Cloudship

It's the 11 across that is tighter.

weero

Is there such an implementation? I mean on the physical world, outside of sadistic managers' minds.

airsurfer

Yes, Airbus itself does an offering of 3-5-3 layout.

http://aviationweek.com/airbus-a380/...0-seating-2017

But I don't know whether that will be the A380NEO, the stretched version of the 380.

weero

So there is no such layout yet.

But 3-5-3 on the A380, is more than one inch better than 3-4-3 on the 777. Oddly enough, the 8 abreast JL 787s are the widest seat configurations out there, even surpassing the 3-4-3 A380.

sbm12

Nope...it is a theoretical that has yet to get anywhere close to on a plane.
Not really. The numbers are published that way but it is subterfuge and misdirection, just like the claims from Southwest that it would be offering wide seats on its new 737s without changing the fuselage or aisle dimensions.



They get there mostly by narrowing the armrest and measuring inside the edges. The measuring tape can show that wider number but the reality for a passenger sitting there is that you're closer to your neighbor and shoulder room hasn't changed. The touted benefit is specious at best.

(link goes to a story I wrote somewhere else; you've been warned)

WorldLux

Oh boy.... And that man isn't even particularly "big boned".

weero

I am not claiming that 3-5-3 is a desirable outcome for the good ol'A380 ... but 3-4-3 is a reality on the 777 these days and if you take the cabin width of both planes, deduct 2 times 17" aisles from it and divide by 10 and 11 respectively, the A380 11 abreast still scores a fair bit better than the existing 777s.

As the hull curvature on the A380 is milder than on the 777, the scenario you list should also be less likely.

airsurfer

Simple calculation:

A 380 has an inner cabin width of 6.50m and a 777 is 5.85m, which makes a difference of 65cm. And 65cm is more than a seat's width of 45cm.
So 3-5-3 in a 380 is 20cm wider than 3-4-3 in a 777. That is almost 2cm per seat.

BTW, why don't airlines choose a 2-5-3 layout instead of 3-4-3 (or 2-4-3 vs. 3-3-3), at least in a part of the Y cabins ? That allows couples seated together without a third person without compomizing seats.

televisor

I don't think that's possible because the seat tracks are too far out, without extra special location-specific engineering. Also, 5 across in a 17" seat is simply inhumane.

Here's a picture of the 2 in 2-4-3 on ANA: the riser coming from the seat tracks is touching the step/aisle edge.
https://christao408.files.wordpress....1/img_1632.jpg
Make those 2 seats a total of 2" narrower, and suddenly you need a new riser design which incorporates the step/trim. In other words you're completely redesigning a major part of the seat, just for use in the 2 groups, whereas the entire rest of the plane has consistent/identical seats/risers/steps/trim/etc. I don't think airlines would be particularly keen on the additional costs of carrying spare parts for yet another type of seat.

(I realise the exit row seats are already special, but the changes there only affect the armrests/sides of the seat, and not the seat mounting/risers, plus those changes are pretty much unavoidable vs optional changes for a 2 side-group.)

Cloudship

Keep in mind that cabins are circular, not rectangular, in cross section. The location of the floor in relation to the fuselage makes a difference here. Also, keep in mind that seat width is measured at either the cushion height or armrest height, so that may or may not be the widest cross section of the cabin. How airbus is finding this "extra room" is a combination not only of reduced seat size, but by raising the seat height just a little, and optimizing the side walls, it can gain a little more room between the window seat and the cabin wall.

weero

Agree on the data but not on the math.

650cm/11-585cm/10 is only 0.6cm.

The A380 is a tad wider and the 777 a tad slimmer than your data and you have to deduct two 17" aisles, so that the advantage of the A380 grows to nearly 1.5cm per seat.
That's still one bad implementation ....
That would make for two good and pleasant coach seats per row ... can't have that in the modern world.

airsurfer

You don't take the two aisles width into account.

The aisles are 0.50m wide (1m altogether) each which makes:

550/11 = 50cm
485/10 = 48.5cm

which is 1.5cm difference.

Cloudship

Partly because that would mean they would need 3 different types of seat sets, a 2 wide, a 3 wide, and a 5 wide, whereas they can use (2) 3 wide and (1) 4 wide unit.

weero

Ehm did you read my previous posts?

You did not take the aisle into account. And you got the math wrong.
Sorry to have to say it that bluntly mate.
I agree that this sounds a lot nicer than "screw you Y pax!".

diburning

That's because they've been using the same fuselage sections from the 707 up to the 757. The Airbus was designed a lot later, and because that baseline was there from the Boeing, they designed it to be wider for increased space.