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What was it like before airline de-regulation?

What was it like before airline de-regulation?

Old Apr 11, 2008, 8:21 pm
  #16  
 
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Originally Posted by tjl
They allowed smoking in airplanes then (well, also post-deregulation until the late 1980s or so). Blech.
Deregulation was just a couple years before my time but I still remember smoking on planes. I don't remember thinking anything of it at the time, but the thought of that is amazing to me now. Who thought it would be a good idea to smoke in a tiny enclosed tube?!
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Old Apr 11, 2008, 8:40 pm
  #17  
 
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go back to re-regulation and we can kiss the frequent flyer programs goodbye...higher fares will be set by a new c.a.b. on every city pair. good bye to the low cost/fare carriers as every airline will be on the same level and service will be the new benchmark.....full dinners could/should be expected between chicago and st louis as it was back in the day
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Old Apr 12, 2008, 7:14 am
  #18  
 
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China

The airlines of China are regulated now. Restrictions on purchases of new planes (how many allowed, from whom). Restrictions on pilots changing an airline they work for.

China has low-cost carries nevertheless. And other things are being tried. Like Juneyao, who offers business travel around Shanghai.

So... what would the content of airline reregulation be? And what should it be?
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Old Apr 12, 2008, 11:03 am
  #19  
 
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It was delightful and I loved it! And none of this way overdone "security" crap either. The airlines NEVER should have been deregulated in the first place.
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Old Apr 12, 2008, 2:25 pm
  #20  
 
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Wirelessly posted (Blackberry8700c: Opera/9.50 (J2ME/MIDP; Opera Mini/4.1.10781/298; U; en))

This is like putting out a call for curmudgeonly old folks reminiscing about the good old days
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Old Apr 12, 2008, 4:50 pm
  #21  
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Originally Posted by hotturnip
. . . I remember these days. This is why I didn't get to fly at all until I was 16. It was TOO DAMNED EXPENSIVE! This is why I roll my eyes when people talk about these years as if they were a golden age. Sure--if you were wealthy.
How is that different from today?? Flying is still very much a preserve of the wealthy. Sure, more people can afford it now than in the past...But that doesn't mean there aren't billions of people worldwide who can only dream of being able to afford a plane ticket. It's all a question of perspective.

My experience of deregulation commenced when I was about 13...and I was seriously relieved at being able to choose an airline other than OA to fly to my grandparents in Athens!
It was fun to fly the F50 of Branson's SEEA on handwritten tickets (in 1992!) and get a croissant and some coke for the short domestic hop (OA only serving a choice of water or vile grapefruit juice).
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Old Apr 12, 2008, 7:59 pm
  #22  
 
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Well, I would certainly not be an old curmugeon talking about how good it was, but deregulation happened in 1978 which was 33 years after my first commercial flying experience and we've had 30 years since then . . .

Seriously, the problem from the beginning, going back to the Civil Aeronautics ACT of 1938, was how to provide reliable air service in a manner that was economically feasible for the airlines to provide while meeting the "public convenience and necessity" of supplying reliable air service throughout the nation. The system was based on a process of granting air routes and setting fares according to the requests of the carriers, the requests and interests of the communities to be served, and within the judgement of the Civil Aeronautics Board that heard and adjudicated requests in route cases that could run on for years. Typically the result was service granted to two or three carriers in each point-to-point or route line market with fares set, as with utility regulation, to guarantee that carriers would not undercut each other to the point of bankruptcy while still providing reasonable fares to the public. One result is that competetive advantage could only be gained in the areas of service, ameneties, and image. Another result is that union structures and lack of cost competition tended to result in high pay scales and desireable working conditions for professional employees such as pilots, mechanics, and FA's (then stewardesses), not to ignore other functions in the company.

I don't think some of the short skirt, glamour-girl, "resort" atmosphere aspects of flying in the 60's were so much an artifact of regulation as of the times. Certainly airline travel in the 40's and 50's did not have that atmosphere. It is also true that there is a huge difference today in terms of population growth, speed of communications, globalization of business, and the cost effectiveness of the modern jet liner which hugely affect the travel atmosphere today, deregulation aside.

OK, the curmudgeon part is that, yes fares were high then, and yes travel today can be hell, or not, lots of times. Personally I think the opportunity we have to move around the world with ease, and at a low price is fantastic. Maybe the system just needs a little adjusting for comfort, if some way can be found to do so.
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Old Apr 12, 2008, 10:14 pm
  #23  
 
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Originally Posted by graraps
How is that different from today?? Flying is still very much a preserve of the wealthy. Sure, more people can afford it now than in the past...But that doesn't mean there aren't billions of people worldwide who can only dream of being able to afford a plane ticket. It's all a question of perspective...
In absolute terms, yes there are billions of people that haven't flown, just as (probably most of the same billions) don't have a cell phone, or a personal computer. However, in relative terms, I don't know how you can deny that so many more people have flown. Common sense just says that. I wouldn't be surprised if total air passengers divided by country or world population doesn't show this percentage increase.

