Per Diem travelers, tips to save money, how much you "made" off per diem,ethics, etc.
#16
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#18
Join Date: Jul 2001
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Someone where I used to work said the best policy is where neither party feels taken advantage of. So if our client would supply a meal, such as around go-live, we would exclude it from our per diem at a predefined rate - breakfast $X, lunch something else, etc. I think also that if a hotel supplied breakfast we were supposed to exclude it from our per diem as well, for the same reason.
#19
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I've worked a couple places that had per-diem rates for meals. Nothing else though: hotels, transportation, etc. were actual expenses.
I didn't change my behavior (vs. submitting receipts). I'm sure some days I exceeded the per diem; others I stayed well under. I never tracked a "savings" - that would seem rather petty to me. I just ate normally: might be a simple breakfast in the hotel lounge, lunch from a deli, and a nice dinner. The only thing per diem did was make life simpler because I didn't need to save receipts. If we entertained (took clients to dinner), that was a separate receipt but our system wasn't nitpicky enough to go back and reverse fractions of per diems. So I guess, in theory, I "made" a couple bucks on those days.
But at the end of the day, business travel takes you away from your family, so I've been lucky to work for companies that understood that and didn't make a huge deal about the minor details. For my part, I've always been a conscientious shopper for flights and hotels, simply by planning a little better than most of my colleagues, and getting total trips done below target budget estimates. Since I have usually owned/controlled my own travel budget, it's in my own interest to keep them lean where it's reasonable to do so without compromising my ability to get work done.
I didn't change my behavior (vs. submitting receipts). I'm sure some days I exceeded the per diem; others I stayed well under. I never tracked a "savings" - that would seem rather petty to me. I just ate normally: might be a simple breakfast in the hotel lounge, lunch from a deli, and a nice dinner. The only thing per diem did was make life simpler because I didn't need to save receipts. If we entertained (took clients to dinner), that was a separate receipt but our system wasn't nitpicky enough to go back and reverse fractions of per diems. So I guess, in theory, I "made" a couple bucks on those days.
But at the end of the day, business travel takes you away from your family, so I've been lucky to work for companies that understood that and didn't make a huge deal about the minor details. For my part, I've always been a conscientious shopper for flights and hotels, simply by planning a little better than most of my colleagues, and getting total trips done below target budget estimates. Since I have usually owned/controlled my own travel budget, it's in my own interest to keep them lean where it's reasonable to do so without compromising my ability to get work done.
#20
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When I was per diem I used to stay at a Candlewood Suites. I still got my hotel points but the room had a full kitchen so I would go to a nearby Harris Teeter and cook dinner and get bananas and Noosa yogurt for breakfast complimented with a cup of free hotel coffee.
#21
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I don't personally "make" money from my per diem. That's theft/fraud. I have caught many people funnelling perdiem and corp card money into their own hands, and have had a few sent to prison. Things like buying gift cards, then selling them to a broker etc. Sometimes even silly things like shopping and then misrepresenting the expense reason.
But, I did work for a company that let me roll my budget each month into the next month, so if I was frugual at the start of the year, I was taking some very luxurious business trips by 4th quarter (And some very budget ones in 1st). By the last quarter I was going full fare F and staying in resorts. And it was all within policy and the allocated budget, and never entered my hands personally. As you suggest, much of the frugality was centered around buying meals in supermarkets and using Hotwire for cheap discount rooms.
Most companies I have worked for have allowed me to retain all airmiles, points etc into my personal accounts. This includes points from the corp Amex, EQM's, my code share alliances etc. When I was on vacation or left the company I took them with me so I didn't have to start over at the next company. That's how I buily top tier status on some carriers, cars and hotels over the years. When I went back and forth to Asia several times a year I racked them up very quickly. But again, that's per company policy and doesn't cut into profitability. It's a perk.
But, I did work for a company that let me roll my budget each month into the next month, so if I was frugual at the start of the year, I was taking some very luxurious business trips by 4th quarter (And some very budget ones in 1st). By the last quarter I was going full fare F and staying in resorts. And it was all within policy and the allocated budget, and never entered my hands personally. As you suggest, much of the frugality was centered around buying meals in supermarkets and using Hotwire for cheap discount rooms.
Most companies I have worked for have allowed me to retain all airmiles, points etc into my personal accounts. This includes points from the corp Amex, EQM's, my code share alliances etc. When I was on vacation or left the company I took them with me so I didn't have to start over at the next company. That's how I buily top tier status on some carriers, cars and hotels over the years. When I went back and forth to Asia several times a year I racked them up very quickly. But again, that's per company policy and doesn't cut into profitability. It's a perk.
#22
Join Date: Dec 2010
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No it's not. Many travel policies pay a fixed per diem for meals based on the area where you're working. The money belongs to the traveler to use as s/he pleases. If a traveler on such an arrangement wants to eat instant ramen and spend the per diem on something else, that's the traveler's right.
#23
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No it's not. Many travel policies pay a fixed per diem for meals based on the area where you're working. The money belongs to the traveler to use as s/he pleases. If a traveler on such an arrangement wants to eat instant ramen and spend the per diem on something else, that's the traveler's right.
#24
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There are no legal or ethical issues here. While there are some countries which may not permit the practice, it is generally accepted in much of the world and certainly the US. It has been in use by the US government for at least 30 years.
#25
Join Date: Jan 2018
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Hmm, I guess it depends on the employer. In places where I've worked, the per diem is specifically for food, travel and hotels because these are expenditures required for doing the job for the company. If it isn't used, then it's meant to go back to the employer - it's their money after all. They do it that way because it's easier than having to submit expenses and receipts each month but they do expect us to be honest with what it was used for.
#26
Join Date: Nov 2013
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Hmm, I guess it depends on the employer. In places where I've worked, the per diem is specifically for food, travel and hotels because these are expenditures required for doing the job for the company. If it isn't used, then it's meant to go back to the employer - it's their money after all. They do it that way because it's easier than having to submit expenses and receipts each month but they do expect us to be honest with what it was used for.
#27
Join Date: Jan 2018
Posts: 107
Yeah, totally get that. Past employers have taken the line that travel is a benefit (if not a downright privilege) and we should be thankful for 12-hour flights in economy on the cheapest ticket possible, being away from home so often and all that. Oh, and travel had to be done over weekends and didn't count as a working day. I think I remember now why I don't work for them anymore.
#28
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Hmm, I guess it depends on the employer. In places where I've worked, the per diem is specifically for food, travel and hotels because these are expenditures required for doing the job for the company. If it isn't used, then it's meant to go back to the employer - it's their money after all. They do it that way because it's easier than having to submit expenses and receipts each month but they do expect us to be honest with what it was used for.
#29
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Uncle Sam does so many things so poorly, but this is one where I think he's got it right.
The hotel portion of the per diem is a location-based max: you are reimbursed what you spent, up to that amount. You're welcome to spend more out of pocket, but you can't keep the difference if you spend less.
The meals portion of the per diem is also location-based, but it's a flat payment; whether you eat peanut butter from the jar or go to a Michelin-starred restaurant, you get whatever the local rate is. The only time it gets messed with is if a meal is separately paid by Uncle Sam, e.g. if a conference fee included lunch, you don't get to keep the lunch part of that day's per diem. Free hotel breakfast and airline meals don't count.
There's a reason so many cheapskate civil servants love Residence Inns--free semi-edible breakfast, some dinner-ish food a couple nights a week and a fridge to fill with beer and other dinner supplies means it's easy to spend $15 a day on food and keep the rest if you're so inclined.
I was never that cheap, but I liked making my own dinner for another reason--it makes it easier not to get fat(ter)
The hotel portion of the per diem is a location-based max: you are reimbursed what you spent, up to that amount. You're welcome to spend more out of pocket, but you can't keep the difference if you spend less.
The meals portion of the per diem is also location-based, but it's a flat payment; whether you eat peanut butter from the jar or go to a Michelin-starred restaurant, you get whatever the local rate is. The only time it gets messed with is if a meal is separately paid by Uncle Sam, e.g. if a conference fee included lunch, you don't get to keep the lunch part of that day's per diem. Free hotel breakfast and airline meals don't count.
There's a reason so many cheapskate civil servants love Residence Inns--free semi-edible breakfast, some dinner-ish food a couple nights a week and a fridge to fill with beer and other dinner supplies means it's easy to spend $15 a day on food and keep the rest if you're so inclined.
I was never that cheap, but I liked making my own dinner for another reason--it makes it easier not to get fat(ter)
#30
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No! Expensive & Not Healthy
As someone who is on an ultra healthy diet (no flour, no refined sugars), I can tell you that Whole Foods hot buffet items are anything but healthy for the most part. A lot of the dishes are high fat, high sugar. The cold selection is good though.