Go Back  FlyerTalk Forums > Travel&Dining > TravelBuzz
Reload this Page >

Old Timer's Airline Quiz and Discussion

Old Timer's Airline Quiz and Discussion

Old May 12, 19, 11:27 pm
  #15631  
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: PDX
Programs: AS DL
Posts: 2,230
QUESTION

Now that the current quiz is winding down, perhaps some answers to this vague question?

A family member was needing specialist medical treatment around 1978. He was flown in a passenger seat, not stretcher, from probably Manhattan Regional Airport (MHK) in Manhattan, Kansas or Marshall Army Airfield (FRI), probably in a USAF DC-9. Let's assume it was a C-9A/DC-9. The longer runway at MHK is 7,000 feet, but wasn't that length until 1979. FRI's runway is 4,503 ft. There's also the possibility it originated at Forbes AFB, Topeka. The destination was Denver. Stapleton? Buckley AFB in Aurora, CO?

a. What airport did the flight likely depart?
b. What airport did the flight likely arrive?

When there's ever a discussion about the family's history, I am always curious about details that nobody else thinks about. What airline was flown? What route? What aircraft? hahaha
Toshbaf is online now  
Old May 13, 19, 2:17 am
  #15632  
 
Join Date: May 2015
Location: South Florida
Programs: DL Skymiles KE Skypass
Posts: 949
Originally Posted by Toshbaf View Post
6. What was the first airport in the world to operate scheduled international commercial services? Where did the flight go?


Great answer! However, I think the answer would be for a different question, a hypothetical 6A, first schedule international commercial service by an airline that is still flying.

England had Airco and the US had Chauk's Ocean, both no longer exists. I believe Airco operated domestically initially. Chauk did not but flew to the Bahamas.

6. What was the first airport in the world to operate scheduled international commercial services? Where did the flight go?
Miami airport, but not the current one. It's the Miami seaplane runway in Biscayne Bay between Miami and Miami Beach. The flight went to Alice Town, Bahamas, which is on Bimini Island, closer to Miami than Nassau. I don't really know seaplanes so I won't be able to say what plane was used.

Chauk's Ocean Airways, later Chauk's International Airlines, lasted a long time until around 2005 or so. An old Grumman seaplane crashed and the airline was shut down. It was tough to maintain a plane more than 50 years old and with the company no longer in the seaplane business. The FAA didn't have confidence in the airline.

I'm not completely sure of my answer except Chauk's was one of the first, if not the first, scheduled international flight. It used to be America's oldest airline when it was flying. I thought of flying them but wasn't too sure about the old aircraft. Kenmore Air flies old planes but Chauk's was an order of magnitude more difficult because Kenmore's old DHC Beavers and Otters are still support by the new manufacturer, Viking Air of Victoria, BC.
Living in Miami, The crash of a plane off the Government Cut Inlet is what finally shut down Chalk's. The seaplane terminal still sits on Watson Island to this day unused and can be seen on many episodes of "Burn Notice" previously airing on USA Network.

(This is the same area where the Late Marlins' pitcher Jose Fernandez lost his life in a Boating Accident at night a few years ago. Ironically, he survived a boat sinking when he came into the USA from Cuba as a child on a makeshift raft.)

And actually Pan-Am actually was the airline entity that developed an airport in Miami to handle mail routes in the Caribbean, especially to Cuba, so in the realm of Commercial services, do you mean non-passenger services like mail?

Last edited by teddybear99; May 13, 19 at 2:22 am Reason: asking the question of commercial services
teddybear99 is offline  
Old May 13, 19, 6:50 am
  #15633  
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Trenton NJ
Programs: UA Gold MM, AA Plat, Honors Silver, Marriott Plat, IHG Plat, Wyndham Plat, National Exec, Hertz 5*
Posts: 1,725
Originally Posted by Bluehen1 View Post
Seat 2A, I couldn't quote your post but here are my responses..


As to your questions below, I'll have a gander at a couple...

1A. What airport had the highest incident rate (per 10,000 flights) in 2018. Kansas City International Airport
1B. From 1990-2017, what phase of flight has had the highest number of bird strikes? Approach for landing CORRECT
1C. From 1990-2017, for bird strikes where the bird could be identified which bird species caused the largest number of bird strikes? Mourning Dove
So, since there wasn't much interest in this I've put in the correct answers....
Bluehen1 is offline  
Old May 13, 19, 9:52 am
  #15634  
Original Poster
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: East Ester, Alaska
Programs: Alaska Airlines Million Miler, United Airlines Million Miler, Wyndham Rewards Diamond Level
Posts: 8,698
6. What was the first airport in the world to operate scheduled international commercial services? Where did the flight go?

Per YVR Cockroach: Educated guess. Given KLM is the oldest continuously-operating airline, I will guess it was Amsterdam, way before Schiphol, to Brussels?

Per Toshbaf: Miami airport, but not the current one. It's the Miami seaplane runway in Biscayne Bay between Miami and Miami Beach. The flight went to Alice Town, Bahamas, which is on Bimini Island, closer to Miami than Nassau. I don't really know seaplanes so I won't be able to say what plane was used.

