Old Timer's Airline Quiz and Discussion.
Jul 2, 2017, 12:53 am
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At London, Pan Am gave up Chicago, and TWA gave up San Francisco. Pan Am mostly withdrew from Paris, and TWA from Frankfurt. Pan Am gave up Spain and Portugal, and TWA their round-the-world flights through Asia. There were various adjustments afterwards but that set the general trend for years afterwards. By the nature of the agreement they were only temporarily suspended so could not be given to another carrier.
"Deregulation" as such, and the ability for an airline to decide for themselves where to fly, only came in 1978 to US domestic flights, international flights were subject to various agreements with other governments, which have varied and been reduced, but not entirely eliminated, in subsequent years.
Jul 2, 2017, 7:34 am
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It was a combination of these points. Pan Am and TWA were both given authorisation for various routes from the US to Europe, building up way back in the 707 days. By the early 1970s the 747 came along and was applied to many of these, and there was a travel downturn. Therefore the two airlines proposed a form of route swap, where each, equally, gave up half of their poor performing routes. This all needed agreement by the government authority, which was (maybe surprisingly) given. Bear in mind that there were still the European airlines for competition on each route.
At London, Pan Am gave up Chicago, and TWA gave up San Francisco. Pan Am mostly withdrew from Paris, and TWA from Frankfurt. Pan Am gave up Spain and Portugal, and TWA their round-the-world flights through Asia. There were various adjustments afterwards but that set the general trend for years afterwards. By the nature of the agreement they were only temporarily suspended so could not be given to another carrier.
"Deregulation" as such, and the ability for an airline to decide for themselves where to fly, only came in 1978 to US domestic flights, international flights were subject to various agreements with other governments, which have varied and been reduced, but not entirely eliminated, in subsequent years.
At London, Pan Am gave up Chicago, and TWA gave up San Francisco. Pan Am mostly withdrew from Paris, and TWA from Frankfurt. Pan Am gave up Spain and Portugal, and TWA their round-the-world flights through Asia. There were various adjustments afterwards but that set the general trend for years afterwards. By the nature of the agreement they were only temporarily suspended so could not be given to another carrier.
"Deregulation" as such, and the ability for an airline to decide for themselves where to fly, only came in 1978 to US domestic flights, international flights were subject to various agreements with other governments, which have varied and been reduced, but not entirely eliminated, in subsequent years.
Jul 2, 2017, 7:36 am
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And on a Friday morning as we roll into a big holiday weekend here in the U.S., here are eight quiz items concerning Pacific Southwest Airlines (PSA) and the Lockheed L-1011 TriStar.....
1. How many new L-1011 aircraft manufactured by Lockheed at their plant in Palmdale, CA were painted in PSA's full company colors? ANSWERED
2. Lockheed added a fairing underneath of the forward fuselage of the PSA TriStars. Why did they do this? ANSWERED
3. How many seats did PSA's L-1011s have on the main deck of the aircraft?
4. What was unique about the PSA TriStar aircraft in terms of the location of 16 passenger seats? ANSWERED
5. Why did PSA send an L-1011 with a full complement of twelve lady flight attendants to Hong Kong (HKG) in 1974? ANSWERED
6. On what date was PSA's first TriStar placed into revenue service on an intrastate flight in California and where did it depart from on this first flight? ANSWERED
7. What was PSA's initial turnaround time between flights with the L-1011 and what was this turn time subsequently changed to?
8. After PSA removed their TriStar aircraft from service, another airline proposed to use these stored aircraft on a premium shuttle service operated on weekdays between Chicago O'Hare (ORD) and New York LaGuardia (LGA) and then attempt to operate charter services with them on the weekends. However, this plan never came to fruition. Identify the air carrier that proposed this plan.
1. How many new L-1011 aircraft manufactured by Lockheed at their plant in Palmdale, CA were painted in PSA's full company colors? ANSWERED
2. Lockheed added a fairing underneath of the forward fuselage of the PSA TriStars. Why did they do this? ANSWERED
3. How many seats did PSA's L-1011s have on the main deck of the aircraft?
4. What was unique about the PSA TriStar aircraft in terms of the location of 16 passenger seats? ANSWERED
5. Why did PSA send an L-1011 with a full complement of twelve lady flight attendants to Hong Kong (HKG) in 1974? ANSWERED
6. On what date was PSA's first TriStar placed into revenue service on an intrastate flight in California and where did it depart from on this first flight? ANSWERED
7. What was PSA's initial turnaround time between flights with the L-1011 and what was this turn time subsequently changed to?
