foreign currency error on Visa credit card
Oct 16, 2016, 6:12 am
#17
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: PSM
Posts: 69,232
Sorry you do not like my answer but you've tried many different avenues to get this resolved; I'm offering an explanation as to why all those efforts may have failed.
Oct 16, 2016, 12:25 pm
#18
Original Poster
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: San Francisco
Posts: 2,337
CSP Visa forex rates have been bad for a while now (I haven't used it when traveling internationally in over a year - I use exclusively Citi or AMEX). Haven't seen them this out of whack but more discussion here:
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/credi...all-cards.html
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/credi...all-cards.html
Oct 16, 2016, 1:05 pm
#19
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Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Bangkok or San Francisco
Programs: United 1k, Marriott Lifetime PE, Former DL Gold, Former SQ Solitaire, HH Gold
Posts: 11,886
Shortly after Brexit, to take advantage of the weakened British Pound (GBP), I purchased a cruise with a travel agent in the UK, using my UA MileagePlus Explorer Visa credit card, issued by Chase, with no foreign exchange fee.
The exchange rate used by Chase, provided by Visa, was incorrect, causing me to overpay by a not insignificant amount. The transaction posted on June 26, 2016. Chase has refused to help because it is an exchange rate dispute. Visa International has also refused to acknowledge their error, despite the (unsuccessful) intervention by Channel 7 On Your Side, a consumer advocacy service provided by my local TV station.
To find historical exchange rates for mastercard and visa:
https://www.mastercard.com/global/cu...ion/index.html
https://usa.visa.com/support/consume...alculator.html
For the date in question (June 26, 2016), here are the various conversion rates from British Pound (GBP) to USD:
visa 1.436642
mastercard 1.376046
xe.com 1.367535
oanda 1.3650
usforex 1.368045
x-rates 1.367535
As you can see above, visa's rate is substantially higher than those of its competitor (mastercard) as well as the various benchmarks.
I have done further research and found that Visa exchange rates from GBP to USD were incorrect for the 4-day period from June 24 to 27, while the rates for mastercard and the other benchmarks were all correct for the same period. In addition, for the same 4-day period, visa's exchange rates were also incorrect from GBP to Euro, as well as from GBP to Australian Dollar. I did not check other currencies but assume there was a similar issue. Clearly there was some systematic error in the way Visa selects and publishes its daily currency exchange rates to have caused this issue.
When I first spoke with Chase, one of its representatives told me that other cardmembers have reported exactly the same issue with GBP to USD conversion during the same time frame. They of course referred the issue to Visa, who is rightfully the owner of the problem but unfortunately has refused to help.
I have filed a complaint with Better Business Bureau and Consumer Financial Protection Bureau. Are there more effective ways to get Visa to own up to and rectify their problem?
The exchange rate used by Chase, provided by Visa, was incorrect, causing me to overpay by a not insignificant amount. The transaction posted on June 26, 2016. Chase has refused to help because it is an exchange rate dispute. Visa International has also refused to acknowledge their error, despite the (unsuccessful) intervention by Channel 7 On Your Side, a consumer advocacy service provided by my local TV station.
To find historical exchange rates for mastercard and visa:
https://www.mastercard.com/global/cu...ion/index.html
https://usa.visa.com/support/consume...alculator.html
For the date in question (June 26, 2016), here are the various conversion rates from British Pound (GBP) to USD:
visa 1.436642
mastercard 1.376046
xe.com 1.367535
oanda 1.3650
usforex 1.368045
x-rates 1.367535
As you can see above, visa's rate is substantially higher than those of its competitor (mastercard) as well as the various benchmarks.
I have done further research and found that Visa exchange rates from GBP to USD were incorrect for the 4-day period from June 24 to 27, while the rates for mastercard and the other benchmarks were all correct for the same period. In addition, for the same 4-day period, visa's exchange rates were also incorrect from GBP to Euro, as well as from GBP to Australian Dollar. I did not check other currencies but assume there was a similar issue. Clearly there was some systematic error in the way Visa selects and publishes its daily currency exchange rates to have caused this issue.
