Asiana (OZ214) (777-200LR) ICN-SFO Crashes on touchdown at SFO
Jul 6, 2013, 3:35 pm
#211
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: in a cabin
Posts: 6,521
KTVU still has a lower half banner stating 2 dead. Watching CNN and other news sources, no one is able to confirm injuries or casualties. I am hoping for the latter.
My vote is for another BA38 type of incident. Loss of power or critical flight systems on final.
My vote is for another BA38 type of incident. Loss of power or critical flight systems on final.
Jul 6, 2013, 3:36 pm
#212
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3 degrees is pretty standard, ~700-800 feet per minute in final approach segment. At higher altitudes and even in terminal area, greater rates and angles of descent are used as a matter of normal operations. Within a few thousand feet of the ground, anything more than 1000 feet per minute (or 3.5 degrees or so) are irregular and usually driven by approach needs (then generally terrain). I've landed at SFO on the 28s hundreds of times and either a normal ILS (but not 28L) currently or a visual approach are standard and easy--nothing special about them. Don't know about validity of a steeper than normal approach today, but that would be unusual in triple 7 esp. in SFO. If not an engine, I suspect we will see that out of service glideslope being a contributing factor.
Edit: just saw your post #212 after I posted this. Thanks again for the explanations.
Last edited by Finkface; Jul 6, 2013 at 3:37 pm Reason: Saw previous response.
Jul 6, 2013, 3:36 pm
#213
Join Date: Aug 2009
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1. Pilot Error
2. Mechanical Failure
3. Outside influences
Issue 1. could be due to a number of things, including
a) Tiredness
b) Medical Incident
c) Automation Complacency
d) Training Error
Issue 2.
a) Instrument Failure
b) Hydraulic Failure
c) Electrical Failure
d) Structural Failure
e) Maintenance Failure
f) Design Failure
Issue 3.
a) Weather
b) Sabotage
c) 3rd Party - Other Plane etc
d) Interference - Run Way incursion etc
d) Communication/Guidance Failure - eg. ILS Failure
Or any/some/none of the above. Who knows, lets all continue to speculate
Jul 6, 2013, 3:37 pm
#214
Join Date: May 2008
Location: YYZ
Posts: 2,636
A difference between BA38 and OZ214 is that G-YMMM had RR engines and this a/c had P&W engines with a different FOHE.
Jul 6, 2013, 3:40 pm
#215
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Windsor, UK (In the flight path)
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Although BA38 was down to ice in the fuel filter due to flying over the artic (which they have adapted the fuel filter to stop that happening)...
Jul 6, 2013, 3:45 pm
#216
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Chicago
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Unusual in that damned near all big airports have "easy" approaches with standard descent rates; like I said previously, most foreign carriers use the ILS a supermajority of arrival regardless of weather. They are standard worldwide and lower arrival risk by giving a very predictable profile that doesn't necessarily require "local knowledge" [or great stick/rudder since often they are 'coupled']...
Did CNN just have ground to air saying "vehicles on the way" or was that pilot-to-tower from in the grass? If in the air, this is likely mechanical...given the small fire, hope this wasnt fuel-related
Did CNN just have ground to air saying "vehicles on the way" or was that pilot-to-tower from in the grass? If in the air, this is likely mechanical...given the small fire, hope this wasnt fuel-related
Jul 6, 2013, 3:46 pm
#217
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Jul 6, 2013, 3:47 pm
#218
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Jul 6, 2013, 3:48 pm
#219
Join Date: May 2008
Location: YYZ
Posts: 2,636
Jul 6, 2013, 3:49 pm
#220
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: DCA/IAD/BWI
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Unusual in that damned near all big airports have "easy" approaches with standard descent rates; like I said previously, most foreign carriers use the ILS a supermajority of arrival regardless of weather. They are standard worldwide and lower arrival risk by giving a very predictable profile that doesn't necessarily require "local knowledge" [or great stick/rudder since often they are 'coupled']...
Did CNN just have ground to air saying "vehicles on the way" or was that pilot-to-tower from in the grass? If in the air, this is likely mechanical...given the small fire, hope this wasnt fuel-related
Did CNN just have ground to air saying "vehicles on the way" or was that pilot-to-tower from in the grass? If in the air, this is likely mechanical...given the small fire, hope this wasnt fuel-related
Jul 6, 2013, 3:50 pm
#221
Join Date: Dec 2002
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Oh, I definitely believe it. If course, if I were behind them in the aisle I think a punch to the face and a shove toward the door would have been in order. Just MNSHO.
Jul 6, 2013, 3:50 pm
#222
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: YVR, HNL
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Unusual in that damned near all big airports have "easy" approaches with standard descent rates; like I said previously, most foreign carriers use the ILS a supermajority of arrival regardless of weather. They are standard worldwide and lower arrival risk by giving a very predictable profile that doesn't necessarily require "local knowledge" [or great stick/rudder since often they are 'coupled']...
Did CNN just have ground to air saying "vehicles on the way" or was that pilot-to-tower from in the grass? If in the air, this is likely mechanical...given the small fire, hope this wasnt fuel-related
Did CNN just have ground to air saying "vehicles on the way" or was that pilot-to-tower from in the grass? If in the air, this is likely mechanical...given the small fire, hope this wasnt fuel-related
Jul 6, 2013, 3:52 pm
#223
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: London
Programs: BA GGL (for now) and Lifetime Gold, Marriott fan thanks to Bonvoy Moments
Posts: 5,115
1. Pilot Error
2. Mechanical Failure
3. Outside influences
Issue 1. could be due to a number of things, including
a) Tiredness
b) Medical Incident
c) Automation Complacency
d) Training Error
Issue 2.
a) Instrument Failure
b) Hydraulic Failure
c) Electrical Failure
d) Structural Failure
e) Maintenance Failure
f) Design Failure
Issue 3.
a) Weather
b) Sabotage
c) 3rd Party - Other Plane etc
d) Interference - Run Way incursion etc
d) Communication/Guidance Failure - eg. ILS Failure
Or any/some/none of the above. Who knows, lets all continue to speculate
Jul 6, 2013, 3:53 pm
#224
Join Date: May 2008
Location: YYZ
Posts: 2,636
I would guess the aircraft was on the ground and the garbled communication was an attempt at a Mayday.