly rewarded for your efforts.

mooper

I love the conspiracy theories that have come with this cost spike. No company can operate severely in the red indefinitely. Airlines saw the cost of their primary input double in just months. Because of the nature of the business, capacity cannot be reduced enough to allow for the quick and steep fare increases needed to maintain profits. Therefore, these surcharges, cutbacks, and fees have been the *only* feasible way for the industry to react in the near-term, in an attempt to preserve their hides. I always ask those who disagree with the move to be kind enough to share their financial advice with the airlines, whom would gladly accept a magical solution if there was one.

Watch this thread into the future and if oil prices drop below $100 for three consecutive months or more (I'm not saying it will happen, but there is a substantial chance it will), I will bet you that most if not all of the fuel surcharges will be retracted. You cannot expect them to be removed because of a three-week drop to still-elevated (albeit much better) levels, any more than you would expect them to be doubled if prices go up 25% for three weeks.

mlbcard

What I don't understand is why some airlines (i.e. UA with it's cutting of free meals on some int'l flights) are still cutting services and adding fees, even though oil prices are lower than it was a few months ago. Sure, they don't want to remove the fees they just introduced too soon, but its a little rediculous that they keep on cutting services or adding fees while their main reason for the fees is reversing itself.

TheCrackedJack

I agree. I think it's amusing sometimes to listen to all the so called experts on here think that in a paragraph or two they have all the answers that entire airlines are missing. Talk about pompous.

There's nothing wrong with discussion, but it just get's out of hand sometimes.

mooper

The need for the cost increases came when oil passed $100 or $110/barrel, it just took a while to implement them - so long that oil was nearing $150 by the time they did. Now at $115, oil is still too expensive to bring fuel prices back to where airlines can be profitable with the same prices (including fees/surcharges) they had when oil was at $70 not too many months ago.

Steve M

The reason is that most carriers are still losing an enormous amount of money. Many people seem to be confusing the oil companies (which are making money hand over fist right now) with the airlines (most of which are losing, if not hemorrhaging, money). When we get to the point where the airlines are making any profit (let alone a fair profit), then we can talk about whether it's reasonable to rescind fare and fee increases.

mooper

Kinda funny how many of these same people are also proponents of the absurd "windfall profits" taxes on the oil companies.

mlbcard

I don't see how my comment confuses oil companies with airlines. I'm not saying they should rescind the fare and fee increases... but they should stop adding more cuts until they figure out where the price of oil will go (though mooper's first comment makes sense... I suppose we should wait until oil goes below $100).

Carolinian

Instead of a fuel surcharge, which is simply dishonest as fuel is an inseperable part of the base product, they ought to be honest enough to simply raise the price of the product to cover its costs, including fuel.

The EU is apparently reining in this dishonest practice, and it is time that government authorities in the US did as well.

MarqFlyer

+1

I don't have a problem with the total amount airlines are currently charging to get me from point A to point B. The problem I have is that they don't just build it into the price of the ticket so that consumers actually know the cost. As Carolinian says, fuel prices are just another of the airlines' expenses, like employee costs and maintenance. If we agree that the fuel surcharge concept is appropriate, what's to keep some airline from later implementing a "labor surcharge" the next time a union gets a better deal for pilots? Or a "maintenance surcharge" next time they upgrade the cabins?

Just tell me the *#@%!*% fare!

HeathrowGuy

The US was the leader in requiring that airlines treat fuel surcharges as the "fare" they really are - the Europeans are just now catching up on that front.

mooper

Would you be kind enough to explain what would happen if the airlines raised their price with the current capacity levels? If you know of a way to do this without having empty seats (aside from progressive layoffs and resulting capacity cuts, which have been underway for some time at the quickest reasonable pace), you should call the airlines immediately and let them know.

Also, I love your idea of having government interference of private business... I mean, how dare these guys try to pass along skyrocketing costs to the consumer! Plus, we all know that the more the government steps in and regulates, the more smoothly and efficient things operate