When I first spoke with Chase, one of its representatives told me that other cardmembers have reported exactly the same issue with GBP to USD conversion during the same time frame. They of course referred the issue to Visa, who is rightfully the owner of the problem but unfortunately has refused to help.
I have filed a complaint with Better Business Bureau and Consumer Financial Protection Bureau. Are there more effective ways to get Visa to own up to and rectify their problem?
Oct 19, 2016, 12:21 pm
#20
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 390
Unfortunately this issue, really is just the 'spread'
These things can be avoided by not buying foreign currency (including paying in a foreign currency) at times of economic or political uncertainty.
That means not paying for ANYTHING in Sterling for the next 2 years. The very same thing will happen when the US vote happens (Hillary in, USD higher, Trump is seen as an economic risk/change is bad in economics) and when the UK gov announces it has invoked article 50 (officially leaving Europe).
I know these things are risky... I still buy things from the UK. Hahaha (silly me) im just not upset when it doesnt work out.
BUT if you want to look in to this further, you should read up on the T&C on HOW Visa sets its rate. You would be looking for a limit they claim on the spread by say 50 base points. You already have the evidence of the actual rates offered by Visas competitors and the intrabank day rates.
If the T&C say they can use the high point of the day, you will know the outcome of your complaint. They are probably acting legally, in their own best interest.
Oct 23, 2016, 3:18 am
#22
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 2,196
Has anyone had any success with challenging an 'overcharge' with the card issuer. Both recent cases for me (last two weeks)...
1) Barclay's Arrival + - Thailand - an elephant 'rescue' - made a gift shop purchase; was advised there was going to be a fee; my purchase, in Thai Baht, included the aforementioned fee. Then the credit card was charged in Baht, but converted to USD, at a poor exchange rate. I was not given the choice of Baht vs. USD - the staff just did it. And I signed the receipt, shame on me, and then read the fine print indicating that I CHOSE this method of payment, which I did not. Questioning it, the previously communicative staff, in English, suddenly became mute. I e-mailed the manager of the park, who has insisted, including on TripAdvisor, that it ALWAYS charges in Baht.
2) Chase UA Club - Poland - a reputable restaurant. Placed my order and handed her the card for payment. I was not asked what currency I preferred, I did not insert the card myself and chose a currency, I did not sign a receipt nor did I enter a PIN. The entre transaction took place before I even thought about it. Same fine print on the receipt...'I accept that I have been offered a choice of currencies...'. That is clearly not the case. I asked, but the rather young staff told me that this is how they are told to process credit card transactions. I am going to dispute this charge.
(Note that in the grocery store last night, in Krakow, the cashier, I quote, 'Zloty, correct, it is cheaper for you', so these establishments know exactly what they are doing.)
1) Barclay's Arrival + - Thailand - an elephant 'rescue' - made a gift shop purchase; was advised there was going to be a fee; my purchase, in Thai Baht, included the aforementioned fee. Then the credit card was charged in Baht, but converted to USD, at a poor exchange rate. I was not given the choice of Baht vs. USD - the staff just did it. And I signed the receipt, shame on me, and then read the fine print indicating that I CHOSE this method of payment, which I did not. Questioning it, the previously communicative staff, in English, suddenly became mute. I e-mailed the manager of the park, who has insisted, including on TripAdvisor, that it ALWAYS charges in Baht.
2) Chase UA Club - Poland - a reputable restaurant. Placed my order and handed her the card for payment. I was not asked what currency I preferred, I did not insert the card myself and chose a currency, I did not sign a receipt nor did I enter a PIN. The entre transaction took place before I even thought about it. Same fine print on the receipt...'I accept that I have been offered a choice of currencies...'. That is clearly not the case. I asked, but the rather young staff told me that this is how they are told to process credit card transactions. I am going to dispute this charge.
(Note that in the grocery store last night, in Krakow, the cashier, I quote, 'Zloty, correct, it is cheaper for you', so these establishments know exactly what they are doing.)
Last edited by lamphs; Oct 23, 2016 at 3:22 am Reason: typo
Oct 23, 2016, 5:16 am
#23
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 45
Has anyone had any success with challenging an 'overcharge' with the card issuer. Both recent cases for me (last two weeks)...
1) Barclay's Arrival + - Thailand - an elephant 'rescue' - made a gift shop purchase; was advised there was going to be a fee; my purchase, in Thai Baht, included the aforementioned fee. Then the credit card was charged in Baht, but converted to USD, at a poor exchange rate. I was not given the choice of Baht vs. USD - the staff just did it. And I signed the receipt, shame on me, and then read the fine print indicating that I CHOSE this method of payment, which I did not. Questioning it, the previously communicative staff, in English, suddenly became mute. I e-mailed the manager of the park, who has insisted, including on TripAdvisor, that it ALWAYS charges in Baht.
2) Chase UA Club - Poland - a reputable restaurant. Placed my order and handed her the card for payment. I was not asked what currency I preferred, I did not insert the card myself and chose a currency, I did not sign a receipt nor did I enter a PIN. The entre transaction took place before I even thought about it. Same fine print on the receipt...'I accept that I have been offered a choice of currencies...'. That is clearly not the case. I asked, but the rather young staff told me that this is how they are told to process credit card transactions. I am going to dispute this charge.
(Note that in the grocery store last night, in Krakow, the cashier, I quote, 'Zloty, correct, it is cheaper for you', so these establishments know exactly what they are doing.)
1) Barclay's Arrival + - Thailand - an elephant 'rescue' - made a gift shop purchase; was advised there was going to be a fee; my purchase, in Thai Baht, included the aforementioned fee. Then the credit card was charged in Baht, but converted to USD, at a poor exchange rate. I was not given the choice of Baht vs. USD - the staff just did it. And I signed the receipt, shame on me, and then read the fine print indicating that I CHOSE this method of payment, which I did not. Questioning it, the previously communicative staff, in English, suddenly became mute. I e-mailed the manager of the park, who has insisted, including on TripAdvisor, that it ALWAYS charges in Baht.
2) Chase UA Club - Poland - a reputable restaurant. Placed my order and handed her the card for payment. I was not asked what currency I preferred, I did not insert the card myself and chose a currency, I did not sign a receipt nor did I enter a PIN. The entre transaction took place before I even thought about it. Same fine print on the receipt...'I accept that I have been offered a choice of currencies...'. That is clearly not the case. I asked, but the rather young staff told me that this is how they are told to process credit card transactions. I am going to dispute this charge.
(Note that in the grocery store last night, in Krakow, the cashier, I quote, 'Zloty, correct, it is cheaper for you', so these establishments know exactly what they are doing.)
You should be able to file a Mastercard Code 4846 chargeback and/or a Visa code 76 chargeback, but I'm not 100% sure. I'd ask the people over on that thread.
Oct 23, 2016, 7:45 am
#24
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 9,302
I've had a few over the years where I've complained at not being asked about what currency to be charged in. Often the bank concerned just refunds the difference rather than get involved in a dispute which is disappointing as the retailer gets away with it.
Oct 23, 2016, 9:24 am
#25
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 2,196
I'd check out the DCC thread http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/credi...hread-174.html
You should be able to file a Mastercard Code 4846 chargeback and/or a Visa code 76 chargeback, but I'm not 100% sure. I'd ask the people over on that thread.
You should be able to file a Mastercard Code 4846 chargeback and/or a Visa code 76 chargeback, but I'm not 100% sure. I'd ask the people over on that thread.
Last edited by lamphs; Oct 23, 2016 at 11:01 am Reason: typo