My source for this question - which I have a link to when the time comes - indicates that the airport we're looking for is neither of the above (Amsterdam or the old Miami airport). In fact, I'll just put it out there now...

https://www.mylondon.news/news/west-...eiled-11186742

That said, Toshbaf has an interesting point, one kind of backed up per that source of all knowledge - Wikepedia. To wit:

"The first airline to operate international flights was Chalk's Ocean Airways, established 1917, which operated scheduled seaplane services from Florida to the Bahamas. The first regular international service in the world was covered by the British Aircraft Transport and Travel, from Hounslow Heath Aerodrome to Le Bourget, near Paris."

Huh?
strickerj likes this.
Seat 2A is offline  
Old May 13, 19, 10:07 am
  #15635  
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: DTW
Programs: Alaska, Delta, Southwest
Posts: 824
Originally Posted by Seat 2A View Post
...
That said, Toshbaf has an interesting point, one kind of backed up per that source of all knowledge - Wikepedia. To wit:

"The first airline to operate international flights was Chalk's Ocean Airways, established 1917, which operated scheduled seaplane services from Florida to the Bahamas. The first regular international service in the world was covered by the British Aircraft Transport and Travel, from Hounslow Heath Aerodrome to Le Bourget, near Paris."

Huh?
From the article, that service started in 1919, after Chalk’s. I’m guessing the distinction is the London to Paris flight was the start of regularly scheduled commercial service, whereas Chalk’s was more like a charter service at the time. Can anyone confirm?
strickerj is offline  
Old May 13, 19, 11:06 am
  #15636  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Nov 1999
Programs: statusless these days
Posts: 19,320
Originally Posted by Toshbaf View Post
I'm not completely sure of my answer except Chauk's was one of the first, if not the first, scheduled international flight. It used to be America's oldest airline when it was flying. I thought of flying them but wasn't too sure about the old aircraft. Kenmore Air flies old planes but Chauk's was an order of magnitude more difficult because Kenmore's old DHC Beavers and Otters are still support by the new manufacturer, Viking Air of Victoria, BC.
I'd wager it's also a lot easier to support relatvely-simple planes (DHC Beaver and Otter) with floats than a flying boat.
YVR Cockroach is offline  
Old May 13, 19, 1:09 pm
  #15637  
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: London, England.
Programs: BA
Posts: 7,388
Big DC-3 get-together in UK and France

Not a quiz item but now is the time to let all interested know about the 75th anniversary of D-Day, being commemorated here in the UK and in France on 5 June.

Here's the dates and times

https://www.daksovernormandy.com/program/

Here's the aircraft (must be a quiz question or two in there somewhere)

https://www.daksovernormandy.com/aircraft/

DC-3s, with paratroopers or towing gliders, were the key aircraft of those times. They hope to get more than 30 DC-3 together, in loose formation, to make the trip across the English Channel. They start from Duxford museum, near Cambridge, and head across to Caen in Normandy, France. They are actually doing the trip on the afternoon of Wednesday 5 June. Lots of events in the days beforehand at Duxford, and after at Caen. the timetable also shows where they will pass over on the way. Shame officialdom has not let them come over central London.

Up to 12 DC-3s are coming over from the USA in a group though I can't find much detail of that.

Anyone who wants to meet up at Duxford on 5 June give me a PM.
Seat 2A, jlemon and strickerj like this.
WHBM is offline  
Old May 13, 19, 11:59 pm
  #15638  
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: PDX
Programs: AS DL
Posts: 2,230
Originally Posted by Bluehen1 View Post
As to your questions below, I'll have a gander at a couple...

1A. What airport had the highest incident rate (per 10,000 flights) in 2018. [COLOR=#1 abc9c]Kansas City International Airport[/COLOR]
1B. From 1990-2017, what phase of flight has had the highest number of bird strikes? [COLOR=#1 abc9c]Approach for landing CORRECT[/COLOR]
1C. From 1990-2017, for bird strikes where the bird could be identified which bird species caused the largest number of bird strikes? [COLOR=#1 abc9c]Mourning Dove[/COLOR]

So, since there wasn't much interest in this I've put in the correct answers....
Of course not. There was interest on my part. It's just that I didn't know the answers. 1A. MCI does fit my hypothesis that the highest rate are swampy or large airports. MCI is fairly large. Since the answer was rate per flight, then large or swampy airports with not that much air traffic would be #1 .

