Heated Runways?
Dec 26, 2006, 7:58 pm
#16
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Right here
Posts: 2,940
The "fall" (i.e., water is kept moving 'downhill') in current systems keeps water moving and inhibits freezing; in addition, most current systems likely have a burial depth great enough that they won't freeze even at cold surface temperatures. It's a slightly different material than storm drainage, but do you think the entire waste sewer system in cities like Buffalo or Duluth is heated? Somehow people can still flush their toilets and have their tubs drain during the winter in these places (i.e. they don't freeze).
Dec 26, 2006, 8:37 pm
#17
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Front Range Colorado
Programs: UA 1MM and constantly changing status in a bunch of Hotel programs
Posts: 323
The biggest is the cost benefit ratio. Airports rarely get so over loaded that they shut down. This was the first time for DEN after being open for how many years how 10?
Drainage is not that much of a problem as on average a foot of snow contains an 1 inch of water. But then again there is alot of concrete.
Drainage is not that much of a problem as on average a foot of snow contains an 1 inch of water. But then again there is alot of concrete.
Actually, this was the third shutdown. I was not here for the first one, but I thought I heard it was more a planning misjudgement (the first real test since the airport opened?). But the 2nd shutdown was a storm even bigger than this one, 3-1/2 years ago.
Dec 26, 2006, 9:04 pm
#18
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Front Range Colorado
Programs: UA 1MM and constantly changing status in a bunch of Hotel programs
Posts: 323
Well, one argument is if it is necessary to create a truly "all-weather" airport? I'm not a pilot or aeronautical engineer, so maybe I am underestimating airplane technology. But is there such a thing as all-weather airplanes (at least for public commercial use)?
I mean, is there any point in keeping an airport open if the planes shouldn't be taking off anyway?
I mean, is there any point in keeping an airport open if the planes shouldn't be taking off anyway?
Dec 26, 2006, 9:36 pm
#19
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: 99654
Programs: Many
Posts: 6,450
Heating every duct close to the surface is not an easy task either.
Not to mention the additional construction cost.
Dec 26, 2006, 9:40 pm
#20
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: 99654
Programs: Many
Posts: 6,450
keep the drains open at the surface. To ensure that for such a large area,
you need to make sure the runways and the surrounding areas are also kept
warm. I dont see that to be an easy or cheap task.
Also the construction costs would be significantly high.. interest from the
money saved by not doing it.. might even pay for the cleaning costs for
years [my guess]
Dec 26, 2006, 10:04 pm
#21
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Right here
Posts: 2,940
That's the very plan being discussed--heating the runways and surrounding areas warm enough to melt snow! I'm not advocating the plan, I never said it would be cheap or easy. I'm just pointing out that if the runways and surrounding areas are indeed kept warm enough to melt snow, there will not be an issue of finding a place for the water to go.
Dec 27, 2006, 4:48 am
#22
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 41
That's the very plan being discussed--heating the runways and surrounding areas warm enough to melt snow! I'm not advocating the plan, I never said it would be cheap or easy. I'm just pointing out that if the runways and surrounding areas are indeed kept warm enough to melt snow, there will not be an issue of finding a place for the water to go.
Dec 27, 2006, 5:35 am
#24
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 41
Modern airliners are extremely capable but there is a limit on every specific weather phenomena possible. For example the minimum temperature for starting the engines (on the aircraft I fly) is -40 C. I rarely see -40C but it's still a weather limitation on the aircraft. You could go down a list of every possible atmospheric condition and find a point at which it exceeds the capabilities of a modern airliner. It's certainly possible to design and build aircraft that could start engines below -40C but it's just not cost effective to spend the extra money expanding the operating envelop for a relatively infrequent condition.