Jeff
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Old Apr 13, 2008, 1:18 pm
  #24  
 
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Originally Posted by ilgoldstein
Pretty accurate, I'd say, and I'd agree with all the points the site makes about "pre-de-reg" flying."
Yep, you never really "shopped" for fares as they were all similar, yep, it was more of an "event" that people dressed little or a lot nicer for, yep, they could shamelessly tout the attractiveness of their FA's, etc. etc. etc.

I'd parse it out with the "pre-9/11" days, when you knew that as you got off that plane, at the end of that jetbridge would be the big smile of a friend/spouse/SO waiting for you.

As for all the posts about the FA's, I'd suggest Google Images search:
Pacific Southwest Airlines Flight Attendants
PSA Stewardesses

etc.
...and you'll no longer wonder why their planes weren't the only things with smiles on

'
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Old Apr 13, 2008, 1:23 pm
  #25  
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Originally Posted by jwhite4
In absolute terms, yes there are billions of people that haven't flown, just as (probably most of the same billions) don't have a cell phone, or a personal computer. However, in relative terms, I don't know how you can deny that so many more people have flown. Common sense just says that. I wouldn't be surprised if total air passengers divided by country or world population doesn't show this percentage increase.

Jeff

Got that the wrong way round.
In absolute terms, more people are flying.
Relative to global population, those who fly still represent a tiny proportion.
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Old Apr 13, 2008, 1:23 pm
  #26  
 
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Originally Posted by BobbySteel
Wirelessly posted (Blackberry8700c: Opera/9.50 (J2ME/MIDP; Opera Mini/4.1.10781/298; U; en))

This is like putting out a call for curmudgeonly old folks reminiscing about the good old days
Ummmm........you mean like when you bought a ticket on an airline, there was no question whether or not that airline would still be in business when time came to use that ticket?
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Old Apr 13, 2008, 1:31 pm
  #27  
 
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Originally Posted by tjl
They allowed smoking in airplanes then (well, also post-deregulation until the late 1980s or so). Blech.
Smoking was allowed much later than that - I can remember having a smoking seat on an LHR-BOS flight in 1995, but that must have been right at the end, because by the time I started flying regularly in 1997 it was all non-smk.
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Old Apr 13, 2008, 1:52 pm
  #28  
 
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Originally Posted by skye1
Pretty accurate, I'd say, and I'd agree with all the points the site makes about "pre-de-reg" flying."
Yep, you never really "shopped" for fares as they were all similar, yep, it was more of an "event" that people dressed little or a lot nicer for, yep, they could shamelessly tout the attractiveness of their FA's, etc. etc. etc.
Scroll about half way down and there's a photo of the first male stewards on PSA. Anyone know why all were Asian or just coincidence?

http://www.psa-history.org/flying/stew.html
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Old Apr 13, 2008, 1:52 pm
  #29  
 
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In the days of deregulation - all tickets were paper and they had cash value. There were two tickets prices - First Class and Coach. All tickets were refundable. The holder of the ticket had the cash value.

You could walk from the airline you were booked on and go to a competing airline and hand them your paper ticket and get a new boarding pass on that airline. So if your Eastern flight was going to be delayed - you just said OK - and walk over to DL and hand them your paper ticket and off you went.

The differences between the airlines were service and food offerings. The airlines had 5 star dining and other gimmicks.
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Old Apr 13, 2008, 2:08 pm
  #30  
 
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Originally Posted by Unimatrix One
Well, for starters, airlines weren't "run by the government."
They were in 97% of the world,and the US although not run by the Government they were strictly controlled..and you could not have foreign ownership[Seems some things have not changed in the USA]..Now have we checked the wiring on all those American made aircraft.

There were no Free drinks on International Coach..oops still not on US Carriers..They also gave out free cigarettes..maybe as an alternative to the $500 Million The US Government now gives tobacco farmers..that is of course before they sue the cigarette companies for using the Tobacco the've just subsidised..but hey that's Porklatics.. Oh and TWA and PanAm, had geriatric FA's on most International flights. All in All things have not changed much.

Last edited by UncleDude; Apr 13, 2008 at 2:16 pm
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