As far as 1C., if I had to guess, it would have been pigeon. The common pigeon one sees in cities is in a similar family as the mourning dove but not the same thing.
Toshbaf is online now  
Old May 14, 19, 8:56 am
  #15639  
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: LFT
Programs: Once again lowly AA Gold. Lots of AA, AS & DL miles & BA Avios + some UA miles, former CO Plat
Posts: 7,619
Originally Posted by YVR Cockroach View Post
I'd wager it's also a lot easier to support relatvely-simple planes (DHC Beaver and Otter) with floats than a flying boat.
Well, speaking of DHC Beaver and Otter seaplanes specifically with regard to an airline up in your part of the world......

https://www.harbourair.com/harbour-a...ctric-airline/

If they can successfully make this work, I'll miss the sound of Harbour Air's piston and turboprop powered aircraft.....but this certainly sounds like a sign of the times.
jlemon is offline  
Old May 14, 19, 9:36 am
  #15640  
Original Poster
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: East Ester, Alaska
Programs: Alaska Airlines Million Miler, United Airlines Million Miler, Wyndham Rewards Diamond Level
Posts: 8,698
And then there were two...

AIRPORT QUIZ QUESTIONS

10. This U.S. city’s airport was the first to have an air traffic control tower and a radio controlled air traffic control system. Name it.

11. In 2002, this was the first U.S. airport to federalize its security force after the passage of the Aviation and Transportation Security Act. It is effectively known as the birthplace of the TSA. So then, which airport is it?
Seat 2A is offline  
Old May 14, 19, 9:44 am
  #15641  
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Programs: AA
Posts: 9,846
Originally Posted by Seat 2A View Post
And then there were two...

AIRPORT QUIZ QUESTIONS

10. This U.S. city’s airport was the first to have an air traffic control tower and a radio controlled air traffic control system. Name it.
Wild stab of Chicago

11
. In 2002, this was the first U.S. airport to federalize its security force after the passage of the Aviation and Transportation Security Act. It is effectively known as the birthplace of the TSA. So then, which airport is it?
Another wild stab SFO
wrp96 is offline  
Old May 14, 19, 10:27 pm
  #15642  
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: PDX
Programs: AS DL
Posts: 2,230
10. This U.S. city’s airport was the first to have an air traffic control tower and a radio controlled air traffic control system. Name it.
Originally Posted by wrp96 View Post
Wild stab of Chicago
Very interesting answer since the original air route control centers were Newark, Cleveland, and Chicago. So the first radio controlled air traffic control system was one of them.

However, the first air traffic control tower could depend on the definition of "tower". The first air traffic controller, according to PATCO, I believe (remember when Reagan fired all of the strikers and PATCO was decertified?), was at Lambert Field (STL). The tower was a makeshift stand where the first air traffic controller (name I don't remember) directed traffic.
Toshbaf is online now  
Old May 15, 19, 9:27 am
  #15643  
Original Poster
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: East Ester, Alaska
Programs: Alaska Airlines Million Miler, United Airlines Million Miler, Wyndham Rewards Diamond Level
Posts: 8,698
I apologize for the delay, folks. Internet issues out here in the wilds of Alaska. Thanks for your patience...

Originally Posted by wrp96 View Post
10. This U.S. city’s airport was the first to have an air traffic control tower and a radio controlled air traffic control system. Name it.

Per wrp96
: Wild stab of Chicago

Per Toshbaf: Very interesting answer since the original air route control centers were Newark, Cleveland, and Chicago. So the first radio controlled air traffic control system was one of them.

However, the first air traffic control tower could depend on the definition of "tower". The first air traffic controller, according to PATCO, I believe (remember when Reagan fired all of the strikers and PATCO was decertified?), was at Lambert Field (STL). The tower was a makeshift stand where the first air traffic controller (name I don't remember) directed traffic.

The information source I have indicates it's one of the three airports Toshbaf has listed above..., However, it's not Chicago.

Given the early season irregularity of our internet here in Denali, I'll go ahead and provide a link to my source...

https://airlinegeeks.com/2015/08/09/...-of-marketing/

11. In 2002, this was the first U.S. airport to federalize its security force after the passage of the Aviation and Transportation Security Act. It is effectively known as the birthplace of the TSA. So then, which airport is it?

Per wrp96: Another wild stab SFO

Ah... it was not SFO. The answer to this one should be a lot clearer as to just one airport. Please guess again!
Seat 2A is offline  
Old May 15, 19, 9:34 am
  #15644  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Back home in the REAL Washington (SEA); still working occasionally in the other Washington (DCA area)
Programs: DL PM 1.3MM; AS MVPG 75K
Posts: 12,858
Smile PSA for all us old-timers

the long-awaited TWA Hotel opens today at JFK
strickerj likes this.
jrl767 is offline  
Old May 15, 19, 3:33 pm
  #15645  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Nov 1999
Programs: statusless these days
Posts: 19,320
Originally Posted by jlemon View Post
Well, speaking of DHC Beaver and Otter seaplanes specifically with regard to an airline up in your part of the world......

https://www.harbourair.com/harbour-a...ctric-airline/

If they can successfully make this work, I'll miss the sound of Harbour Air's piston and turboprop powered aircraft.....but this certainly sounds like a sign of the times.
I saw this a couple of months ago and wondered (still wonder) how it will work. I understand an electric motor can be quite a bit lighter than a piston engine but batteries are heavier than fuel. I guess someone has all the weights worked out.

p.s. still have no flown on any Beavers or Otters of any flavour.
strickerj likes this.
YVR Cockroach is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread