silvergirl

Personally I wouldn't downgrade for the sake of $1k, but where I think this system really is flawed is about making sure the people who do, don't justify or make up extra travel just for the sake of earning more money. Even if people don't, it could create a perception in some cases and question the reasons for a trip (even if justified and well intended it may not be clear to those on the outside).

For the similar related reason I also don't like the rationale of people saying they get paid enough to pay for their own upgrades. Even if that is the case, why should I be paying more from my own pocket just because I happen to take on an overseas project (compared to a peer who may just happen to take on a local project)? I already make a lot of sacrifices in my life for work travel, so I think if every trip (i.e. Joining that additional sales pitch, going for a project overseas) resulted in me paying extra, I would start really resenting it.

For me, global consultancy, SH is Y, LH is J (applies at my level, some more junior levels is all Y); this applies to all flights, whether billed to client, business development or training.
We also have clients who only pay Y, but the company then pays the difference. It is my responsibility to make sure I have planned this in my project financials. I think this is the right approach, as individuals shouldn't be punished for working for one client vs the other.

Personally when I fly for personal reasons it is also always J or F in long haul, so I would struggle with anything else at work.

For those who say to take an extra day off to rest to make up for Y in LH, I would struggle finding the time. I often juggle multiple projects in multiple countries, so it's hard enough to figure out where to be when - there simply is no time to add rest days in between, if I did that would impact my client presence and delay projects as a result. So better try get some sleep on an overnight flight in J (which isn't that great either). But my company is flexible, even in J, if I can arrive early it is up to me to do so, no one tracks me or tells me which dates to book.

Ski CB

Hey All -- looks like an old thread here but wondering if anyone has guidance on when it's "ok" to ask about travel policies in an interview? How specific / blunt are you with your questions about when it's ok to book biz?

I'm in process for a role that's probably only 25% but will include some long hauls if it works out (e.g., DEN-MNL). While it may not be a determinant factor, I'll be taking it in to consideration. Thanks in advance!

SMFlagg

Almost any interview, even formal, non-conversational ones have a point where you are asked for any questions. I'd just ask them to talk about their travel policies considering a quarter of your job would involve that aspect of the work.

I work in an industry where 25-50% travel is expected, almost all of it is long haul. If someone were to ask me that question during an interview, I'd talk about our booking policies straight away.

Ski CB

Thanks for the insight!

bexfrepp

It depends on a couple other factors besides duration
- timezone diff
- duration of stay
- schedule while there

Basically, if doing the job properly demands that you get some quality sleep, and thats impossible in economy, then business it is.

Often1

A major consideration is to make this part of your unofficial research. Finding others who may work there, have experience there and the like is important for all kinds of reasons, not just travel. It doesn't help to learn that the policy allows for F/J TPAC travel, but to later find out that "nobody here does that".

If the job involves occasional short/mid-haul travel, asking about specifics at a first interview shows that you don't have your eye on the big picture.

But, where there is a lot of travel, it is long-haul, or the service standard really matters at the destination, it is important to nail this down. No use in going all the way through the process only to find that the travel policy is unacceptably limiting.

I would not focus on small things, e.g., whether it is Marriott vs. Hyatt and whether you can expense the mini-bar, but asking about important specifics such as the cutoff for F/J and general expectations about on-the-ground are reasonable.

BThumme

That's a couple good points. I don't know why I feel this way, but travel talk to me always feel like a taboo subject at the workplace. Maybe it's because I want to be a road-warrior, and I feel that, despite me being a younger guy and going "hey, I don't have a wife/kids, I can be flexible if needed", I sometimes fear that if I bring up travel or ever talk about FF programs and everything, that it might appear to some/one that I'm only looking out for myself, if that makes sense to anyone here.

Or if I would potentially consider a job based on its travel policy, that I must not really be that interested in the job or position. Now with that said, my current and previous role didn't have a whole lot of traveling, so I'm sure more traditional travel-heavy jobs are much more open about it.

mdkowals

Out of curiosity, has anyone seen a push to use Premium Economy instead of J on long haul flights where J has been authorized?


It seems like we're in a long term circle for US Commercial Airlines:
(1) 3 cabin planes (F, J, Y) with unsold F seats due to business standards specifying J on long haul.
(2) Airline industry corrects by ditching F cabin and providing a facelift to J to appease both the old J passengers and the handful of pure F passengers
(3) Airline then adds 3rd class of travel (PE) in between J and Y to restore a more natural slide in accommodations from high cost travel to low cost travel.


--That's as of Today, future steps in the circle:


(4) Businesses realize that PE does roughly what J used to do, and change travel policies to dictate travel in PE long haul
(5) Airlines go back to step one when the J seats start underselling.

365RoadWarrior

Our policy: No.

(Incidentally, no upgrades, even free ones.)

der_saeufer

Yes and no. Uncle Sam has criteria under which federal employees can fly in J, but I've never actually known anyone to get it approved (other than a couple medical waivers)--it's far easier procedurally just to take a break enroute or upon arrival, either of which puts you back in Y. Some agencies, though, are now allowing Y+ on flights over a certain length and it's actually getting approved. That said, for my usual TATL route, Y+ is rarely over $200 extra, whereas a paid J seat is about $2000 more than Y.

KDS777

We got booked into economy or PE randomly. If you wanted to upgrade to J on points, that was between you and the airline. If you wanted to buy J you could either email the travel dept and they'd charge your personal CC with the difference, or you could do it online.

No politics involved whatsoever.

bocastephen

What kind of a nutty policy is that? You can't even use your own miles or certificates (or pay a fare different from your own pocket) to upgrade? How is this any of the employer's business?

gobluetwo

I'm sure the aim of that policy is some misguided attempt at egalitarianism.

matrixwalker2012

Stupid companies driving away talented employees and retaining mediocre ones.

Bluebrummie2000

By any chance does anyone have an example text from a successful doctor's note that allowed a medical exception to the 'Y' policy for flights below 8 hours?