8. After PSA removed their TriStar aircraft from service, another airline proposed to use these stored aircraft on a premium shuttle service operated on weekdays between Chicago O'Hare (ORD) and New York LaGuardia (LGA) and then attempt to operate charter services with them on the weekends. However, this plan never came to fruition. Identify the air carrier that proposed this plan.
Last edited by jlemon; Jul 3, 2017 at 8:05 am Reason: answer updates
Jul 2, 2017, 8:46 am
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Quick ... I'm just off to London Euston station for a train to Birmingham, for an all day session tomorrow and then continuing by train to Scotland. Yes, it is a pleasant sunny Sunday mid-afternoon ... Just time for the PSA questions.
For I was in California in September 1974 and went with PSA one Sunday morning LAX-SFO. How cheap that was. It was a 727, but there was plenty of material around about the L1011.
I'm guessing the L1011 started service first Monday in September. And its departure point was likely PSA's base, San Diego.
By the time the aircraft came it was apparent it was far too large for the route. So I'm guessing the trip to Hong Kong was to try and sell/lease them to Cathay Pacific.
Birmingham beckons ... Hey, nobody has had a shot yet at my Ford Tri-Motor question
For I was in California in September 1974 and went with PSA one Sunday morning LAX-SFO. How cheap that was. It was a 727, but there was plenty of material around about the L1011.
I'm guessing the L1011 started service first Monday in September. And its departure point was likely PSA's base, San Diego.
By the time the aircraft came it was apparent it was far too large for the route. So I'm guessing the trip to Hong Kong was to try and sell/lease them to Cathay Pacific.
Birmingham beckons ... Hey, nobody has had a shot yet at my Ford Tri-Motor question
Jul 2, 2017, 9:12 am
Join Date: May 2015
Location: South Florida
Programs: DL Skymiles KE Skypass
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And on a Friday morning as we roll into a big holiday weekend here in the U.S., here are eight quiz items concerning Pacific Southwest Airlines (PSA) and the Lockheed L-1011 TriStar.....
1. How many new L-1011 aircraft manufactured by Lockheed at their plant in Palmdale, CA were painted in PSA's full company colors?
2. Lockheed added a fairing underneath of the forward fuselage of the PSA TriStars. Why did they do this?
4. What was unique about the PSA TriStar aircraft in terms of the location of 16 passenger seats?
1. How many new L-1011 aircraft manufactured by Lockheed at their plant in Palmdale, CA were painted in PSA's full company colors?
2. Lockheed added a fairing underneath of the forward fuselage of the PSA TriStars. Why did they do this?
4. What was unique about the PSA TriStar aircraft in terms of the location of 16 passenger seats?
2 and 4 may be related in that the forward cargo hold was modified with a stairwell to allow boarding from airports that did not have jetways. As such, there were 16 seats on this level with an additional stairway to the main level inside the compartment. The fairing was there to add additional protection for those passengers and covered the stairwell when retracted while flying.
Jul 2, 2017, 12:14 pm
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Quick ... I'm just off to London Euston station for a train to Birmingham, for an all day session tomorrow and then continuing by train to Scotland. Yes, it is a pleasant sunny Sunday mid-afternoon ... Just time for the PSA questions.
For I was in California in September 1974 and went with PSA one Sunday morning LAX-SFO. How cheap that was. It was a 727, but there was plenty of material around about the L1011.
I'm guessing the L1011 started service first Monday in September. And its departure point was likely PSA's base, San Diego.
By the time the aircraft came it was apparent it was far too large for the route. So I'm guessing the trip to Hong Kong was to try and sell/lease them to Cathay Pacific.
Birmingham beckons ... Hey, nobody has had a shot yet at my Ford Tri-Motor question
For I was in California in September 1974 and went with PSA one Sunday morning LAX-SFO. How cheap that was. It was a 727, but there was plenty of material around about the L1011.
I'm guessing the L1011 started service first Monday in September. And its departure point was likely PSA's base, San Diego.
By the time the aircraft came it was apparent it was far too large for the route. So I'm guessing the trip to Hong Kong was to try and sell/lease them to Cathay Pacific.
Birmingham beckons ... Hey, nobody has had a shot yet at my Ford Tri-Motor question
6. The first revenue flight conducted by PSA indeed departed from the airline's main base in San Diego on a routing of SAN-LAX-SFO. PSA employees gave their first TriStar a nickname: "Mother Grinning Bird".
However, this flight did not take place in September.....but you are very close with your guess concerning this first date of scheduled revenue operations.
Last edited by jlemon; Jul 2, 2017 at 12:54 pm Reason: Mother Grinning Bird
Jul 2, 2017, 12:48 pm
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1. They only had 2 in their fleet, so I will guess both were originally painted before delivery to the airline as they received them new.
2 and 4 may be related in that the forward cargo hold was modified with a stairwell to allow boarding from airports that did not have jetways. As such, there were 16 seats on this level with an additional stairway to the main level inside the compartment. The fairing was there to add additional protection for those passengers and covered the stairwell when retracted while flying.
2 and 4 may be related in that the forward cargo hold was modified with a stairwell to allow boarding from airports that did not have jetways. As such, there were 16 seats on this level with an additional stairway to the main level inside the compartment. The fairing was there to add additional protection for those passengers and covered the stairwell when retracted while flying.
2. & 4. These are indeed related and PSA's aircraft did have a lower deck lounge with 16 passenger seats. The fairing underneath the forward fuselage was added for the protection of lower deck lounge passengers in the event of a belly landing.
Jul 2, 2017, 1:29 pm
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Just looked it up. The substantial layover time at each end is surprising, as is the lack of connectivity to any other 727 schedule; it needs two aircraft on something which could be achieved by one in a daily round trip. Turning now to the TT in question, I see it also operated a Panama-Caracas tag flight, overnighting in Caracas, to the PA 747 which ran daily LAX-Guatemala-Panama.
So with all this in mind, please answer the following:
A. Name the airline that operated both of these flights.
B. Identify the propeller aircraft type operated on the initial flight from Houston.
C. Name the U.S. domestic airport where the connection was made to the international flight.
D. Identify the three international destinations served by the connecting flight.
E. Name the different and larger propeller aircraft type used to operate the international flight.
And for bonus points....
F. Provide the marketing name the airline used for this international service.
Last edited by jlemon; Jul 2, 2017 at 1:36 pm
Jul 2, 2017, 6:20 pm
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I didn't think the three additional sold to LTU in 1977 were painted in PSA's colors, so I guess that means a total of 5.
Jul 2, 2017, 8:33 pm
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6. August 1, 1974 - The same day that the UN created the Green Line in Cyprus.
Jul 3, 2017, 7:59 am
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1. Yep. And LTU initially operated these three TriStars that had originally been intended for PSA with the lower deck lounges. Registrations were D-AERI, D-AERE and D-AERU. I believe D-AERI may have been destroyed by fire on the ground at Dusseldorf during maintenance in 1991.
Jul 3, 2017, 8:04 am
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6. Quite right. PSA's first L-1011 replaced a B727-200 primarily on the LAX-SFO route with the aircraft beginning and ending its day at SAN. Initial load factors were around 50% and the aircraft achieved a dispatch record of better than 98%.
Jul 3, 2017, 8:08 am
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....here are several quiz items concerning Pacific Southwest Airlines (PSA) and the Lockheed L-1011 TriStar.....
3. How many seats did PSA's L-1011s have on the main deck of the aircraft?
7. What was PSA's initial turnaround time between flights with the L-1011 and what was this turn time subsequently changed to?
8. After PSA removed their TriStar aircraft from service, another airline proposed to use these stored aircraft on a premium shuttle service operated on weekdays between Chicago O'Hare (ORD) and New York LaGuardia (LGA) and then attempt to operate charter services with them on the weekends. However, this plan never came to fruition. Identify the air carrier that proposed this plan.
3. How many seats did PSA's L-1011s have on the main deck of the aircraft?
7. What was PSA's initial turnaround time between flights with the L-1011 and what was this turn time subsequently changed to?
8. After PSA removed their TriStar aircraft from service, another airline proposed to use these stored aircraft on a premium shuttle service operated on weekdays between Chicago O'Hare (ORD) and New York LaGuardia (LGA) and then attempt to operate charter services with them on the weekends. However, this plan never came to fruition. Identify the air carrier that proposed this plan.
Jul 3, 2017, 10:38 am
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having discovered that no operators actually configured to the maximum certified number of seats (315), I'll just pull an order-of-magnitude number out of thin air: how about 287?
Jul 3, 2017, 12:45 pm
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3. my first flight on a TriStar was aboard "Mama Grinning Bird" N10112 (SFO-LAX) in Jan 1975, but not having the foresight to realize that there would be a quiz item I certainly didn't count seats!
having discovered that no operators actually configured to the maximum certified number of seats (315), I'll just pull an order-of-magnitude number out of thin air: how about 287?
having discovered that no operators actually configured to the maximum certified number of seats (315), I'll just pull an order-of-magnitude number out of thin air: how about 287?